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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that "middle class" has become a derogatory term

285 replies

hijk · 16/02/2015 12:57

and actually, most people aren't actually part of any class, really, they are just individuals who make their own way in the world.

OP posts:
Fuckup · 16/02/2015 13:00

we definitely live in classed society with the gap between the richest and the poorest ever increasing. Whether or not middle class is an insult or not depends entirely on context but I wouldn't have thought it was by itself.

Original poster
hijk · 16/02/2015 13:02

would you not just say we live in a society with a range of levels of wealth. i don't really think class comes into it, your level of wealth can change a lot in your life time.

OP posts:
123upthere · 16/02/2015 13:06

I don't think middle class necessarily means wealth, rather there is a perception of its members being cultured, well educated and perhaps more aware of social etiquette than other classes!

123upthere · 16/02/2015 13:08

You often get wealthy without manners/knowledge of world affairs literature etc and you often get those without wealth but who have had a cultured life

Perhaps

Original poster
hijk · 16/02/2015 13:09

I don't think the term "middle class" when used on mumsnet means well educated and good mannered!

OP posts:
StillStayingClassySanDiego · 16/02/2015 13:11

I don't think the term "middle class" when used on mumsnet means well educated and good mannered!

What do you think it means?

Original poster
hijk · 16/02/2015 13:11

I think it is usually derogatory.

OP posts:
StillStayingClassySanDiego · 16/02/2015 13:13

Can you expand on that?

SunnyBaudelaire · 16/02/2015 13:16

when I have heard 'middle class' used as an insult, it does not mean well educated and good mannered it has usually meant kind of uptight, narrow minded, sheltered from real life, that kind of thing. I have been hearing it for years, usually from working class hero types, who when you scratch the surface are as 'middle class' as anyone.
I will never forget my first bf whose parents house was much bigger than my mum's place, yet all he went on about was 'middle class' this 'middle class' that.

Original poster
hijk · 17/02/2015 12:14

currently in AIBU

To ask how many of you use your local/nearest school? (31 Posts)
Add message | Report | Message poster monkeymamma Tue 17-Feb-15 11:31:39
When we moved to our current house I was pregnant with dc1. I noticed there was a newish, nice looking school here and thought 'ah good, that's where the baby will go to school when the time comes.' Ds is now 3 and all anyone seems to talk about is the school question. Many people seem keen to avoid the local school (it Required Improvement at last offsted, has a new head, and a large intake from both social housing and local traveller community). Everyone wants to send their dc to an alternative school but the others round here are 'good'/'requires improvement' apart from one small village school (v.v small, middle class intake, not what I have in mind for my dc - I feel like they'll learn more about life in a more diverse environment) which is outstanding. No one ever gets their child in there anyway from where we live (ie nowhere near said village).
Anyway sorry to go off on detailed tangent - my thought ws that it seems the 'normal' thing to do to try to shop around rather than using the school nearest to you. Is that your experience also? Or did anyone find this whole business more straightforward?

OP posts:
Heels99 · 17/02/2015 12:18

No but I think working class has. Nobody on mn is ever working class...

Original poster
hijk · 17/02/2015 12:23

But who are these working class and middle class people anyway? i don't think most people are anything.

OP posts:
Nomama · 17/02/2015 12:24

Nobody on mn is ever working class...

For some of us that is only because we are not allowed to be Smile

We both did as we were told, strived to 'better ourselves'. Parents and grandparents before them insisted that this was part of our job... so we did. We strove to be better educated, to have more job opportunities than our working class backgrounds would have given us access to. We were successful working class kids.

Then we woke up and realised that the world (OK, the DM) no longer allowed us to be working class! So now I live a mixed up,scary life, wherein I think, vote, believe that I am working class, but society demands that I accept that this is a lie and that I simply must change, eat naice ham, etc. I am Middle Class, DAMMIT!

Heels99 · 17/02/2015 12:27

No mama why do you say you are middle class? How do you define that?

Jackieharris · 17/02/2015 12:27

Now that you mention it I probably do use the term 'middle class' as a derogatory term sometimes when I'm talking about inequalities/politics/the lack of social mobility/ the generation gap etc.

There are are group of people now, who I used to identify with, who I see as a barrier to creating the type of society I want my dc's to grow up in.

The type of comfortable suburban dwellers, often baby boomers, who have an 'I'm alright jack' attitude to others in society.

SunnyBaudelaire · 17/02/2015 12:27

it has all changed now anyway....the 'working class' eg builders, electricians, etc have far more earning power than the 'middle class', so become more middle class than the middle class.....so things have been turned on their head a bit.

Original poster
hijk · 17/02/2015 12:28

well, I get that all graduates are "middleclass" by definition, but why is this used as an insult?

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 17/02/2015 12:30

I agree. Along with Reading the Daily Mail and holidaying in the Canaray Islands. I knew some socialist left wing types who looked down their noses at people and they were more middle class snobs and than anyone but they were signed up to the Labour party and committed to socialism. Moved to good area for the best schools and all the usual stuff. Looked down on private companies and all the rest of it. They fitted nicely into a stereotype as much as any DM reader.

Heels99 · 17/02/2015 12:30

No, all graduates are not middle class by definition. Graduates can come from any class and having a degree doesn't make you middle class.

Heels99 · 17/02/2015 12:32

I don't think builders and electricians have more earning power than middle classes. A builder doesn't earn more than a doctor usually unless the Dr is just starting out and the builder is at a different career stage

noddyholder · 17/02/2015 12:33

All the builders I know do!

StillStayingClassySanDiego · 17/02/2015 12:33

We're working class and proud of it.

SunnyBaudelaire · 17/02/2015 12:33

of course they do heels, the builders I know are loaded.

Original poster
hijk · 17/02/2015 12:34

graduates can come from any class, but being a graduate turns you into middle class, but then I'm not sure what happens then, do you stay middle class forever, no matter what?

the ONLY clear criteria for being middle class is being a graduate, but that is why I can't understand why it is an insult.

And I don't think graduating at 21 means you still belong to a specific class at 40, does it?

I'm not any class, I am a graduate though, so by that criteria, middle class, although I don't think it defines me absolutly for ever, and I'm not insulted to be a graduate

People move between jobs and professions, and income levels go up and down, and I don't think "middleclass" means a lot, but still don't understand why it is an insult!

OP posts:
Heels99 · 17/02/2015 12:35

But you don't know what they earn or whether they earn more than a middle class profession do you? You are making an assumption because they flash their cash around. See harry Enfield loadsamoney as example.

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