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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to wish someone would teach those bloody Masterchef presenters about the correct use of pronouns? (not in the least lighthearted)

147 replies

MardyBra · 04/04/2015 12:32

If John Torode says "I want to you cook something delicious for Greg and I" once more, I will fling a fucking fondant at the telly.

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ChopperGordino · 06/04/2015 14:45

X-post!

RunAwayHome · 06/04/2015 15:06

Yes Soup I didn't explain myself properly. So to my ears John and I sounds fine, and me and John sounds fine.

two different problems here. One of them is whether to use I/me, and the other is whether John should come first or second in the pairing.

The first one is, as everyone has explained, easily worked out by deciding which one you'd use alone. "I was cooking" - yes, so "John and I were cooking". (You do have to change the verb to match sing/plural, but that's irrelevant to working out whether it is I/me). "He cooked for me" - yes, so "He cooked for John and me". This is a grammatical issue, and one where there is a generally accepted right and wrong answer.

The second issue is which one comes first. This is not so much a grammar issue, as a stylistic one. It is not actually wrong to say "I and John were cooking" - it just sounds a bit odd. To make the sentence flow, or for the sake of politeness, it is more common to put the other person first, and "I" second. But sounding odd doesn't mean that "I and John" can't be used, though it would be more common if you were trying to emphasise the "I" (and likely would be puncutated with dashes or the like in the order to show that: "I - and John, of course - cooked this amazing meal for you")

The misuse of "myself" and "yourself" also bothers me, because I know the other person is trying hard to sound posh or educated, and yet is coming out as the opposite, and it makes me cringe for them because I know that I get embarrassed when I say a word wrong that other people know how to pronounce or use an expression incorrectly, and I think that they will be just as embarrassed if they find that they've been doing this. I'm not sure that actually happens though!

The most common use of "myself" is just to emphasise that it's you that are the subject or object of the action - "I made it myself" or "I hurt myself"; it doesn't really indicate formality or politeness (don't need "my husband and myself" or "please return the form to ourselves", etc). I know that some people have been told not to use "me" (because they should be using "I", as in the "John and me are cooking tonight" examples), but then they hypercorrect this either to using "I" all the time, even when wrong ("He cooked for John and I") or to using "myself" all the time, even when wrong ("John and myself were cooking" or "He cooked for John and myself").

Dumdedumdedum · 07/04/2015 19:15

Does anyone know if John Torode himself still owns and runs a restaurant in London? Or anywhere, really? If so, has anyone been and was it any good?

BIWI · 08/04/2015 09:14

I don't think he does any more. We went to Smiths of Smithfield once, a few years ago now, and it was not very good. We were really disappointed.

MardyBra · 08/04/2015 13:17

Re - pronouncing food, they don't annoy me as much as Delia with her BAAYchamel sauces and her WHO MOUSSE.

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MardyBra · 08/04/2015 13:20

Who mousse clip

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MardyBra · 08/04/2015 13:22

One of them gets (Greg I think), always pronounces chorizo wrong though.

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SummerHouse · 08/04/2015 13:57

Mardybra you have caused myself to have to explain to my children what is so funny with regards to your example of "Greg and I" Grin

SummerHouse · 08/04/2015 14:00

Has anyone mentioned Greg's rather bizarre eating technique?

Hold spoon in fist, keep spoon in mouth for inordinate ammont of time, reluctantly slowly slide spoon out. Both my children grew out of this by 2 years of age!

MardyBra · 11/04/2015 01:15

I suddenly remembered Jamie and his odd Gazpachio pronunciation earlier.

[random]

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BertieBotts · 11/04/2015 01:26

RunAwayHome is spot on.

I remember always being told not to say "X and me" at school but it was never explained why. One day when I was 15 we were staying with my Grandma and I said to her "Me and Lauren are going to the beach," she tutted and said "Don't they teach you anything at school? You wouldn't say Me is going to the beach, would you?"

Eleven years of school and they hadn't managed to explain that to me, but my Grandma got it in one sentence Grin

Neilnancy · 05/03/2020 21:35

It drives me nuts. I want to ask him what would he say if Greg wasn't there? Would he say "I want you to cook something for I?" Why doesn't someone tell him???

leghairdontcare · 05/03/2020 21:37

2015 thanks you for your contribution @Neilnancy

MitziK · 05/03/2020 21:40

They pay the bloke bazillions to lecture Indian Housewives on how to be authentic, tell Chinese people that their food isn't really Chinese enough and African/Caribbean people that their food isn't African/Caribbean enough/is too unsophisticated. whilst putting a posh white boy and the invariably big eyed girl through for their version of Potato Three Ways and a Jus

Butchering the English Language is the least of Torode's offences.

Neilnancy · 05/03/2020 21:42

It's where the verb is. It's I before the verb and me after. ie John and I love the cinema. The cinema is a favourite of john and me ...... or John and I have requested a tee off time at the golf. The tee off time was given to John and me

Neilnancy · 05/03/2020 21:44

Either way he just always sounds so wrong

Ravenfeet · 05/03/2020 21:52

YANBU.

But I also think it's ridiculous to pretend that language is in any way logical.

Logically it's bloody stupid to say "It is me" instead of "It is I" but I doubt many posters here would be caught saying the latter.

Ravenfeet · 05/03/2020 22:03

And I reckon "Me and John cooked a battered sausage" is fine. Sounds natural to me.

I don't know why, but using "and I" in the object position sounds worse because it's like you're trying to be clever but you've actually got the 'rule' arse backwards.

But all native English speakers use pronouns in the object case as subjects. Some are just pickier about when they do it.

Samtsirch · 05/03/2020 22:12

I have always found grammatical errors jarring in the written form but have come to accept that conversational language far more relaxed .

Samtsirch · 05/03/2020 22:13

😂

Confusedasusual78 · 05/03/2020 22:24

😂This thread.

So would you say..This weekend my mum and I..? I would 🤷‍♀️Is that wrong?

Itstheprinciple · 05/03/2020 22:53

That's right.

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