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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think many mumsnetters have little or no understanding of life on a low income

554 replies

crocodilesarevicious · 24/11/2014 16:09

It's going to be hard to know how to phrase this as I don't want to cause offence.

I've been hanging around for a while. One thing I've noticed is that benefit threads become angry very quickly because so many are quite loud and fixed in their view that the UK is full of starving children reliant on value baked beans from food banks to fill their hungry tummies.

However, if someone who is on benefits or a low income is searching specific advice! they are often given quite short shrift. I've noticed this a few times - they are told, often brusquely, to retrain as something at university - usually a teacher or a nurse. These are graduate professions yet they are chucked out as something anyone can do. Not everyone can go to college or university due to financial restraints but also, some people don't have the academic ability. This is dismissed and shrugged off - if people aren't on much money then they need to find a way to make more money, even if this isn't possible.

Childminding, or starting a business is also suggested. People who rent may not be able to do this. Again, this takes a certain amount of financial and business savvy not to mention starting up costs.

Cooking is another area people seem to have little understanding of. It's so easy to cook healthy, cheap nutritious meals if your kitchen is large and a pleasure to cook in and you can whiz in the car to sainsburys or Tesco. If you have a small, grubby, dark kitchen and the local Spar or premier shop it's a bit different.

I suppose what I'm getting at is that when talking about people in general terms, Mumsnet likes to be left wing and PC. Yet when it's someone specific, irrelevant and often patronising advice is given to them and then they are flamed when they can't act on it.

My own position, while I'm a graduate and employed in a professional capacity, is perhaps between the two. I've never been reliant in benefits but was homeless for a time in my 20s and am able to see how things that look simple often aren't.

OP posts:
GratefulHead · 24/11/2014 16:53

Let's not discount the crap being peddled by the right wing press when it comes to people's opinions either.

Gremlingirl · 24/11/2014 16:57

This makes very interesting viewing especially with regards to this thread (it's a microplay from the. Guardian website in case anyone is wary of clicking unknown links!)

Innocuoususername · 24/11/2014 16:57

Ooh yes the "I worked hard" response, there are loads of people that work hard and are still on the bones of their arse.

Chalalala · 24/11/2014 17:01

Having an au pair is hardly Downton Abbey territory really is it. Usually a foreign kid on minimum wage in the spare room.

Not having a go at you because of course you're right in a sense, but still - you're assuming 1) the existence of a spare room (an unattainable dream as far as I'm concerned!) 2) that your house and location are nice enough to attract said foreign kid in spite of minimal salary

ClawHandsIfYouBelieveInFreaks · 24/11/2014 17:02

The idea that council housing is "free" enrages me! People actually assume that if you live in a council house it's "free"

What the actual?

NewEraNewMindset · 24/11/2014 17:05

Bloody hell OP you have just said what I have been thinking for a year but was too thick to articulate. YANBU!

Fairylea · 24/11/2014 17:06

This sums up a lot of attitudes perfectly I think. ..

Britain Isn't Eating | Off The Page #1:

crocodilesarevicious · 24/11/2014 17:08

Cha - quite.

It isn't just money. It's lack of money but also a permanent lack of access to money (many people, myself included, will happily work for little in order to balance work with childcare fees) and therefore lack of ability to purchase things that will enable a saving of money.

I also find it very interesting reading about 'hard work.' Seven years ago, I decided to get out of the teaching rat race Grin and complete a Masters. Due to the premature deaths of my parents I have inherited two properties; I live in one and rent out the other. I therefore 'ate' my rent from house2 and did days of supply when I could. In Christmas 2007 there wasn't any supply available and due to a car malfunction I took seasonal work at Marks & Spencer's checkouts.

NEVER in my life have I had to work so long and so hard for so little! I was longing for the schools to go back to enable me to get some supply Grin

OP posts:
Boomtownsurprise · 24/11/2014 17:11

Did you see the thread about childcare being expensive?! Apparently I shouldn't have thought spending £40k on two dc a year in childcare was. It was something I should have budgeted for. I should retrain to be s lawyer. I should work every night. Dh should take a second job. I should move ffs.

The responses were laughable. All apparently went to the "I had it fucking hard and you should too" school of response rather than actually made a sensible or measured reply.

aermingers · 24/11/2014 17:11

So hang on, you come on and complain about being on a low income and people try and offer you advice on how to get out of your predicament and you're moaning about that? And I have eaten healthy food on a very tight budget and a tiny kitchen.

x2boys · 24/11/2014 17:11

Yes but claw a lot of people also believe council housing should only be for people who have no other option and there is an assumption that just because council housing is very hard to get in London its like that everywhere! Well actually no where I live in the north west I was offered a house within a couple of months and currently both myself and dh work.

IrianofWay · 24/11/2014 17:12

Of course many of them don't. I suspect the majority of the population doesn't. Not really truly skint. I've been there only once and for a relatively short period of time but it has seared itself into my brain.

FickleFecker · 24/11/2014 17:13

I know people on both sides of this... I have a particular friend who has been looking for job for years, applying for every minimum wage job he can find, volunteering with his church to fill his time and almost every job here has over 400 applicants. He has MH issues, which doesn't help matters, but being constantly told "well just go and get a job then!" isn't helping. He lives in a grotty bedsit where the LL doesn't give a shit about the living conditions. Seeing the disparity between him and my colleagues is heart breaking.

So many of my friends in this situation are too proud to ask for help but it affects them mentally and physically.

LoisHatesChristmas · 24/11/2014 17:16

I think this is true in life, not just on mumsnet. I have seen some great support given to people on here too. The pull your socks up brigade do annoy me though. Not everyone is capable of retraining etc.

SilentAllTheseYears · 24/11/2014 17:16

I think most people haven't got a clue. I have never forgotten the time when I rented a bedsit to live in and had a candle in my room for light since it was cheaper for a single candle and a box of matches and a light bulb and would go to a shop for food that sold dried food in bins like you get bird seed etc in pet shops as I could buy chicken noodle soup for 50p which would last a week.

crocodilesarevicious · 24/11/2014 17:17

Aermingers, no, as a rule - although it has been known, people don't complain about being on a low income.

People complain about abusive husbands, failing schools, broken down cars, rude neighbours, awkward hours at work, depression, mental illness, fear of cancer, elderly parents, dilemmas relating to jobs, housing, moving, their dreams and anxieties for the future.

Many of the answers they get assume that cash, if not available in abundance, is at the very least accessible (could you not get a business loan? asked one well meaning Mumsnetter brightly when a bored SAHM explained she couldn't start her own business making cakes.)

What is interesting is not the advice - it's when a poster explains that isn't possible due to lack of funds, the advice quickly changes as to how to GET these funds.

That's when - retrain, get an au pair, be a childminder, start a business, move - come in. It's as if poorness in it's permanence is faintly obscene.

OP posts:
ClawHandsIfYouBelieveInFreaks · 24/11/2014 17:18

2boys they believe that because the bulk of them was sold off! Stupid tory government "Oh everyone can be a home owner"

Yes...and fuck the normal people who work but earn little!

You should not have to be on the breadline to get social housing. They were always meant for the working poor. People with low wages.

In our region they actually still are...you need to be in employment to qualify for many houses and flats.

Innocuoususername · 24/11/2014 17:18

Yes yes to permanent lack of access to money. All but the most frivolous could live on whatever jobseekers or IS is for a few weeks, but that's because most people with even a little extra money have well maintained homes, tins in the cupboard, clothes that fit in decent nick....I think those who say "but welfare is plenty! I could live off £80 a week" have no idea of the cushion that having money gives you.

Boomtownsurprise · 24/11/2014 17:20

I really thoroughly agree with you op.

Also the shock of having a woeful life compared to what you had pre dc is also quite large.

And for the poster who suggested I move away from my support system, we did. I had a breakdown because of it. Marvellous idea. Moved back life's still shot to shit but at least I have my sanity.

ouryve · 24/11/2014 17:20

I suppose what I'm getting at is that when talking about people in general terms, Mumsnet likes to be left wing and PC. Yet when it's someone specific, irrelevant and often patronising advice is given to them and then they are flamed when they can't act on it.

This is because "mumsnet" is more than one person.

FickleFecker · 24/11/2014 17:28

73 squid isn't much when you factor in utilities, clothes, transport to the job centre, food...even before you get to the things that stop you going stir crazy like socializing.

NickiFury · 24/11/2014 17:33

I agree OP. I remember having a low level skirmish with a well known MNetter after it was suggested I could clean, take in ironing Hmm, walk dogs, babysit etc to earn some money.

I told them I live in London and there are agencies here who do ALL that, you name it and there's an agency that does it. They want you in uniforms, regular hours and so on. I have no childcare and two kids with autism. How?

I was told I was being defeatist, that there's always that kind of work if you want it, that I was discouraging others from doing it Confused. That in the teeny village THEY live in there's this kind of work and so on.

Cloud Cuckoo Land.

ghostyslovesheep · 24/11/2014 17:34

I really dislike the 'become a child minder' answer to everything Hmm

Childminders have to eb QUALIFIED and go through OFSTED inspection etc - you can't just buy some toys and take kids in

Innocuoususername · 24/11/2014 17:34

boomtownsurprise you make a good point about suggestions of "can you move somewhere else for work?" suggestions. Never mind that you may have a support network and kids in school, moving also costs £££, even if you are renting not buying. If you have savings or can earn back agency fees in a couple of pay cheques then great, but many people aren't in that position.

GratefulHead · 24/11/2014 17:35

I love my MIL, but she and FIL are prime example of this. They live in a £600k house, own another property which they rent out worth in the region of £700k AND have land which is about to be granted planning permission for four luxury homes if all goes to plan.

But they are poor and have to watch every penny haha. I love them to bits but they really have no clue about what struggling is like. It's best when we sit down for drinks and they start on abo it while quaffing their expensive wine or spirit bless em.

And am not being horrible here, they REALLY don't know the other side of it. And I suspect would help anyone if they could see a need not being fulfilled.

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