To feel we are all a little bit too obsessed with education and school?

[TheOddity]

I've seen threads recently about people remortgaging their house for private education, teachers publicly shamed in front of their peers for results beyond their control, people moving house to be nearer a good nursery, and on and on.
I recently moved to another country in Europe. I asked my new neighbour what the local nursery was like as that's where we intended to send our son. They said "it's very close and convenient". My spidey senses were tingling, did this mean it was a failing nursery? Next I go to the first parents' meeting. Not a word was spoken about targets, the curriculum etc. it was all about food and naps. In the end section for questions, the questions parents asked were about.....food and naps! He is there now for half a year, it's fine, And hopefully sometimes he is learning. There is one secondary school nearby so everyone goes there and again, it's fine. I am not overly worried my son will fail, because he is bright and I will help him.
I just think, are we all insane in the UK? Is it worth the stress? At the end of the day, if you are worried enough about them to remortgage your house, surely you could just do a bit of homework with them each night and it will all turn out ok? AIBU to think that school is all a bit out of proportion and life is pretty unpredictable unless your parents already own a fortune?

"actually state selective schools punch well above their weight in securing places at Oxbridge. And indeed at all highly selective universities."

What - you mean even taking into account the fact that pretty much 100% of students at selective state schools are

• bright
• strongly supported at home, usually by professional parents
• often tutored and home coached before and during secondary school?

All the children I know who have gone to grammars and selective state schools have had massive parental support and all have had years of coaching in maths and English.

I have yet to see any research into outcomes which controls for parental input and extra tution.

Whereas the sad fact is that comprehensives in nice leafy suburbs have the parents who do all of the above and send to top universities and the comprehensives in deprived areas have none of the above and don't send many pupils to any university.

You're not allowed to mention the leafy comps.

Obviously not as all comprehensives are 'bog standard'!

I agree with a lrevious poster that if a child is bright they will succeed anywhere. But not all children are bright
www.theguardian.com/education/2013/jun/13/state-schools-pupils-ofsted-chief

Ofsted chief: state schools' failure of brightest 'an issue of national concern'

With headline like this ^ honestly who is comfortable with sending dc to comp with not great reputation?

Would you send your bright child and literally leave them to it, trust the school in all areas?

If my DD gets into a super selective I can literally sit back and let the school do its job with confidence.

If my bright DD however misses the exams and gets into local comp which was failing, maybe on the up now, but still not great, will I be able to sit back?

No.

"If my DD gets into a super selective I can literally sit back and let the school do its job with confidence." There's another thread running which demonstrates that you absolutely cannot do this, especially if a child has been tutored or only just passed to get in.

IME an slightly better than averagely bright child in a school with a lower than average demographic (I was that child) will be a bit special in a bog standard comp and teachers will do loads extra for their star pupil, who is one of the few who wants to learn. Whereas an averagely bright child in a school with loads of kids of similar ability can be largely ignored, especially if they're one of the quiet ones who doesn't get into trouble but doesn't push themselves forward either.

A huge shock to the system for a bright child to get to a super selective and find they are average there - or even worse below average.

Well Double, the article posted directly opposes your view, based on proper research.

Comps fail bright pupils.

Mehitabel6

Not if the child is well supported at home, and told there will always be brighter and less bright!

All the children I know who have gone to grammars and selective state schools have had massive parental support and all have had years of coaching in maths and English.

Were the children in preps or normal state schools?

If the latter then yes parents will have to help because

a) state schools will not help at all to get children into selective.

b) So, if thats where you want your dc to go, your up against preps who are doing this very job, so state parents need to try and match that.

c) A report came out recently saying, to get more state pupils into selective, state schools need to help.

d) state primaries do more parents can do less.

I always worried me when super selectives get c. 97% through 5 GCSEs.

They've taken absolutely the cream of the crop from homes where they've had enough support to get through the tests and not all of them can scrape 5 Cs. They're failing someone.

The super selectives can get rid of those who won't make the grade. If you read the thread from the mother whose son won't work at one,the constant fear is that he will be asked to leave.

Exactly Mehitabel6 and still they don't get 100% though 5 Cs

They've taken absolutely the cream of the crop from homes where they've had enough support to get through the tests

Yes home being the key word.

State primaries should be helping their more academically minded pupils to dothe test.

Knitted, the average spend on privately educated children per head is about twice that spent on your average state ed child. That's why they can give 'extra help'. The state does all it can with the resources it has. There is a strong argument that extra resources should be spent not helping top achievers who will succeed anyway, but on children who are failing to reach a level of education where they can function effectively as adults.

No - the answer is for grammars to be compelled to take proportionate numbers of pupils from state and private.

I can't see why state primaries should be teaching to a test. It would be much better if no one taught to the test and then it would sort out the really bright, rather then those with the most practise and the best exam technique.

Some children no matter how well supported will get ill during their GCSEs, or experience a death in the family or will simply refuse to engage with education.

These children are not being 'failed' by their super selectives.

It would also be in the interest of the super selectives to have the true brightest as opposed to the brightest after coaching.

They may not be failed, but they are unlikely to be able to stay on for 6th form unless it was purely down to something like death of a parent.

The state does all it can with the resources it has

It doesnt though, most states dont even mention the 11+.
The state is also failing bright pupils, its those bright pupils who would have gone onto positions of so called power which is now being called a closed circuit, because its only open to children of rich parents or invested parents...the circle continues.

Children on FSG get over a grands extra funding at our school, we always get missives asking us if we need FSG ( FSM) as they get more funding.

the answer is for grammars to be compelled to take proportionate numbers of pupils from state and private

Grammars are reaching out to state but state is not reaching back.

www.suttontrust.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/poorgrammarreport-2.pdf

Excuse me but education IS important. I personally give my three children tons of help with their school work. I even go out and buy extra work books for my 9 year old daughter as she absolutely loves doing the work and my 4 year old has his own to help him read and write etc.

Parents need to put more thought into were they decided to send their children to school and not just opt for the easiest and most practical option for them. In fact I started a thread not long ago about a similar thing, where I explained why I chose to send my children to schools that bit further away as all the local ones were shockingly bad, and all I got was negativity. You can't just say oh if the child wants to learn then they will and if you just encourage them more with their work then they will succeed, I mean yes Ofcourse helping and encouraging your child with their work will benefit them but what good is that if you've chosen to send them to a failing school with unenthusiastic teachers that has a bad reputation and is full of certain types of children!

But really there are not many SS schools about.

Most DC go to comprehensives that have a spread of children in terms of ability and social background.

But since some if these schools provide a decent standard of education and some do not, any parent who is willing to target the good school is surely just doing the obvious thing.

It would be much better if no one taught to the test and then it would sort out the really bright, rather then those with the most practise and the best exam technique

We cant turn back the clock to the 1950's this is our reality right now. Preps aim for selective/scholarships for their bright pupils.
State does not. Parents step in where the school is not filling the gap.

pupils with parents who do not want to step in are being failed. they probably dont even know what the test is.

Most DC go to comprehensives that have a spread of children in terms of ability and social background

YY.

There are only 164 grammar schools left! They get far too much importance on MN when very few have the option even if their child were likely to pass the test. It is a tiny, tiny percentage. ( thankfully)

I can't see why state primaries should be teaching to a test

The level of competition is so high, you need a certain level in maths which is not covered by state primary.

You also need basic exam technique, timing tips alone would be a huge help. Exposure to the NVR and VR papers so they know what they look like will also be a huge help.