AIBU to object to a customer referring to one of my team as "the bird behind the counter"?

[soundsystem]

And WIBU to say something about it?

I work in food retail and got an email from a customer with a suggestion (actually quite a good suggestion). He said he'd "told the bird behind the counter" but she didn't seem interested. To be honest, I suspect his attitude in "telling" her probably contributed to this - she's normally quite receptive to ideas and generally a smiley, polite person.

Burke, I thought it was pretty fucking obvious I knew what a clan/guild was. You don't need to educate me.

SmillasSenseOfSnow you got it a bit wrong, saying it was just a group chat within a game, whereas it's actually more of a fully fledged community, we have our own website, forums, servers etc. It's more close knit than just a shared "chat channel" in a game, and that's why we're more comfortable chilling out and taking the mickey of each other from time to time.

So you're not actually saying the words to people face-to-face?

People often use language they wouldn't dream of saying face to face (because it's offensive) online.

And your point about intent is wrong. The test here is if someone took offense. Not if you meant to be rude.

Oh I'm surprised at how many find 'bird' offensive. Although perhaps it depends on the context. I wouldn't have used it in a letter like that guy did.

Burke, I was trying to make it simple and cover most clans/guilds for the sake of the vast majority of people here. I didn't 'get it a bit wrong'. Stop fucking mansplaining as if no woman on Mumsnet could possibly know anything about this, I've seen multiple besides me who do...

SmillasSenseOfSnow You DID get it wrong, do not try to slither your way out of it or backtrack. I don't think it was intentional, but your explanation was misleading people. I wouldn't have highlighted the mistake if it wasn't relevant, but it is. If it's just a shared instant messaging channel in a game, you wouldn't really make close friends. Our clan is actually a mini "community" on the internet, we have a busy website, a forum, server competitions, sometimes people meet up with each other if they live close. So when specific words are used in a playful way, you have to realize it's between close friends who have been gaming together for (in some cases) 3-4 years. And we don't use those words on people we aren't sure will be ok with it, and we definitely don't use it outwith the server. We also have a strict no racism/disrespect policy, and I've banned people in the past for breaking that rule. Our rules recognize a difference between playful remarks between friends, and cases where there is genuine intent to cause offence. We rarely get racists but when we do they are banned very quickly once they are reported.

ifyourehoppyandyouknowit some do meet face to face at times and use the same words, not me because I live in a different country than the majority of players so it's not practical. Your test is pretty much what we apply in-game - I can call you any name I want as long as you are happy with it. We do take genuine disrespect seriously, and our rules say that any namecalling has to stop if the person being called the name isn't ok with it.

You have got to be fucking kidding me, Burke, how many times do I have to make this clear - I was giving a definition that fits across games and clans/guilds. I was not trying to give an exhaustive list of the activities of your particular clan (give I don't even know which fucking game you're talking about) - I didn't just call it a group chat, I said that you choose to make teams with people from said chat because you know them better than random players.

I couldn't have made it any more blindingly obvious that I have personally been members of guilds in games and therefore know what I'm talking about. You say that you haven't met people IRL from your clan - well I beat you there by a large margin, and the fact that we weren't from the same countries (or necessarily even in the same countries before the meet) was no obstacle.

Stop the mansplaining, you're making yourself look incredibly dim.

Maybe if you stopped womansplaining Smillas we could reach some sort of a deal on that. You made a mistake, you were corrected and now you have learned something for the future. I'm not spending any more time on this, we're moving on.

Hopefully from the example I've given people can understand why I prefer to judge the intent behind the use of a word rather than the word itself. True, it might be correct that most of society thinks "X is a bad word" but what if two long term friends playfully refer to each other as X and neither takes it in a bad way? It's largely about intent, although as with our server rules, we do also take into account the feelings of the person who has been called the name. If they aren't happy with that name, the person has to stop or they will be banned. And I have banned people in the past because they were being disrespectful and refused to stop when I asked them to, so we do take that kind of thing very seriously.

Curious as to how Burke finds so much time for racist gaming, and defending racist / sexist language on so many MN threads (usually on the fucking bullshit grounds that if it doesn't offend him then it mustn't be offensive).

Odd.

But Burke - the people to whom you have used that term are not in your "clan" and it is not used here playfully/ironically or otherwise - intent is one thing, a time a place and context are another - whatever your intention this is the wrong place as the audience are not part of your "clan" and out with your "clan" it is not acceptable. Being able to adapt your language to your audience is important and none of your audience here is in (nor wants to be in in many cases) whatever this "clan" thing is.

'Bird' is unacceptable in a professional exchange. The customer was deliberately condescending implying that the person in question was if lesser value to him. I'd ask her what exactly he said to her.

I hope Burke is not Tom Burke I would go right off him

Ps "bird" is also unacceptable when the audience is in a professional capacity - I agree take it up with whomever you liaise with within the "main" company as such disregard for your staff is not tolerable from a company to whom you provide service to.

maddening the only people I have used the N word to ARE people in that clan, and even then only the people that I've known for years and built close friendships with and who I'm 100% sure will NOT be offended by it. I wouldn't dream of using that word towards anyone else, and I've actually banned people in the past for using similar words when there is disrespect/offence intended. We're very strict on that.

DrinkFeckArseGirls not sure who Tom Burke is but he's not me.

OP, I've not read the whole thread, but to revert to your original question since we all seem to have gone off at a tangent, no, it would not be unreasonable to say something about his use of language.

There are some men who may still regard the word as a perfectly acceptable term for a woman - and a young women in particular - for who, I believe some allowance might be made. However, none of these men are under age 85.

Nothing to say on the clan or guild comment as i'm not apart of it,
However coming from a hospitality and retail background i think it would be unprofessional to say anything to the customer.
He wasn't abusive.
Not all blokes use the word bird in a derogatory way.
Not all women are against the word bird, chick duck etc
Some of my friends call each other chick and
Iv had little old ladies call me and my colleagues duck.
Obversiously every company is different but we would never say anything unless a customer were abusive or racist.
Glad i'v read this thread, learnt all about guild and clan!

I also don't consider "bird" to be offensive or sexist. I'd think it was just him using a colloquialism, the equivalent of chap or bloke.

If you do actually try and school him on it I suspect you might sound a little ridiculous, just as the many bemusing responses to this thread do.

Whatever is okay or not okay in whatever online communities random posters here like to frequent - that's not what the OP was posting about.

In a context of a professional work environment, not between friends, with no "in jokes" or established slang, the customer was unprofessional and rude.

I don't think there's much you can do though, OP - in response to a written comment. I might have a word in person though.