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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

"She's got the weekends off because she's a mum"

124 replies

TicTicBOOM · 02/12/2014 13:11

I don't know if I'm being unreasonable, genuinely.

Recently DH started a new job within the company, and until now his rota has been up in the air. He took it upon himself to look at the available rotas to find a gap where he could fit in and he noticed there was an opportunity for him to work monday - friday with fixed weekends off (something that is quite rare in his line of work) and brought this up with his boss. Boss agreed that it looked like he would be able to have this shift, there was fixed cover for the weekends he'd have off, and it suited the company very well for him to do this. Boss happy, DH over the moon, all good.

DH was told he'd have his rota by the end of December with a view to start it in January.

A couple of weeks ago new colleague transferred over and is being trained to do the same job as DH. They got chatting the other day, and she mentioned how she'd been told she can have a monday - friday shift. DH spoke to his boss about this and apparently yes, she's been given the shift instead of DH, last minute decision - he just hadn't been notified yet.

When he asked why she'd been given it over him, he was told it is because 'she's a mum, we tend to give the weekends to women with children where available'

Now, I know, being a mother myself that weekends with my children mean a lot. But they mean an equally great deal to my husband.

Am I being unreasonable in thinking this is unfair on DH, and that he's basically been denied something he was told he could have, just because he's a man? Or is what they've done fair for reasons I'm not understanding?

OP posts:

NeedsAsockamnesty · 02/12/2014 21:59

I am assuming she's not a SP, by the way, the hours they work are very unsociable, 4am starts would be hard to pull off without support at home

I'm a single parent I routinely start work in the middle of the night but it would be almost impossible for me to get weekend childcare

apotatoprintinapeartree · 02/12/2014 22:01

I don't think parents should get priority over none parents either.
If you can't do the hours, don't take the job, both male and female, married or single.
This sounds like discrimination and I think he should fight it tbh or at least propose they alternate weekends.

zeezeek · 02/12/2014 22:16

To make it clear, what I am saying (as an individual with children) is that my children and their childcare are the responsibility of myself and my DH - their father. I continue to work evenings and weekends because I am able to because of the support that I have at home. If I didn't have that support I would have to change careers.

I also said that under the new law everyone is entitled to ask for flexible working whether or not they have children.

I firmly believe that in the future many jobs could easily be carried out on a flexible manner - I know that I work best in the early mornings to just after lunch, then again in the evening and I enjoy the (relatively few) opportunities for being able to work that way.

However, that is all irrelevant in this particular thread because the fact is that the OP's DH has been discriminated against on the basis of his gender. Imagine the uproar if he was a female?

PhaedraIsMyName · 02/12/2014 23:21

Completely unfair and completely irrelevant that she might be a single parent.

GraysAnalogy · 02/12/2014 23:31

ThisFence She shouldn't be given flexible working because of her children. She should be given flexible working because she has requested it, like the next person who may not have children should be able to get it.

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost · 02/12/2014 23:37

That's unfair. Can they not do alternative weekends.
However is the women an LP. With no childcare of a weekend if she is then what is she supposed to do leave her child alone of a weekend.
I do get your frustration though,

NotGoingOut17 · 02/12/2014 23:57

As someone who works in HR I have to say I am absolutely shocked at some of the attitudes on this thread. Very naive to think that work places should go out of their way to accommodate employees outside of work commitments and give preferential treatment on this basis to colleagues. Parents have a statutory right to apply for a change in working hours but there is no right to have the working pattern agreed if a business cannot accommodate it and this includes if existing working patterns of existing employees mean it does not work - as in this case because OP's DH had already had agreement.

I must have missed the week in my employment law module where they taught single parents should be given priority over everyone else. We all make choices in life including having children and choosing a work place to suit our needs. I absolutely support the right for parents to apply for flexible working patterns but I remain aghast at how many people think that their employer and colleagues should accommodate them no matter what the cost is to everyone else.

OP this is absolutely gender discrimination, if your DH has email confirmation I would suggest in the first instance he raises it with the manager to resolve informally but if unsuccessful raises a grievance/harassment complaint. If he does not have it in writing I would suggest he considers putting in a formal request and asking for written reasons if it cannot be accommodated to give him something to use as evidence should he wish to take it further. It must have been very horrible for your DH to be treated in such a way, I would be ashamed if a manager in my company had treated a male employee in such a way.

NotGoingOut17 · 02/12/2014 23:59

Iliveinalighthouse - She is supposed to think about what she would do for childcare before she applies for a job with a working pattern she can't do.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler · 03/12/2014 00:15

I would be furious. DH would be furious too.

The new employee (or the newest to be transferred in to the department) needs to check that they are able to work the available shifts before accepting that particular job. They can't simply take something offered to someone else!

IF the woman in question is unable to find childcare at weekends, then she was not suitable for this particular position as at the time of her appointment, there were no Monday-Friday only jobs available.

I am getting angry here on your behalf!

GraysAnalogy · 03/12/2014 00:33

Glad to see someone in the line of work agrees notgoingout

Original poster

TicTicBOOM · 03/12/2014 07:53

He has lots of emails back and forth between his boss about the shift change, and the email confirming the rota will be drawn up by the end of December with a view to begin in January. Would this be classified as 'in writing' in that case?

Also! She definitely isn't a lone parent, so DH informs me. She mentioned to him that she gets a lift home from her husband. So being a lone parent had no impact on the decision to give her DH's shift.

OP posts:

Bellossom · 03/12/2014 07:55

The only thing I'm thinking of is maybe they wanted her to work there and said to her you can have mon-fri to tempt her over? But can't quite see from the post of that could be possible (and I hate companies who shit on their own staff to please newcomers)

Bulbasaur · 03/12/2014 08:03

Single parent or not, he was promised weekends, he needs to be given weekends.

When I find jobs, I do work only with ones that can accommodate my hours, but I don't expect jobs to cater to me. I simply let them know when I can work and if they can do it, great. If not, maybe the next job will. I also work contracts from home so completely different dynamic, but I don't accept contracts for hours I can't put in.

Madamecastafiore · 03/12/2014 08:04

It doesn't even matter if she is a single parent. She should not be looked on any differently than someone without kids or with a penis.

A fathers role is no less important.

If she couldn't get childcare to allow her to work the same shift pattern as everyone else she shouldn't have accepted the role.

rollonthesummer · 03/12/2014 08:07

What is he going to do about it, OP?

YonicScrewdriver · 03/12/2014 08:14

Can we please stop blaming the woman? She may well have been asked re shifts and then expressed a preference, just as op's DH did. She may even have said that she couldn't accept the transfer unless she had a certain shift pattern, either of these would be fine. It is the employer who has messed up.

ilovesooty · 03/12/2014 08:18

If he hasn't copied those emails I'd advise him to do so in case they disappear.

YonicScrewdriver · 03/12/2014 08:19

And my understanding was that parents of children under 16 (mothers, fathers, lone, coupled, whatever) had enhanced rights wrt flexible working requests.

ilovesooty · 03/12/2014 08:22

I think everyone has equal rights to flexible working now, dependent on the business ability to accommodate, and quite rightly so in my opinion.

DrSethHazlittMD · 03/12/2014 08:46

Mouth dropped out at Bertie. You're basically saying that parents are more important than people who haven't had children ever, haven't had children yet, or were unable to have children.

There are enough divisions in society and life as it is without that sort of shit attitude becoming more prevalent.

ilovesooty · 03/12/2014 08:55

The only people I can see on the ACAS site who might receive any kind of different treatment when making a flexible working request are those requiring reasonable adjustments for a disability. In fact the emphasis is not on your reasons for asking but on how the request can be accommodated from a business perspective.

Jill2015 · 03/12/2014 09:43

Hmm. Tricky one. I'd like to say yes "person with children" should trump "person without children" ...

Eh??

MissDuke · 03/12/2014 09:52

Op, will he say anything? I definitely think he needs to now, before her hours are put in writing. I would certainly be looking for some kind of compromise. Good luck!

As an aside, my sister used to offer to work every Christmas as she is child free and she wanted to help out her colleagues. However one year her father in law was ill so she requested to have it off so she could spend time with him before he passed away, as she knew it would be his last Christmas. Her colleagues were furious with her. So she never again offered to have it off, she just works whatever is on the rota now. People can be so selfish, and take kind heartedness for granted, and I fear that is part of the issue when trying to accommodate single parents. I think staff have to be prepared to work at least the occasional holiday/weekend if required, if it is a normal part of the business hours. Choosing to have children should not lead to automatic preferential treatment.

Nicknacky · 03/12/2014 09:52

yonic it's been extended that all employees have the right to request flexible working, parents don't have any additional rights now. It changed earlier this year, I believe.

Andrewofgg · 03/12/2014 12:25

I'd like to say yes "person with children" should trump "person without children" ...

Really Jill2015?

Contact father who only sees his DCs at the weekend?

Person with eldercare responsibilities?

Do two kids with OH trump one without OH?

Or is everyone's private life equal?

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