Aibu: to feel devastated that my son said this?

[kewtogetin]

Afternoon all. I'm not usually one for drama but I'm actually feeling devastated over an incident at my sons school today. He is in year 2 and at pick up time his teacher asked if she could have a word. It transpires that my son called a girl in his class 'brownie' during a lesson this afternoon. The girl is his friend, of Pakistani heritage and so does indeed have brown skin. I asked him why he said this and he replied 'because she has brown skin mummy'
I genuinely believe this incident doesn't have racist undertones but if course I understand that making fun of someone because they look different to you is also not acceptable.
Race/racism is not something we've ever spoken about at home, I don't think he has any concept of racism. He certainly hasn't heard any negative language surrounding race either at home or within the wider family. His teacher was very unhappy and he has received a warning and will miss out on the end of term treat as punishment. She also told me (grudgingly) that she is prepared 'to leave it at this, and not take it any further')
I can't understand why I'm so upset over it, I think it's because I'm worried that his teacher has him marked as a racist but also because he seems so bewildered as to why this incident is so serious. Im waiting for DH to come home from work before we talk to him together but to be honest I really don't know where to start or what to say, I'm upset with him but for him too if that makes any sense?!
Any advice gratefully received.

I agree with the other posters, my dd yr 1 would quite innocently describe someone as having brown skin, pinky skin, or sort of Golden skin in the same way as she would use eye colour, hair colour, shape and size. Or being male or female. She has no concept of being black or white I guess because to her it is just another way of us being different to each other and not a big issue (although she does understand people coming from different countries mainly because she was born in a different country and her little best friend at school was born in Pakistan). I sometimes think that it is we, grown ups, that impose these problems on our children by trying so hard to not offend (which of course we shouldn't offend) but sometimes we can end up making our completely innocent and non judgemental little ones suddenly aware of the differences between us all. Also by being so insistent on not being allowed to talk openly about those differences, because it is not polite, therefore making those differences somewhat of a taboo.
Maybe have another word to the teacher tomorrow to explain, why you can see that what he said was not appropriate, you also feel strongly that he meant it in an innocent way.
Try not to feel bad.

Your child is being very unfairly punished for something he didn't do. He wasn't racist, and there are far better ways to educate a child into why it's unacceptable to comment on skin colour.

That's what you need to be talking to the school about.

Over reactions like this create racial issues when there were none previously.

Don't be devastated . Kids in year two have no tact and just say as they see it. Tell him under no circumstances should he make these type of comments and explain why . I would imagine the teacher is inexperienced or over reacted. Your son will learn

Racism in schools always touches a nerve with me. I have finer hair and was bullied horribly at school. I could never get anywhere. Bullies were given trivial punishments etc etc but never excluded. A friend who was mixed race was victim of a couple of comments about being coloured, again in a bullying way but not racism as such, just stuff like brownie whereas I was ginger minger. Her bullies were excluded as it involved 'race'. Both were bullying, both were to do with our physical characteristics that we were born with, but one was seen as worse than the other.

My mum is a deputy head now and I think a lot of schools have to write reports and things for 'racist incidents'.

Deffo speak to the head. Even if it was meant as a put down of sorts (and in this case I don't think it was) kids just pick on physical characteristics that make us different. I don't see why skin colour should be any differently treated to fatty/blondie/speccy in terms of punishment, which for a first or isolated incident, a quiet word should suffice.

Surely sensible adults can see the vast difference between an innocent little child commenting on another's appearance without even a smidgeon of 'racism', and nastiness, mockery or a desire to insult and hurt through an overtly racist comment? I feel so sorry for your DS; I bet he's puzzled and upset, as he knows he meant no harm and now he's being punished quite strongly by being excluded from a treat.

I should do what others have suggested and have another word with this teacher. The child mean no harm, you've explained things to him and you'd like an opportunity for him to regain his place on the trip.

Our lovely neighbours' children 2 doors down (aged 2, 5 and 7) really like my African dh. Their dad was talking to me only last week and said, "It's lovely we have a black man in the village as they never see any other races. They're always saying how nice and black Mr Spiders is." Then he looked aghast and clapped his hand to his mouth. He added, "Oh no! Should I be saying he's black? Have I said something racist? I'm so sorry..." I had to reassure him over and over that what he'd said was absolutely delightful and my dh would be proud and happy to hear how much they liked to see him. Surely anyone can tell when an insult is intended, or when children are merely noticing and commenting in complete innocence?

A lovely story Spiders!

leave the poor boy alone, he's just speaking the truth as he sees it.

Poor lad. As an adult I am now never sure on what we can say or not say. Also why are children not reprimanded for making fun of ginger haired children. My granddaughter has beautiful red hair, but keeps dying it because she gets so upset about the names she is called.

Historically people with ginger hair were not enslaved or made to use different bathrooms. Bullying for any reason is really wrong but that is why racist incidents are taken so seriously, because of the legacy of real racism.

Op, maybe the fact that you don't talk about race is one reason why this happened. Children notice difference whether it is granny who always wears red or someone who is bald. The fact that we pretend to be colour blind when it comes to skin colour must be confusing for children and they may realise that skin colour has some taboo significance.

My son is younger and has made some comments that I found very embarrassing, its pretty common I think. I have talked to him about how we don't keep mentioning people's skin colour as some people are mean to people who look different and it can hurt their feelings. Also it could be really annoying if someone kept pointing out that you look different.

I do agree that an end of term punishment is really far away. Is that their standard punishment?

Dancing crown - we've never discussed race because I don't feel it's necessary, we take people as we find them and by mentioning a persons skin colour I think it creates an issue where there really isnt one. Today has forced us to talk to our son about race/racism and I feel a bit sad, as though there is a loss of innocence almost. His best friend at school is black and he's never mentioned it, nor have we, why would we? In the same way we don't mention that my sons ears stick out, should we talk about that just in case their is an incident in the future?! I don't mean to be flippant, maybe we've been naive in thinking skin colour isn't important or an issue to discussed.
As for the punishment, well if you get one warning you lose a half day treat after Easter (a walk in the woods, baking cookies etc) if you get 2 warnings you lose a full days treat. So basically if you get two warnings in the first couple of weeks of term you might as well go hell for leather and be an almighty shit in class because you've got no treat to look forward to anyway. It's a new system only started this year.

In my LEA teachers have to report any and all incidents of racism or perceived racism in class.

The teacher is obviously using their discretion wisely in this instance but a lot of teachers probably would have reported it and then it does go on your childs file.

A boy in DDs class when she was 9 was reported to the LEA for calling a black girl "Chocolate face" I know it got passed on officially.

This happened to me when I was 5 or 6. There were 8 girls in our class, all getting changed after PE and we were all pretty hyper, making animal noises (oh to be 6 again!) anyway, our friend started barking and I said oh look you're being a big brown dog. I remember being in detention (which back then was standing in a freezing cold corridor during lunches and breaktimes) wondering what I had done. I just didn't understand it, she was brown wasn't she? I don't think most 6 year olds have any clue that racism even exists. I just didn't know what i'd done wrong. My mum reasoned with the head teacher and I was allowed to do my two weeks of detention in a classroom with the learning assistant.

Please take it easy on your son OP and speak to his teacher. Explain what he said was wrong but make it clear that you understand he didn't know it was wrong. These kind of things stay with you for life and I genuinely believe it affected me. I have a really strong urge to defend injustice and put it all down to this experience, i wish someone had spoke up for me more instead of branding me a racist.

when my son was younger i got a call from the school saying my son had made a comment about another pupils skin colour

i said i would have a word etc etc but the teacher kept on and on

so i then asked the teacher if the other child had called my son white trash would the other boys parent get a call and a lecture,the answer was no

schools especially where the children are very young need to keep things in proportion

This is OTT. At that age you say what you see, he had no malice behind it (ie I'm not playing with you because you're a brownie) then it's an over-reaction.
Also, end of term is 12 weeks away - he's 5 - how is that effective? No-one will remember why he's missing out unless it's constantly brought up which unfairly labels your son.
I think I'd have to say to her "yes completely agree that he needs to be aware this word can be offensive and he shouldn't use it but to stop him having his treat implies that you think he has knowingly and wilfully been offensive which I absolutely do not agree with".
This is great advice. I'd also query the punishment system; in my DS's first school he quite often missed golden time on a Friday - half the time, by Friday, he had absolutely no idea why (it was for being unable to sit still on the carpet on Tuesday). Missing something at the end of term is crazy.

My three year old son keeps saying he doesn't like brown people when we go to church as our church is very multiple cultural , his preschool and family are pretty much white so it is where he sees black people. I have told him not to say it but it's tricky to get him to stop. He certainly doesn't hear anything like that from us.

He was just being literal. Like kids are. The teacher sounds very, very silly indeed. A simple "we dont poke fun at people like that" would have sufficed. No big deal, poor kid.

YABVVU.

1// to feel devastated - seems like an overreaction.

2// Dancing crown - we've never discussed race because I don't feel it's necessary, we take people as we find them and by mentioning a persons skin colour I think it creates an issue where there really isnt one.

Thinking like this is part of the problem.

Read this: www.rageagainsttheminivan.com/2010/02/little-bigots-at-basketball.html

"I truly believe that our colorblind era of denial is not serving our children well. Kids do see color - and when parents ignore it, the result is that MY KID gets to become the object lesson."

Unfortunately because you chose to ignore the race conversation, that humiliated girl became the public object lesson.

Complete overreaction on the part of the teacher. The girl wasn't upset, neither was her mother. The OP's DS doesn't even realise he's done anything wrong.

Would a 7 year old be made to miss an end of term treat because he called someone Ginger? Or Spotty? Even Stinky? I doubt it!

I'd go and speak to the head.

What a sad overreaction. I teach this age group and would not dream of responding like that! These are 6 and 7 year olds! I also have a black DW (we're both women). When she came to live with us Dd was very young and had never met a black person before. She used to ask all sorts of funny questions and make all sorts of observations because she was just being very honest and open. We took them as they were meant, naive comments from a young child curious about the world. Go and talk to the HT about it. I hope s/he is a bit more sensible.

Thinking like this is part of the problem

Rubbish. There is no problem except one that you are apparently trying to create.

Username12345 are you the teacher?! I'll be ignoring your advice.

That's fine. Then don't be surprised or 'devastated' if he does it again because you refuse to talk about something basic, obvious and important.

The message that a child is going to get from this incident is "next time you are around someone of a different color from yourself, start feeling uncomfortable. Because talking to a person of a different color from yourself is fraught with dangers and difficulties." I would be absolutely furious if this was my child.

well, if nothing else the punishment of missing an end-of-term thing needs to be remitted - a punishment that doesn't come into effect for another couple of months? Bonkers.

It sounds like a purely observational comment, made innocently to a friend. Teacher sounds too keen to stamp on anything she percieves as racism on her watch. Sounds like, if she is new, she could do with some mentoring/training on this point?

I know what you mean about not mentioning it, OP - DD's best friend as nursery was mixed-race Asian, and many of her good friends now at school are black or mixed race. I really don't want to make it an issue because of course to her it isn't - her friends are her friends, people are people (as Depeche Mode eloquently said). She's grown up in a multicultural area and has never even observed that some people have black skin etc.

I think it's an overreaction. Young children are very pragmatic about these things - when my DS started nursery, he made two new friends with the same name and came home that day talking about how he'd played with Matthew-with-the-white-face and Matthew-with-the-brown face. This was not meant to be racist in the slightest - no different, in his eyes, than saying he'd played with Matthew-in-the-green-top and Matthew-in-the-blue-top. It's all about context and intent, and if your son didn't say it in a nasty way then punishment - epsecially such a remote and heavy-handed one - is totally inappropriate.