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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think that it's unacceptable to frighten someone's DC even if you think they're a nasty bigot?

295 replies

OTheHugeManatee · 23/03/2015 12:20

I just saw this story about protesters forcing Nigel Farage and his family out of a pub where they were having lunch.

I don't really like Farage's politics. But I support his democratic right to hold those views. AIBU to think hounding him and frightening his DC during a family lunch is unacceptable, illiberal and frankly nasty, whatever you think of the things he says?

OP posts:

SunnyBaudelaire · 25/03/2015 11:49

but sitting in a 'Public House' is not 'private' is it?

SirChenjin · 25/03/2015 11:51

Of course it's private. It's patently obvious to anyone with half an ounce of sense that someone in the public domain eating lunch with his family is not 'on duty'.

Original poster

OTheHugeManatee · 25/03/2015 11:51

As a footnote, I don't think it's very likely that we're going to end up with a wide acceptance of thought crime as being a thing in this country. (I refer to Soviet Russia and medieval Catholicism simply to illustrate what happens when people get really, really serious about thought crime.) It's still my expectation that old-fashioned British contrarianism will prevail and we'll be able to continue with political diversity as well as the Guardian approved race, gender, sexuality etc versions. I just think we should be questioning the way social liberalism seems to have developed a Jacobin streak as I don't think it really advances the cause of tolerance.

OP posts:

Hullygully · 25/03/2015 11:53

Manatee, surely surely surely for the love of the sweet baby jesus you can see that Farage's OPINIONS are not just that - he acts on them, and gets others too.

SunnyBaudelaire · 25/03/2015 11:54

"Of course it's private. It's patently obvious to anyone with half an ounce of sense that someone in the public domain eating lunch with his family is not 'on duty'."
no , a Public House is not 'private'. The clue is in the name.
And he was probably intending to use eating out with his family as a photo opportunity, lets be honest. Fair game really.

Hakluyt · 25/03/2015 11:56

It's a bit disingenuous to say that a pub lunch that the press had been made aware of in advance is "private time"..............

DodgedAnAsbo · 25/03/2015 11:57

just because you don't like someones opinions, doesn't mean you can vent your hatred on their family

Original poster

OTheHugeManatee · 25/03/2015 11:57

I would add that one person's view of what constitutes a bad opinion is very different from anothers , and if we take the approach that everyone (and their family) in the public domain is fair game then we have to be clear on where that stops - does it mean that a large crowd who disagree with a decision can ambush a planning officer on a family lunch, for example, or the Chief Exec of the local NHS? I'd be very concerned that this lack of respect for 'off' time would put people off from taking up roles in the public domain.

This is precisely my point. I think the people who are doing this have been blinded by their outrage at the views for which Farage is a figurehead, to the extent that they aren't thinking through the implications of their behaviour. The logical consequence of eliding the distinction between private and public life in this way, and justifying the punishment of individuals for holding 'bad opinions' (and who gets to determine what is a bad opinion?) is nothing less than nasty, knee-jerk mob rule.

Given the protesters are campaigning against populism (of a type that's not to their taste) you'd think they would want to step back from behaviour that creates the conditions for populism to flourish.

OP posts:

SirChenjin · 25/03/2015 11:58

Nope. Whether it's a pub, restaurant or picnic in a park, it's not appropriate behaviour to intrude on a family in that way - regardless of whether you agree with the opinions of one member of that family or not.

Hakluyt · 25/03/2015 11:59

The press knew about this private family lunch.

Original poster

OTheHugeManatee · 25/03/2015 11:59

Manatee, surely surely surely for the love of the sweet baby jesus you can see that Farage's OPINIONS are not just that - he acts on them, and gets others too.

Yes, but what exactly has he done wrong? If he has committed an offence then seek remedy within the bounds of the law.

If no such remedy is available you not protesting against bad behaviour. You are protesting against bad opinions.

OP posts:

OrlandoWoolf · 25/03/2015 12:00

Manatee, surely surely surely for the love of the sweet baby jesus you can see that Farage's OPINIONS are not just that - he acts on them, and gets others too

Completely irrelevant to the debate.

Would people think it was OK if they were in a pub with Cameron and it was invaded by such people? Cameron has done real damage to many people in this country. I don't think I've seen any group target him when he goes about his family life.

Tony Blair - I bet he goes out for meals without people invading his space like this.

Original poster

OTheHugeManatee · 25/03/2015 12:01

And in case I haven't made it clear enough, that's bad opinions as determined by the protesters and people who share their views, not by some objective arbiter. Quis custodiet ipsos custodes and all that

OP posts:

SunnyBaudelaire · 25/03/2015 12:02

"Tony Blair - I bet he goes out for meals without people invading his space like this."
I bet he does not, not without bodyguards anyway.

OrlandoWoolf · 25/03/2015 12:05

It would not be right if a group of protestors targetted Blair if he was out having a meal. Or Cameron. Or anyone really.

Time and a place.

ComposHatComesBack · 25/03/2015 12:05

It's a bit disingenuous to say that a pub lunch that the press had been made aware of in advance is "private time"..............

So it was a publicity stunt designed to get attention, probably to garnish his 'man of the people/family man' image. Therefore you can't complain when you get attention, but not the type you like.

SunnyBaudelaire · 25/03/2015 12:08

exactly he was using his family to project an image.

they should be protected, yes but from him.

ComposHatComesBack · 25/03/2015 12:14

If the children were distressed by the incident (and I'm amazed that a 15 year old would be distressed by a conga line in fancy dress, mortified that my dad was such a a tit that he was attracting all this attention yes) then the fault lies Farage and Frau Farage for involving their children in electioneering.

Hullygully · 25/03/2015 12:15

Manatee, surely surely surely for the love of the sweet baby jesus you can see that Farage's OPINIONS are not just that - he acts on them, and gets others too.

Yes, but what exactly has he done wrong? If he has committed an offence then seek remedy within the bounds of the law.

If no such remedy is available you not protesting against bad behaviour. You are protesting against bad opinions.

No, you are protesting against opinion inciting bad behaviour. The word INCITING is key. Because he INCITES people to act on his opinions. And meanwhile? While the law grinds along so very very slowly?

Because the law works, doesn't it? I think you'll find history shows us otherwise.

Direct action is the thing.

JanineStHubbins · 25/03/2015 12:15

Wasn't Tony Blair subject to a citizen's arrest while out having a meal some time back?

Hullygully · 25/03/2015 12:16

Don't know if it was a meal, but yes.

SirChenjin · 25/03/2015 12:34

To be fair, TB does have the blood of many people on his hands...

Farage doesn't 'incite' anyone to act anymore than any other politician does. Unless you believe that all politicians and public officials incite - but even then, they have off time which should be respected.

Hullygully · 25/03/2015 12:57

You don't get "off" time when "on" time is about encouraging people to treat others badly.

DodgedAnAsbo · 25/03/2015 13:07

You are wrong hullygully. use the ballot box, it's there for a reason. Leave the kids alone

Hakluyt · 25/03/2015 13:12

The press knew in advance about this price family lunch.

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