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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to be mortified by 4 year old sons behaviour :-(

63 replies

Lottie10000 · 30/03/2015 08:58

Cut a long story short my son is 4 1/2 and has always been " boisterous "
We've gone through stages of pure aggression directed mainly at other children in parks / soft play places although occasionally also to me and his dad.
We have used all sorts of methods from positive parenting to time out to removing toys to taking straight home, the other discipline method we've never used is smacking as we don't want to plus we have really tried to enforce that hitting is wrong in any sense so would hate to be a hypocrite.
More recently it hasn't been unprovoked attacks as such, more if a kid hits him he is unable to walk away and tell me etc, or if a child says something nasty he lashes out.
Never does it at pre school, I've even asked him why not and he replies " the teacher would tell me off " so he does know right / wrong although I have no idea why that's enough to deter him yet I'm not.
I'm not a softy parent who sees no wrong in her own children and unlike some other friends I have I don't buy into " boys will be boys " and all this nonsense, I watch my children and correct them when they need it.
Yesterday we had been to a farm in the morning, he had made friends to play with there and had a lovely time and later in the afternoon we had met my mum for lunch and soft play.
All going well until I saw my son ( he didn't think I could see as the frame is large ) punching this kid ( same sort of age ) over and over again. By the time I climbed the frame he must have hit him 6/7 times. The child wasn't crying and was attempting to hit back but what made me really upset but as I was running over I could see the kid trying to stand up and just as he did my son knocked him down again.
I felt sick, my son is 4 1/2, just a child but it was awful to watch.
I found the parent and apologised, she was very much like " boys will be boys I'm surprised mine didn't whack him back " and we immediately left which I hate doing as my 3 year old who rarely does anything wrong then also has to be dragged out of places but I felt it was the only option.
He has lost the new football kit an boots for practice he had today and he isn't going, he's been told he can go next week if he behaves this week.
He's been on the recieving end more than once being punched in the face by older bigger kids whilst he cried trying to protect his face :( and I've been the mother shouting for the mother of this uncontrollable child attacking mine, so why he thinks it's okay is beyond me.
Maybe he's seen it too much in these places but at 4 1/2 I thought he would know better by now.
Has anyone else dealt with this?

OP posts:

kinkyfuckery · 30/03/2015 09:02

Have you asked school what their discipline technique is for bad behaviour (chart,removal etc) and thought about attempting the same at home?

ssd · 30/03/2015 09:02

he is only young, just keep trying to get your message across about how this is unacceptable, am sure he'll pick it up soon enough, hes already learnt at nursery.

StillStayingClassySanDiego · 30/03/2015 09:03

Have you spoken to his teacher and asked for advice?

I'm a TA in a reception class and would be very concerned at his behaviour.

Why has he been punched in the face by bigger , older children?

19lottie82 · 30/03/2015 09:07

ssd - he's old enough to understand that you shouldn't hit people and this behaviour is wrong.

ssd · 30/03/2015 09:09

yes and thats what his parent is telling him but at 4 and a half it doesnt always sink in

ThinkIveBeenHacked · 30/03/2015 09:12

OP could you try making him sit out while your 3yo still plays? He can see exactly what he missing as a consequence of his own actions and the 3yo can still enjoy the activity.

duplodon · 30/03/2015 09:17

Just keep doing what you're doing. Try not to turn it into something it's not, he is young, this will change. A lot of kids do this, the important thing is consistent, calm responses over and over. Think of them like little animals needing to learn social boundaries. Repeated enforcement will get the message across

kewtogetin · 30/03/2015 09:19

I think that sounds like one heck of a busy day for a four year old. Farm, then lunch, then soft play? He sounds like he was over stimulated and overtired. That's a long time for a child to be on their best behaviour, to have to follow the rules. I often notice a difference in my sons behaviour after school towards the end of term, he Is mentally drained from being 'good' all day and knows he can act out at home because it's 'safe' and we will love him anyway, although I should point out he has never hit me or his father/siblings.
He sounds like he needs some downtime, some time to relax and do things he wants to do, at his own pace.
And YABU for expecting a four year old to be responsibke for football kit/boots. That's your job.

toddlewaddleflipflop · 30/03/2015 09:24

I agree, don't panic just keep reinforcing your message as you are doing. I wouldn't keep him away from football or other positive physical activity, though. Sounds like he may benefit from even more structured physical stuff if you can manage it. I read about boys having a hormone surge at 4 and needing to let off lots of steam, and it sounds like he responds well to structured settings like nursery.

Shakirasma · 30/03/2015 09:24

I think the OP means she's taken his brand new kit off him as a consequence of today's behaviour.

OP, zero tolerance of aggressive behaviour, clear, consistent consequences. Lots of talk about how he can better deal with his frustrations.

He will get there, don't loose heart.

kewtogetin · 30/03/2015 09:26

Ah I see shakira, my mistake.

comedancing · 30/03/2015 09:28

He will grow out of this. Agree with suggestion that he sits out and watches others play as consequences need to be immediate and then forgotten about. So l think you taking his football stuff away is not good as it's not related to the offence..it's to removed to have affect and it could lead to a build up of frustration resulting in a few more punches for someone else. So quick relevant consequence then leave it. Plenty of rest quiet play good snacks and don't drag it on.

ImpishElf · 30/03/2015 09:33

Agree with kewtogetin. The PE kit punishment sounds harsh, whichever adult picked him up was responsible for making sure it was with him. Often children are like adults and need unstructured relaxing time to just potter around at home, especially after a trip. Was he punched at school? I do get surprised to hear how much pushing/shoving/hitting goes on at school - tends to be the boys - but they are not always "violent", just seem to have off days. It is good that you are handling this now instead of leaving it for too long so that it seems like acceptable behaviour .

wheresthelight · 30/03/2015 09:33

I agree making him miss out and watch his sibling play will probably have a bigger effect.

my now 11 yo dss went through a stage about 2.5 years ago if being incredibly naughty and nasty and the only thing that made him take notice was watching his sister do things while he sat out and watched. we have had to do this with dsd too and to their credit it worked but they were a lot older.

it does sound like you are doing everything right though and he clearly does know right from wrong as he doesn't do it at school.

InaPuddle · 30/03/2015 09:48

I suspect as the day goes on it may be harder to 'behave'. DS might need wind down time built in to a day - 'free time' where he can simply play quietly alone (or what ever he likes to do alone) be read to etc. Time where there is minimal reference to rules, minimal need for correction of behaviour, minimal opportunity for him to 'get it wrong' really etc. You may all feel better for building this into your day :)

For us to wind down with my DS who is the same age, if we have a bad day I engineer letting him potter in the garden with a watering can, wellies etc. or we make home made play dough together with lots of weighing ingredients, mixing with a big spoon and plenty of strees free mess, adding colours, glitter, rolling pin, sprinkling flour, driving veichles through to just see what happens, minimal structure, maybe some quite music in the background.

Should anyone be a fly on the wall in these moments it will look like bliss and little would they know how high my blood pressure had been threatening to go before the activity started!

popalot · 30/03/2015 09:49

He might be finding the whole softplay situation too much to handle after being punched in the face himselfe and freaking out, so he's getting his punches in before he gets punched. An episode of being punched in the face by older kids must have been really frightening and that one incident might have triggered this defensive/aggressive behaviour. Just stay away from softplay until he gets over it. Imagine if you'd been attacked in a place full of people running and shouting, you'd be on edge every time you went there.

ragged · 30/03/2015 10:12

Do you know what triggers your son to start hitting? Finding the triggers might be key.

BullshitS70 · 30/03/2015 10:25

I agree, its too busy for a 4 year old. He needs some down time, playing in your garden, or inside with his toys, DVD time, reading time, anything really that doesn't stimulate him.

I too think that's the reason for his behaviour at the soft play

I always timetable an activity out of the house like a bike ride round the park in the morning, home for lunch or packed lunch, then an activity at home for the afternoon, like helping me plants flowers in the garden or painting

And if they are really tired - like today - we have a lazy day mainly at home doing gentle stuff like cooking

If we don't do it like this, the kids get over stimulated, rude, arguing etc

ChipDip · 30/03/2015 10:35

I disagree that because he had a full day this could be a reason , many children can manage just fine without resorting to violence. It must have been awful to watch a child being repeatedly hit. Awful. He needs to be learning consequences as he is clearly picking situations when he behaves like this, as he is not doing this at nursery.

formerbabe · 30/03/2015 10:36

unlike some other friends I have I don't buy into " boys will be boys " and all this nonsense

I agree it should not be an excuse for bad behaviour, but I do believe boys can have a lot of energy and aggression that needs to be channelled effectively. My own ds does martial arts. It is brilliant for him as it allows him to use his energy in a safe and positive way and has also helped him with keeping him disciplined.

CoolCadbury · 30/03/2015 10:46

Another one here who thinks that he may have been over stimulated by his busy day. Chipdip some children can cope with a busy day, others can't. Maybe OP's child is in the can't category.

BTW OP, I think you are doing ok - some children do behave very differently in school than with their families. Why don't you keep a diary of his behaviour and when it occurs to see if you can find his trigger points or patterns?

TwartFaceBeetj · 30/03/2015 10:48

I think it could be a combination of things,

To much in one day, being on the receiving end of violence, and maybe in some circumstances seeing the perpetrator get away with it?

If it doesn't happen at preschool because 'its not allowed ' this might be more the fact he feels safe there because he knows that nobody 'gets away with it'
I agree with pp poster soft play is a free for all.
My Ds1 had the same issues with it, he once ended up with a black eye, the mum didn't see it (too busy chatting) and got stroppy with me when I approached her about her son. Luckily the manager was writing it in the accident book and over heard her, and asked her to leave.

Sounds like he needs some chill out time during the day, and smaller calmer places to play.

FriendlyLadybird · 30/03/2015 10:49

I think soft play is rather a difficult environment. It's designed for children to be boisterous and many can be/seem really quite uncontrolled jumping into ball pits, running about, pushing ahead of others. It's not the place for calm negotiation over turn-taking. I've seen loads of children hitting and pushing it seems almost the accepted behaviour.

I've always thought those places were the seventh circle of hell anyway. If I were you I'd steer clear of them until you were confident he was in better control of himself.

I agree with pp that taking him out and making him sit quietly while his brother continued to play would have been an appropriate 'punishment'.

duplodon · 30/03/2015 10:50

I have to agree. I didn't before I had three boys but their energy is beyond my ability to contain without regular time spent outside and lots of directed physical activity. I have to balance sitting type activities and physical ones and ensure they have down time too...and there does seem to be more aggression than I ever expected given that it's never been modelled, even the one year old.I don't see this in my nieces. We do not allow it, but it does need active management.

BlackeyedSusan · 30/03/2015 10:50

I think you probably did too much in one day. children struggle to behave when they are tired, hungry and over stimulated. did he behave well in the morning?

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