To think this is crazy <DV Trigger>

[RandomNPC]

What the hell is happening here?
www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mum-who-throat-cut-brutal-5164409

Icimoi, obviously we are reading a very condensed version of the situation, nevertheless, this is happening for this poor woman or she would not feel she had to go to the press. This does happen unfortunately, someone I know is going through similar, but because the man has not abused her he is allowed unsupervised contact with ds. But now he has started to abuse ds emotionally and sexually, ds is now able to speak out and SS are involved, and contact suspended whilst tgey investigate.

Icinoi.

It is an offence to publish a family court order without consent from the court

Her injuries speak volumes, I have no doubt she is telling the truth.

Aeroflot, sorry, but you really are very naive if you believe that everyone who goes to the press is automatically telling the truth just because they've gone to the press. Have a look at that story about the couple supposedly living in an airport, for instance - they presumably "felt they had to go to the press" but the story falls apart on the slightest examination.

Needs, if this woman isn't allowed to publish the family court order, even with personal details taken out, then she isn't allowed to publish any of this. Since she has, you would think she might want to produce the evidence.

I'm not saying this is necessarily untrue, I'm just saying you really need to be cautious about it. Especially given that reference to negotiation.

Icimoi tgat is insulting to that poor woman. She did not get her injuries from nowhere! He is in jail, for causing her injuries.

I would write the bare minimum.

To cunt

Child 1 has completed first term at school and says their favourite lesson is music. He/she had a cold last month but is well now. He/she has a number of friends and is going to a birthday party next week.

Ditto child 2. Favourite lesson is PE/very well and did not get child 1's cold/also popular and going to birthday party.

Fuck you

Enc. 2 photos of children (in masks)

Aeroflot, I don't doubt in the least that she received the injuries. But that is now what this report is about, is it?

To think she is lying or fabricating is awful, yes it does happen, the system is not as impartial as you think. If tgat had happened to me, I would be shouting from the rooftops to make sure I get heard.

I know courts generally take the view that as long as the dv perpretrator hasn't abused the children then they have a right to some involvement in the children's lives. I generally struggle to see how dv cannot have affected the children psychologically even if they were not themselves targeted

Whilst I totally agree with the sentiment of this thread I can't agree with this comment.

The courts are very aware that witnessing DA is in itself child abuse and in my experience that yes whilst shocking situations like this do happen they do usually take it seriously.

I see far to many threads on here talking about DA and how it apparently does not matter when it comes to contact but my experience is totally different I have so many clients with no direct contact orders or no direct or indirect orders that I can't even give an approx number. At any given time I could have more without contact than with.

Problems tend to arise when the seriousness of the abuse is not agreed on by the court those are the ones who tend to end up with the short term contact centre then normal unsupervised contact.very sadly its something that does happen when you spend a lot of time seeing evidence of very serious violence you tend to think (wrongly) that the ones who are careful with how they mark the victim or are throat grabbers are not as bad as a beat with a weapon one. And as the mums netter often referred to has shamefully had to discover we still have a very very long way to go with family court and partner rape.(and every court and 99% of rapes)

Look Aeroflot, you aren't reading my posts. I have expressly not said she is lying. But the fact that you are failing to understand a relatively short post speaks volumes for the attention you are able to devote to the story itself.

It is about a man who nearly killed her and left children motherless, who wants access to information about his chikdren. The mother is forced by the courts to comply, if she does not, she risks jail. Which is totally unacceptable. In addition, the criminal has been given legal aid to fight this, and the victim has to fund it herself. Totally unacceptable.

First rule of newspaper sadface stories. Don't take them as gospel.

I understand that icimoi, but in this case I am pretty certain the woman is not lying.

If I had those horrific injuries I woukdent exactly be happy either!

Needs, if this woman isn't allowed to publish the family court order, even with personal details taken out, then she isn't allowed to publish any of this. Since she has, you would think she might want to produce the evidence

I'm not saying this is necessarily untrue, I'm just saying you really need to be cautious about it. Especially given that reference to negotiation

She hasn't published it has she,the newspaper have, I would be surprised if she has not given them a copy of the order and the decision not to publish it was made by the paper.

Negotiate is a very strange word it could mean something as simple as "we both agree to do this" or as troubling as " if you agree to this I will drop my highly likely to be successful application to force you to bring them to visit me in prison"

If I read the figure correctly and she's only had 3k worth of legal support I would guess that she's been fairly unsupported legally as I would expect something like this to cost significantly more. Or that she's still suffering from the impact of the abuse and easier to manipulate or scare or possibly that she's spent a fair bit of time listening to people blather on about how DA does not matter with regard to child contact and its her duty to facilitate some form of connection combined with the other two possibilities.

I totally agree Needsasock.

He is getting g legal aid to fund this, she has to self fund.

aero

The wording about prison ect on the bottom of these types of order are standard it's not an instant automatic sanction, any punitive or encourage to comply measure are decided on a case by case basis.

The likelihood of a woman in this ones situation ending up with any sanctions is about as likely as me ironing my own clothes (clue for you I never have and never will).

The bottom line is the children have rights and sometimes indirect contact is viewed as a way to protect the children's rights.
(Making no comment on this case being right or wrong just a general observation)

The mother has many options available to her as it would be highly unlikely that it specifies she personally writes she could get someone else to or she could go back to court.

I have avoided posting on this subject before because I didn't want to distress anyone undergoing separation due to dv; but there has been a massive legal sea change on the rights of contact for non resident parents.

A new child arrangements order came out in April last year which superceeded all previous contact / PR orders. Basically this order gave far more powers to non resident parents (usually fathers). Under this legislation there is essentially no powers to deny non resident parents the rights to see and have as far as much is possible equal access to their children.

Domestic violence is not a reason to restrict contact. It is not classed as a failure of parenting. As long as the parent seeking access did not physically harm their child, they will be granted contact as the domestic violence was only being directed at the other parent - it doesn't matter if the dv occurred in front of the child.

Nor is the scenario of an absent father suddenly deciding to come back into their child's life. Contact will be granted as much as possible to grant 50:50 contact known as shared care.

I presume the rationale of the act was to support the right of non resident dads to have the right of equal access to their child without their mothers raising pesky accusations of domestic violence to deny access to their children.

I have been through domestic violence - it was pretty horrendous and I genuinely feared for my life - refuge, police involvement, social servicws , IDVA teams etc. I was a single patent caring for my baby with little involvement (except control) from ex. Despite this my ex took me to court last year and was granted almost equal contact and 100% aqua
Residence during holidays. In court, I was essentially put on trial. My ex excused his violence and control on the grounds of self defense, accidentally hitting me or breaking my possessions and his control on the grounds i was a very passive person who had a mental illness which required someone to paternally control me for my own good.

During this court process he sought to get even more than 50% residence. I managed to fight him for this but it was very difficult - my son has autism and even this was not a good enough reason to radically change the pattern of contact he was used to.

The whole court process cost me 14 k - I had to borrow it from family. It was a horrible process and the new law changes have not IMHO been well publicized at all

itsnotjustaslap

I'm incredibly sorry that you have had that experience and hope you are now safe.

You are correct about the change to the name of the orders you use but quite wrong about the intention of use and quite wrong about domestic abuse not being recognised as child abuse.

In the last 2 months I have sat in various courts and witnessed domestic abuse being taken very seriously.

I'm speechless at this - it's not just about if the children are at physical risk from the Dad here, it's their psychological well being that's important to - he wasn't cafingvaboyt that when he assaulted their Mum in front of them.

Thanks for clarifying needs, guess just it being there is enough to scare people who are not aware. I think this woman wring to update her ex, is the lesser of 2 evils.

Thanks needs however I feel that this new act has penalized me. During the court process I had to call out the police half a dozen times due to my ex's behavior (forcing himself into my house or refusing to leave) and this was viewed as irrelevant information which was not taken into account. There was a very long history of me reporting to police, GP, health visitor etc but the Magistrates viewed the history as 'irrelevant' and that this should not at all be taken into account.

My ex was able to establish this by implying there had been violence on both sides and that he was simply trying to re establish the contact he had always had that I had suddenly withheld. Neither of these position statements were at all true and establishing this would have been easy however there was no opportunity for me to establish the truth and no finding of fact hearing etc. So a manipulative abuser was in my case, able to convince a court with very little effort on his part.

I hope that my case is an isolated incident. I hope that the results I got were perhaps from a court inexperienced in the new act, however the opinion of the IDVA team that I spoke to is that the new act by accident or design will disadvantage women like me. My abuser is well spoken, well educated, articulate and charming. Perhaps in these cases it is easier for an abuser to manipulate in these circumstances.

The effects on me however were harmful. I felt as if I was put on trial - I had to get a letter from my GP confirming that I was sane as my ex claimed my pnd which I had long recovered from was a reason why he should have more care. I was told in court that I couldn't refer to any history of dv, abuse, control because they were contested by my ex, were in the past and therefore irrelevant to the matter of contact. My ex's Rottweiler solicitor defamed me as a woman who actually was the abuser and who was denying contact (I wasn't at all - he had contact several x a week before going to court) to be controlling.

However I am very safe now - actually as a consequence of going to court. I have not had to call the police since August. My ex feels very powerful, and consequently happy. He has got everything he ever wanted which is control of my life. I have an incredibly restrictive and complex schedule of contact, and if I break this at all I will be in contempt of court and potentially imprisoned. He managed to trash my reputation and shake off any accusations of abuse. So ironically I am very safe, and my child is therefore safe - so that is a positive.

itsnotjustsleep on your part

How the hell does he get legal aid for this?

I understand the need for legal aid in relation to his crime but not for any additional matters. Totally wrong.