to be really upset and angry with Dsis. I have no idea where to go from here.

[farewellfigure]

Hi

A bit of backstory so not to drip feed. I've posted before that Dsis (10 yrs my senior) is an alcoholic... completely in denial and unaware that it's a horrible situation for the whole family. She got completely plastered on Christmas Day then walked out and slept God knows where. They whole family were in shock. DBiL has asked that we NEVER TALK ABOUT and apparently we all have to carry on as though nothing happened.

I wrote her a heartfelt 5-page letter after Christmas to try and explain how I felt, but she emailed me that she wasn't willing to even read it.

I'm sure you can imagine that ignoring the whole situation is completely impossible. We've had chatty email and text exchanges, and we have had one chat on the phone (completely fine) since Christmas. My Dniece, DM and myself have all been going to AlAnon since Christmas to try and cope with our anger issues, and to try and get a handle on the whole 'detach with love' thing. It's working up to a point.

Anyway, yesterday I had a great bit of news I was dying to share with DM. We are very close, probably even more so than ever. I rang her and started to tell her the news, only to hear that Dsis had got the news from Facebook earlier in the day (DM doesn't have a computer) and told her the whole thing. This was MY NEWS. My family's news. Not hers.

I emailed Dsis a perfectly lovely account of our weekend, with all sorts of chatty news, but then said that I was sorry to be a bit moany (I hate confrontation and was shaking while doing it) but I was so disappointed that she'd told DM my news having read it on Fbook, and could she not pass on my family's news to DM before I even get the chance.

Her response was to say sorry I was upset (not sorry that she'd done something which is a subtle but important difference imo), and that she'd done this for the last 10 years. She said she knows mum misses out on family stuff (wtf?) because she doesn't have a computer, so she regularly rings her up and describes photos, reads out texts and tells her what EVERYONE in the extended family has been up to. She said DM understands that if someone in the family rings her to tell her the same piece of news, DM has to pretend not to know about it. DSis said she couldn't imagine why DM had told me she already knew in this instance.

WTF? Is she family oracle? Yes DM doesn't have a computer, but she has a PHONE and I ring her 4 times a week. As does my DB and my DNiece.

Honestly I am shaking with anger. I know it's all out of proportion because of the backstory but I don't know where to go from here. I just need her to apologise properly. Also, taking on board that the WHOLE FAMILY are in bits about her drinking... actually acknowledging that we have a right to be upset would also help. Instead we just have to pretend everything is OK. Oh grrrr. Like I said though, I'm not a confrontational person and the very thought of having a argument makes me feel sick. We haven't had a cross word EVER in 42 years btw, apart from the row on Christmas Day when she accused me (slurringly) of 'judging her'. I wasn't. I was crying because DM was so upset at seeing her totally plastered.

I'd appreciate any advice. AIBU to think that taking my news from Facebook, texts etc and ringing DM to tell her is out of order?

Oh bless you Farewell - I totally would too, although I think perhaps you should let your sister see those tears and stop protecting her from the consequences of her actions. Your niece is old enough to have a say in how this is handled as well, so perhaps you could join forces with her and ask how she thinks it is best approached.

It sounds to me like an intervention-type situation might be on the cards so the family can present a united front, emphasise your willingness to help and support her, but make it clear that ignoring the situation is causing you all unimaginable pain. She will do what she wants, but she shouldn't be allowed to think that she can do it in a vacuum - people are hurt as a direct result of her actions and it's understandable that she doesn't want to deal with that, but she cannot opt out of it indefinitely.

for you and an un-mumsnetty shoulder to your your exclusive and unlimited use.

I would be ignoring your BIL at this point with regard to pretending all is fine. If he wants to enable his wife, who by all accounts is a raging alcoholic, then that is unfortunately his choice. However the rest of her family do not have to listen to him

i think you need to stop pussyfotting around your alcoholic sis and your bil....somebody needs to be upfront and 'realistic' with them. tell her which behaviour you will not tolerate from her and stick to it, tell your bil to faceup to the problems in his marriage.

otherwise nothing changes for them and your the one left to deal with it all.

Already apologised for that bloody!

I think the drinking issue is clouding your judgement on the 'sharing' issue. They're two separate issues.

Once something is on FB it's 'out there' and you can't control it. I certainly wouldn't put special family news on FB before telling my immediate family.

Sorry, yabu on the FB thing. Once it's on there it's public knowledge, how was your sister to know you hadn't told your mum already?

On her drinking, I actually think it's none of your business and she is entitled not to talk about it. Just don't invite them to occasions where there will be alcohol for a while.

I winced when you said you are closer than ever to your mum. The idea of you and her bonding over another of her child's problems is not very nice. I've had that dynamic in my family and it makes the "guilty party" feel even worse.

Carla I beat myself up on a daily basis about me and DM talking about DSis. But how can we not? We both love her. We're both absolutely scared witless about what she is doing to herself... both physical and mental health. We both just want what is best for her. We certainly aren't having cosy little chats about 'Oooh isn't DSis awful'. Not one bit. Our 'bonding' is utterly excruciating and hateful. I'm sorry that you've had that dynamic in your family too.

As for not being any of our business, how can getting falling-down drunk and leaving the house on Christmas Day not be our business? How about the numerous times she's been rude, forgetful, repetitive, slurring, and sometimes really unpleasant to us? How about getting so drunk you leave and go an sleep in a cardboard box on the street? And as for 'not inviting her to occasions with alcohol' that means cutting her out of any social occasion for the near future. Surely it's better to tell her how we feel and give her a chance to DO something, rather than just say, 'Oh well, Dsis can't come to the family summer party, Dniece's wedding, Christmas'. Isn't that a great bit fat example of burying our heads in the sand?

I'm sorry OP. Your DBIL sounds pretty useless tbh and he's not helping your sister any. I think when it happens again and he asks again, you refuse and you tell him why.

You're very frustrated with your Dsis which is very normal but you definitely need to get the support in dealing with your anger and frustration otherwise this will happen again on the next small/non issue. I'd also get some support on how best to speak to Dbro about not enabling and minimising (for yourself) any more, how to explain to him so he listens.

When you do family days like lunches, can you make them dry occasion? No alcohol and refuse anything but soft drinks? If everyone wants to help your sister then surely they'll be willing to do that so you can have a good day? And if she's turning up drunk, then I'd stop inviting her.

You put it on Facebook first so lost all ownership of the news. Your sister has done nothing wrong.

laughing I asked about 'dry' family occasions at AlAnon. They said that you're a. making a massive point, b. driving the drinking underground because the alcoholic will probably be sipping a hidden bottle of gin in the loo and c. making them feel angry and resentful because you're all pointing the finger.

At Christmas the entire family's alcohol consumption was virtually zero (unheard of... we would probably all have had a couple of beers or wine in the afternoon) but we all are suddenly hyper-aware of booze now and feel distinctly uncomfortable about it. Dsis was popping into the kitchen to drink a hidden glass of ginger wine and by 5pm she was falling over. Apparently there's just no point in trying to help by staying dry yourselves.

I agree Dbil needs to be onside and he needs to stop enabling. Dniece said she heard a lovely phrase where enabling means you 'put a trampoline under the alcoholic to let them bounce back', whereas you supposed to just let them fall. Awful, but it makes sense.

I don't understand why you put it on FB before speaking to your mum? Surely if you wanted to share it so badly with her, you'd have told her first, then put it on FB? So I think YABU.

That's interesting that alanon advise not to go dry on social occasions, OP. I would have thought that drinking yourselves would count as enabling ie. "Everyone else is having a drink, so I'm doing nothing that no one else is doing" kind of thing.

I wish you could go back and edit the thread title so it says 'The OP appreciates she was BU, an imbecile, idiotic, barking mad and making no sense. Please read the whole thread'.

The first step in AA is 'We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.' I think they're saying that the alcoholic HAS to admit they have a problem before they can move forward and hopefully give up drinking. If they haven't done that (which Dsis hasn't) then having a dry social event won't make a heap of difference. The drinker will just find some way of doing it secretly. Enabling isn't about drinking in front of an alcoholic. It's more about cleaning up their sick, bandaging their cuts, putting them to bed, ringing work the next day to say they're ill, not saying anything when you see 4 cans in the recycling etc etc.

laughing I asked about 'dry' family occasions at AlAnon. They said that you're a. making a massive point, b. driving the drinking underground because the alcoholic will probably be sipping a hidden bottle of gin in the loo and c. making them feel angry and resentful because you're all pointing the finger.

I can see the logic but isn't there a line that you are enabling too if you do have alcohol at an occasion? Don't you sometimes really need to make a point if nothing else works?

I agree your anger is misplaced. I have an alcoholic in my family well a few actually. I acknowledge it head on. I refuse to believe when they claim they aren't drinking and refuse to engage until thez are honest with themselves about it. it might sound mean but I don't think clouding the facts in secrecy helps anyone.

Ah I see your update, I just wonder if making a point might make her more aware that she can't hide it? She can pretend and hide while everyone plays along like nothing is wrong but if someone says 'actually you have a problem, don't you think?' She might take a harder look at herself. I know it worked for my eating disorder.

Won't your Dbro go with you to these sessions?

Yes, maybe laughing. Can you imagine though if Dsis turned up to a party and there was no booze and we all said, 'It's so you don't get pissed' or similar. I can't imagine it would be the cheeriest of events! She's probably walk out and go to the pub!

I can't imagine DNiece having a dry wedding either.

I think AlAnon means that until the drinker admits they have a problem you are totally powerless. That was a very hard lesson to learn. I went along and begged 'tell me how to stop my DSis from drinking'. They all aaahed a bit then said, 'You can't'. I get it now. It has to be her decision.

Sadly DBil won't go to AlAnon. He said he cannot sit in a room full of strangers and say his wife is an alcoholic.

I agree with what you mean though... we all need to say, 'you have a problem' rather than pretending everything is OK.

mommy thanks for that. I feel dreadful about this but several times DSis has said she's giving up, or will give up, or has given up and now I just don't believe her either. It's just a repeating cycle over and over and over. Sorry that you have to deal with it too.

I agree with Carla to an extent that her drinking is none of your business although it is very painful to watch a loved one in the throes of addiction. I hate all this 'enabler' shit as well. As though it's somehow your poor bils fault that she's an addict, that his behaviour is causing it when he's probably floundering himself, not knowing what the hell to do. I imagine you don't know the half of what goes on between them. In reality there is nothing you can do to help her until she wants to help herself. Not drinking yourself at Xmas, crying in front of her, telling her her behaviour is unacceptable etc etc will do jack shit. She needs to want to stop herself, you can't force her.

There seems to be a lot about how the OP has to get help, and be understanding and control her anger. But she isn't the one with the problem; her sister is. And yes, she put the news on Facebook but what was the point in her sister ringing her mum, unless it's to grab all the attention? That's not to say the OP was totally right there, but given the background; actually I can see the frustration.

Your DM is in a horrible position. Go to counselling if it helps you. But if it doesn't, I suggest you detach, let DBIL know you are there if he needs practical help, and then wait until your DSIS wants to help herself.

Everyone else going dry misses the point - your will still be an alcoholic even if everyone else in the world gave up the booze. I bet your sister has been to plenty of places where there wasn't alcohol and managed to come home drunk. Opportunity to drink isn't the problem, and by acting as though she only drinks because she has access to it at events belies the fact that she is clearly not only drinking at times when it would be socially acceptable, she's choosing to drink whether it's a problem or not.

You have all my sympathy op, I'm in the same situation.
My dsis 10 years my senior, is an alcoholic, like my father who died fifteen years ago.
She works, but spends every penny on drink. My eldest niece moved back in with her dh and her dd to try and save them both money. Since then dsis has lied about paying rent and bills, and when discoverd engineers an argument between niece and her husband to draw attention away. Niece's dh is at college but as soon as he is working plans for them to get their own flat, as the atmosphere is so toxic.

Dsis lost her relationship, and blamed her exdp totally. She seems to be able to hit rock bottom and just keep going, because it is never her fault. She was so upset when our dad died, I cannot understand why she would do the same to her own children.

We have a formal relationship now, see each other and never talk about anything meaningful. But a text from her asking for a loan of a tenner sends me into a frothing rage, as I am already upset with her, so I can completely see why the Facebook thing has upset you so much. It's another lie, and it's the cumulative lies from an alcoholic which are the hardest to live with.

I don't have all the answers, but if you find al-anon doesn't work for you don't be afraid to try another way of finding support. My mum didn't find them helpful as they advocated not trying to control the person, and if my mum had followed their advice she would have let dad drink all the rent money and been homeless with three kids. She didn't think their process acknowledged that alcoholism damages the whole family, and sometimes you have to do something to curb the person's behaviour before they damage others.

I think you may find yourself confronting her eventually, as you can see from your dbil's behaviour that protecting an alcoholic from the consequences of their behaviour enables them allows them to cause more hurt.

Am sorry about your sister OP. Have a similar situation with DH's family, although less dramatic, where almost everyone is ignoring or enabling.

What do al anon advise about telling her your feelings about her drinking?

Agree that BIL isn't helping anyone, least of all your DN, and I wouldn't ignore the issue for his sake, but I guess all everyone can do is decide what, if anything, to say to the person with the alcohol problem, and set your own boundaries.