8 week old DD won't sleep!!! Feeling desperate :(

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Posted this in 'sleep' but also posting here for traffic. Sorry, but I am so desperate now!!!!

Sorry this is long, but detail needed I think. Typing this after hours of trying to get DD to sleep she has finally given in and asleep on me (for the moment).....

DD is almost 8 weeks old and exclusively BF. Has always been a crap sleeper/frequent waker and fought naps in the day but sometimes went 2-3 hours in her cot at night.

This week (week 7) she has become even more alert and it's made her sleeping even more of a nitemare! She is basically point blank refusing to sleep anywhere but on me or DH so we have to take it in turns throughout the night...but sometimes she won't even sleep on us until hours of 'battling' her to sleep have passed!

I have noticed that if she is awake for more than 2 hours she goes into meltdown (hard as she is SO alert she would stay awake all day of left to her own devices!!! This has happened on few days when I've had to attend appointments, and ends in hours and hours of screaming and taking until 12-1am to settle her!!!) so I try to get her back to sleep before 1-2 hours of awake time.... Hit and miss at the moment.

We are both feeling desperate now, if DH wasn't here I'd be averaging 1-2hrs a night max. Surely this isn't normal?! You can tell she's exhausted but she just won't let herself go, and even when she does, she's sleeping so lightly that the slightest thing (e.g, she moves her own arm) wakes her up. She's comfort sucking so much she's pooing loads, I'm worried she'll make herself ill...but if I don't give it to her then she just screams hysterically!!! The only time she gives in if I refuse her the boob (if I'm ridiculously sore for e.g.) cuddle her/rock her and essentially let her cry (which is f'king awful!) is after many many hours and she is completely exhausted. Can't co sleep....have tried it, it doesn't work because she wakes herself up, being led down next it me is the same as being in her cot so she might as well be in there because at least I sleep better. Sometimes I can rock her to sleep if she's almost asleep from feeding lots, but she's getting so heavy I can't do it much longer because it makes my stitches hurt (extensive tearing) Even DH is struggling to rock her to sleep now.

My HV is useless and never has more than 5 mins to speak because she's so disorganised and always running late. All the usual suggestions (swaddling, trips out in pram/car seat, white noise, dummy etc) make no difference at all :(

Considering giving a bottle of formula last thing at night....?! But I KNOW she's not hungry, she just won't sleep!!!!!! So don't think it would make any difference and after all I've gone thru to breastfeed (another thread!!) it feels like a failure.

I'm feeling pretty low and desperate....

Thanks for the suggestions and comments.....it helps to hear that it's probably just a phase we have to trudge through (chanting it will end, it will end!!)...but I cannot emphasise enough that DD does not seem like a normal baby!!!

She is SO alert and fights sleep until the bitter end....she will even be sound asleep after hours of feeding/rocking and then for seemingly no reason at all, wake herself up with a start and SCREAM!!! And it starts all over again......

All the usual tactics of swaddling, white noise, dark room, pram or car rides, dummies (she refuses it), co sleeping etc do not work!!!!
The only things that even come close to working at the moment are feeding and feeding and feeding until she is almost sick and then rocking rocking rocking....she may then fall asleep. But like I say, wake herself up again for no reason!!! It is exhausting.

I'm worried about how the lack of sleep is affecting her brain development, let alone mine and DH's levels of sleep deprivation!!
The constant grind of repeating this over and over again day and night is getting very draining emotionally :(

Poor you, just try to be consistent in whatever approach you decide on, I kept trying different things and giving up after a night and trying g something else. Mine was a terrible sleeper he improved a lot after 12 weeks, I know that must seem like a lifetime away for.you at the moment but this will pass and things will improve. Get someone to take baby out for a walk so you can have a nap, if people offer help take it!!

Mine would get so tired he looked like he had 2 black eyes, it was awful x

My dd was exactly like this. She had silent reflux and needed medication before anything changed. Google silent reflux and see if she has any other symptoms (hiccups, arching, coughing, screaming soon after a feed). I know lactose intolerance can give similar symptoms too. Go to your gp. My hv's told me it was normal too, but in my dd's case she was in constant pain, and feeding as a desperate attempt to sooth the pain.

I feel for you. I'm lying in my bed next to DS2 who I've been trying to get to sleep for 3hrs. He's totally wired and flapping and pumping his arms and legs and no doubt working his way up for another mammoth crying session. It's dark. You've fed. You're warm. So just go the fuck to sleep!!!!!!

Was going to say silent reflux but others have got in before me. If you think she has then gp will probably start her on infant gaviscon. Hopefully that will make a big difference. Also prop up whatever she sleeps in. If it is reflux, just to warn you that the gps try a 'guess what works' approach, which can be frustrating.
Returning to the checklist can help. Double check that she is not hungry, hot/cold, tired, dirty etc. Sometimes it can help focus and make you feel less lost. Plus when they've screamed from one feed to the next it's quite easy to miss that they are hungry again.
The best advice I can off is to repeat the mantra of 'this too shall pass' and to sing the Tim Minchin Lullaby song while they are screaming. It doesn't last forever (thank goodness) but it certainly sometimes feels like it! Keep your chin up!

You have my sympathies. I. hallucinated due to sleep deprivation. Have you tried white noise? It is the one thing that helped me when nothing else worked.

Download white noise baby app or just use untuned radio. Needs to be quite loud i.e. louder than their crying. Play noise to send to baby sleep. You can also keep noise playing after baby falls asleep to encourage to sleep longer.It mimics the environment in the womb. It's a noisey place, apparently.

Try this white noise app - it has actual magical qualities on my 11 week old daughter -

meant to say the video is pretty awful - but the noise works a treat!

The more tired she is, the longer it will take her to settle. What worked for me was routine from almost day one with both of mine. But they were both excl. FF which I think is easier. YY to swaddling-nice and tight in a giant muslin. Dummy.

But routine is key to good sleep.

How are you swaddling.
We used a zippy up one as she couldnt get out.
Think mine had a soya allergy causing relux.
But also had an undiagnosed lip/tongue tie.

I feel your pain, DS1 was a rotten sleeper at that age, I remember frantically trying to identify his "sleepy signs" when in fact he used to go from "alert and happy" to "overtired meltdown" with no intervening stage. He is now a five year old who only wakes up at night if he's sick and actively asks to go to bed, so it's not permanent! (and lest that sound like eight million years in the future, he improved a lot after about 12 weeks)

Definitely second investigating things like reflux/tongue tie (though don't be disappointed if there isn't anything physically wrong), swaddling for night time (we used to burrito DS1 in a Miracle Blanket and let him cluster feed all evening while I watched TV, then he'd usually give a good long stretch afterwards), and fresh air during the day. Due to the aforementioned total lack of sleepy signs we basically did naps by the clock - an hour and a half (or less) after waking up I'd parcel him up, stick him in the pram, and go for a walk, he'd normally conk out before we got to the end of the road. He used to sleep pretty well in the sling as well. Eventually he got to the point where he'd stay asleep in the pram even if it wasn't moving, so I used to go to a local cafe and eat cake. :) Until then I'd download lots of interesting podcasts (This American Life, Woman's Hour, etc.) and listen to them while walking around for naps, made it seem less like a chore and more "me time", IYKWIM. Once his daytime naps were better his night time sleep also improved.

Oh, and also recommend Dr Harvey Karp's "Happiest Baby On The Block", he is a genius at calming very young cranky babies. If you Google Harvey Karp Richard And Judy, you'll see him in action.

Also 8 weeks is a classic "developmental leap" time (see The Wonder Weeks) where there's a lot of brain development going on, so sleep can be especially crap around then - it's a phase that will improve, though (though may disimprove again when the next leap comes along).

I found a woombie helped with ds' startle reflex which often woke him up - they are fab as one layer (it is a zip up pod) so no over heating, ds looked like a glow worm :) he was never a good sleeper and the growth spurts were horrendous - awake every 30 mins for 3 nights and lots of cluster feeding, we eventually coslept at 10mths.

And yy to the wonder weeks!

Also isn't this the classic colic age?

Please read up on silent reflux OP

I could have written your post 8 years ago.. turned out it was reflux. Propping him on his side next to me on the bed helped (had futon on floor so was safe). He also got really bad trapped wind, so learned from a paediatrician how to wind properly, as he was often tossing and turning in his sleep. The thing is, some babies, especially reflux babies just hate being put down on their backs. The first time ds slept properly was when he could roll on to his tummy. Lots of tummy time in the day, as this helps strengthen the diaphragm, as I recall. It does pass. Sleeps like a trouper now. Do get him checked for reflux. Best of luck x

Oh, and the feeding and feeding thing is a classic reflux sign.

my dd was edbf it's totally normal we had this.too.my dd.is still up.a.lot now at 16months it's a killer I remember phoning my mum at the 8week Mark cos.I was so tired and my dad drove 2hours to take her out a.walk.so.I come sleep I used to have a blanket in the living room and the minute she napped I would like.down even if I didn't sleep I'd just rest even now I nap when she does if I can. It's exhausting but get people to help even so you can rest look after yours self

8 weeks is peak crying. My little boy was like this. It was horrible. We tried anti reflux and cranial osteopathy in desperation. Really he just grew out of it by around 12-14 weeks. Swaddling and white noise and bouncing on an exercise ball for the evening and the two hours at around 1-3 am fur weeks. Daytime walks in sling for hours. Took me 90 mins of walking to get him to sleep. I was so slim! But it all went back on after. He grew out of it and is a dream now at 18 months. we got our evening back at 16 weeks. It was lovely! You will be fine but it's impossible to see now. I cried every day. Hang in there. Good luck.

My DD was like this. I couldn't even take her for a walk in her pram until she was almost five months old, she just screamed the whole time hysterically. A stretchy wrap helped loads. Either walking around in the house or going for a walk with her in it. You can have her in just a nappy and your too half naked for skin to skin. Looking back I do think she probably had silent reflux. If she ever did fall asleep in her car seat, she'd wake up The second I took it out of the car. Many a car journey ended with both DH and I in tears as DD had been screaming and there was nowhere to pull over.

Also, I know you have said you've tried co sleeping, but have you tried side laying and feeding her to sleep and then letting her sleep next to your breast, not latched on, but touching? Or can you doze while she actually feeds?

My ds was similar. So another poster sending sympathy. I suspect it was reflux for ds but I was ground down by tiredness and not able to stand up to drs and hv who insisted it couldn't be. Do comfort feed too - in case of growth spurt. Do check if there is physical cause too - could they have trapped arm/foot in cot and hurt themself. Unlikely I know but one to bear in mind.

How about starting a bedtime routine now? We started one at 10 weeks or so. Felt a bit funny doing it with a baby so young, but it worked quickly and it was a novelty having our evenings back and eating together. Low lighting and quiet might be suitably boring for an alert baby? The trick is consistency.

Have you tried a crib with a t-shirt smelling of you for a bed sheet and a blanket rolled into a sausage at the end to make it more cosy?

Dummy?

I recommend just leaving her alone.

Ds was like this. He didn't want to be held, fed, changed, wind, rocked or fussed at all.

It was over stimulating him.