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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To go over the teachers head?

154 replies

Bananaapplegrape · 04/02/2015 20:51

Right bit of a backstory (sorry!) DD is 11, year 6 of primary school, never been in trouble, always had brilliant school report, in top sets blah blah.. She's targeted for a 5A in maths and a 5B for literacy in the sats...

Today she came out of school hysterical (to the point where she was brought out by a TA who had found her crying in the toilets), they had a 'long write' today.. It had been marked and DD got a 5c.. Her teacher ripped the work out of her book and she is to redo it tomorrow (during break!!!!)

I went to talk to the teacher, fully expecting her to explain that DD has completely misunderstood but no.. Teacher stated that DD has potential to do better, so she has too.. I asked had DD been messing around? Nope.. Chatting? Nope.. Behaviour was absolutley fine.. But she KNOWS she could have done it better.

I completely and utterly disagree with this and told teacher so DD loves school and always works hard.. She is not reacting well to the stupid amounts of pressure that these fucking sats are placing on her (despite me telling her repeatedly that it's the school being tested not her) and today has just completed fucked up her confidence...

I've tried talking to the teacher and she is Adament its a legitimate learning approach bollocks so would IBU to go to the head?

I should add - If DD was messing around them I would have absolutley no objection to the loss of break (though still wouldn't be overly impressed by the book ripping) but to do that to a child who is already achieving over average? It just feels really wrong that she's being punished for not over achieving...

OP posts:
Tinks42 · 04/02/2015 23:17

Fuck me, a couple of commas in my last post would have worked Grin

Tinks42 · 04/02/2015 23:21

life is not perfect, schooling is not perfect. Teaching your child that is far better. My son didnt get on with a few of his tutors.. so what. I told him that in order to progress in life you have to deal with people you dont get on with, you are there to learn so do it in spite of this. He has.

DancingDinosaur · 04/02/2015 23:25

Well done to you tinks Hmm

Not really the same though is it. Unless you're advocating that kind of abusive behavior in schools is ok. Which, in case you're not sure, no it isn't ok.

I'd go and talk to the head about it op.

Tinks42 · 04/02/2015 23:30

I have already said in my earlier post that of course you should go and speak to a head if the teacher is pulling pages out your childs book. Im not advocating anything. Im saying that helping your child to know that there are horrible people in all walks of life and how to cope with that is what we as parents hopefully do.

Tinks42 · 04/02/2015 23:34

I could not change his teachers but I could tell my son not to rise to it and focus on what he wanted to get out of his schooling.

LizzieVereker · 04/02/2015 23:34

I'm a Secondary English teacher. I'm generally of the " stop snivelling and work harder" breed of teacher.

However - your poor DD. If my manager observed my lesson, and said it was a "Good" and I'm expected to get "Outstanding", I'd be upset. I'd be even more upset if he ripped up my lesson plan, and delivered this feedback in front of my colleagues or students, which is essentially what has happened to your DD. I'd most certainly be crying in the toilets. I think your DD's reaction was entirely proportionate given the circumstances.

I would not support her redoing the work during her break either - she hasn't been lazy or naughty. Your daughter deserves an apology, and in my unqualified, commenting through a screen opinion, the teacher deserves some support with their stress level or work load.

I hope your DD is feeling better now.

(Tiggytape is right about SATs being a legal requirement btw.)

TheFairyCaravan · 04/02/2015 23:37

Tinks not one poster has said all teachers are demons, so stop making things up.

Some teachers are horrible and they can, and do, destroy children's self esteem. I'm glad you could tell your son to "deal with the people he doesn't get on with"! Hmm However, I had a 6/7 year old who was being shouted at for asking questions when he didn't understand and having his work sheets screwed up when he got it wrong. Was I supposed to tell him that was okay and to "deal with it?"

Tinks42 · 04/02/2015 23:42

Here we go...

I said that I helped my son deal with whatever in school.

I said that teachers are sometimes wrong.

I said I told my son that these things happen and to rise above it and learn.

You cannot change some things all you can do is equip your child to deal with them..

Now IM wrong... really

DoctorDonnaNoble · 05/02/2015 06:21

I teach Secondary English. Many of our students come from the independent prep system and have no SATs results. We set them targets based on CATs and our knowledge of how they are performing.
Regardless, if you tell your DD the tests don't matter and she 'underperforms' in them, you can bet your bottom dollar the secondary school will still try and get her to her best level. A school doesn't stop encouraging a child once they get to their target grade. That would be silly.
SATs are used to assess teachers. Whether that's through league tables at primary or their progress at secondary.

Lucy61 · 05/02/2015 06:39

Perhaps she removed it to avoid getting in trouble with the senior leadership team who would look in the book for evidence that your Dd is making progress in her class and that she is indeed achieving a level 5a/b/c .. She's covering her own back at your daughters expense.

I would photocopy a page if a child needed to refer to it as a draft, not rip it.

So sorry this happened,

Mostlyjustaluker · 05/02/2015 06:41

Hi bananapplegrape,

I am another teacher but thinks the teacher's behaviour is unacceptable. I don't think speaking to the head is going over the teacher's head as you already spoken to the teacher and are unhappy with the outcome.

Feenie · 05/02/2015 06:49

Feenie, people can still chose to keep their children off for SATS testing. It is known as 'choice', you may not like it!!

What a strange thing to say! Why would I not like choice?! Don't be an arse. I'm just making sure the facts are clear so that no one reading erroneous advice like yours goes off hard-cocked.

As other teachers have also stated, you can't choose to withdraw your child from SATs. If you were chose to keep your child off for the entire fortnight, there would be consequences.

Original poster
Bananaapplegrape · 05/02/2015 06:55

I'm not keeping DD off for two weeks! Heaven forbid!

tinks (again) you choose to teach your child to 'suck it up' - I chose to teach mine that the right things happen when you do the right thing.. She worked hard so that should be rewarded not punished.

OP posts:
Feenie · 05/02/2015 06:57

I know you weren't considering that, bananapplegrape. Wink

Let us know what the Head says today.

clairemum22 · 05/02/2015 07:28

Good luck with head. I can't believe that the teacher behaved in an acceptable way - humiliating your daughter in front of her peers just because her work was below a high grade. Who does that?

JollyFrog · 05/02/2015 07:39

Of course you should speak to the head, or higher.
I would have gone mad if this happened to My DC.
I never agreed with Sats, imo it was all for the schools benefit and secondary schools will soon grade the child into the correct groups.
When DS was in yr 6 some of the teachers admitted they didnt agree with sats
Oh and good luck trying to speak to the head!. Ours was always guarded by a team of vipers who were worse than drs receptionists Hmm
Dont let it drop OP!

saoirse31 · 05/02/2015 07:40

teacher was wrong to tear pages out. Not convinced she was necessarily wrong re missing break if she genuinely felt ur dd and others not trying.

as her mother I'd be more worried tbh about your dds reaction- it seems completely over what you'd expect forwhat happened and I'd be looking to teach her some strategies about coping when things don't go her way. And checking there was nothing else going on. I'm not sure you're doing her any favours by saying I'd she does the right thing she'll get rewards... she's surely of an age where she should be moving towards a broader understanding of life.

on a tangent- hoe dies it take a good 11 yr old 2 hours to write 2 a4 pages?

Baddz · 05/02/2015 07:48

See the HT...if no joy write a letter to the BofGov
Unacceptable behaviour from the teacher.

Altinkum · 05/02/2015 07:49

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Yangsun · 05/02/2015 08:03

I'm appalled that this happened and hope the head takes it very seriously. Contact governors if he doesn't. Yes SATs results are used by secondaries but it's for target setting which is for the teachers really not for your dad. No one is not going to teach her to reach the highest grade possible just because her SATs indicated she was a lower grade.

Original poster
Bananaapplegrape · 05/02/2015 17:10

I'm back!

I can't comment on all that's been said (especially as most of its the same that I've already responded too...) but the few I've not answered...

It took 2 hours because it involved planning the work etc, it was over two lessons. Everyone had the same amount of time.

I spoke to the head who agreed that it wasn't handled correctly and agreed that DD is a good student and therefore should be encouraged to 'take chances' and not worry that if she doesn't make the target grade it will be deemed not good enough - he had a chat with the teacher and DD was given the work to do over the course of the day without missing any breaktime...

I don't get the feeling DD's teacher is a 'bad' teacher.. I suspect she's got caught up in the madness and actually forgotten that there are little people and minds involved here not just test scores.. Hopefully she's now been reminded!

OP posts:
Original poster
Bananaapplegrape · 05/02/2015 17:13

Oh and for the 50,000 time my DD is not overly emotional, she has perfectly good coping strategies - it's not like she ran out of class and was found screaming about the injustice.. She went into the toilets of school and had a good cry.. Tbh I never understand what the outcry is regarding crying - it's a human function.. People cry.. It's not a sign of a damaged individual.. In fact the opposite! It's normal!!

OP posts:
tiggytape · 05/02/2015 17:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Feenie · 05/02/2015 17:36

Me too! Hope the teacher has had a reality check about what is and isn't acceptable regarding children's work.

missymayhemsmum · 05/02/2015 17:57

Well done. I'd suggest you say that if you feel your daughter is undue pressure you will withdraw her for SATS week and ask other parents of bright children to do the same.

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