To think that it is hypocritical to be anti Private,Selective or Single Sex Schools when you have benefited from them.

[smokepole]

Having read many threads on this site and having read a couple in particular today, it seems that "most" of the posters on here have benefited from these types of schools. However, time and time again you read these people slating Grammar , Private and single sex schools. This is so hypocritical that the posters who have had the benefit of the best of the education system, seem so anti any form of selection for today's children.

I had the misfortune of being educated in a Secondary Modern in Kent in the 1980s . There are not many Secondary Modern educated posters on this site, which goes to show how fortunate the majority of posters on here were with their educations. These people are like "Champagne Socialists" having benefited from superior educations, but seek to deny the opportunities for future generations. "DO AS I SAY NOT AS I DO" springs to mind with these posters who espouse the merits of Comprehensive education, having not being educated through the Comprehensive system themselves.

I was privately educated throughout with the exception of 18 months at a really decent state school. I didn't choose my education but for sure, if I had, my choices would have been different. I did, of course, choose my dcs schools and they were state educated throughout and, in my opinion, went to better schools than I did!

Personally I see no hypocrisy in commenting on choices that were not ours to make but our parents. I'm not any sort of champagne socialist because my mother sent me to boarding school and I chose differently.

Never assume that everything in the independent school garden is lovelier either.

We went round this loop once before on another thread about another topic. Your parents made choices. My parents made choices but at 40 you have to figure out your own path not harp on about what they did or didn't choose. If it was something dreadful like abuse then that's different obviously but sending you to a local school isn't crime of the century.
As MrsDeVere says, what actual evidence do you have to back up your assertions? Not 'look at this thread'
I'm probably an undiagnosed Aspie. Best O Level results in my year at my mixed secondary school in an area with no grammar schools.

And finally, I know what it's like to go to that type of school. It's the type of school which I am best qualified to have an opinion. DH went to a boys' school. Secondary too. So where do we send ds to avoid one of us being hypocritical in your book?

The schools I attended were in part dictated by my parents' divorce settlement.

I'm still married to DH so have made different choices for my children.

I went to a comprehensive school. I chose to go there, despite passing the 11+ and getting a place at a grammar school. (Private school was never a consideration for my parents - they didn't believe in it, but also couldn't afford it).

We sent our DC to the local comprehensive as well.

All based on our beliefs that education should be free and equal.

So no hypocrisy here, thank you very much!

i agree with you Smokepole and alot of politicians had the mindset you outline in capitals.

Surely most people go the school their parents choose for them and don't have much of a say in the question. Once they have children themselves, they are perfectly entitled to make a different choice for them.

That's true but surely you want the best opportunities for your dc.

I did, indeed want the best opportunities for my dcs. Which is why I chose to have them state educated. Far from any sort of hypocrisy, my experience of private schooling actually informed my decisions.

YABVU. I don't see why I am accountable for decisions my parents made when I was 11. It is often because we went to certain types of schools that we know first hand what's wrong with them.

Almeci. Its good to know I am not the only one to think the way I do, regardless of my education or experiences of it.

Hurly. I am not saying you are accountable for your parents decisions, that in most cases were the correct decisions.

I am though saying that to call parents who are making the same "correct" decisions for their DC regarding Private, Grammar or faith schools is "wrong and hypocritical. The reason being that many of the posters who be-moan such schools on here benefited from the said schools. Today's Parents should not be called for making the same choices for their children.

smokepole
I went to private school.
Since then private school fees have risen at double the rate of inflation every year.
I could no more afford private school for my kids than I could afford my childhood home in South Ken.

So I've made the best of my lot for my kids.
I support comps. They are at a comp.
Why is that hypocritical?

Hardly hypocritical given the unlikelihood that they chose how they were educated.

I've not come across this attitude at all.

YABU

Of course it is not hypocritical.
is it that you do not understand what the word means?
If I send my child to a certain school while at the same time saying such schools are wrong, I am a hypocrite.

if I am the child of someone who made their decision where to send me to school and I grow up and disagree, that does not make me a hypocrite.

you cannot be a hypocrite because your view differs from that of your parents.

you can only be a hypocrite if you make the decision to do one thing while saying the opposite. Since children rarely if ever choose their own education, they cannot be hypocrites for making different choices for their own children.

they just made a different choice!

do you do everything exactly the way your parents did in every respect? If not, are you a hypocrite? Of course not. That would be a stupid thing to say, wouldnt it? You would be a parent who has made choices they feel are the right ones.

I do think hypocritical is an odd choice of words here. Partly because obviously, you usually have very little choice about how you are educated. And partly because often the experience you have had informs your judgement. A friend of mine, for example is a vocal campaigner against private education. He is the product of a very expensive private education himself, which has,obviously, given him many advantages. But his experience means that he can speak knowledgeably about the damage and disadvantage that such an education can do to individuals and society.

Polter. I am glad you said that. There are some excellent "Secondary Modern schools" that achieve up to 80-85% A*-C including Maths/English. These schools bear no relation to what people's perception of them are.

I guess the Comprehensive was the worst of the three, because it was trying to straddle both the Grammar and the Modern without succeeding .

Talkinpeace. You are located in a fully Comprehensive area, that realistically does not have access to a grammar in a nearby county or area.

I guess Salisbury would be the nearest grammar area to you, South Wilts/Bishop Wordsworth?

You will support comprehensive education if it is the only option available, considering that you don't want to or cant pay.

The point is every "caring" parent will choose the best school for their children. If the child is able and a Grammar/ Private school is Available or affordable , surely either is preferable over a Comprehensive for that child.

smokepole
There are kids from round here who get the train up to the Grammar.
I think their parents are mad.
I genuinely do not believe that my children would have better outcomes in a segregated environment.
Seeing how the grammar / private / comp kids are settling in at the 6th form colleges has only reinforced my views.

" "Secondary Modern schools" that achieve up to 80-85% A*-C including Maths/English."

Could you link to, say, 10, please? Actually, start with 5.

"If the child is able and a Grammar/ Private school is Available or affordable , surely either is preferable over a Comprehensive for that child."

Why?

I went to a girls, Catholic comprehensive.

I'm anti single sex and faith schools. I think religion should be kept out of schools, and while I get that girls acheive well in sciences in a single sex environments, I don't think single sex schools prepare pupils socially. Most people work alongside others of the opposite sex. Also I went to school in the 70s/80s and we were not allowed to do 'traditional' male subjects such as woodwork, metalwork and TD. Our school had a 'sister' boys Catholic school who weren't allowed to do needlework and Home Economics.

If the child is able and a Grammar/ Private school is Available or affordable , surely either is preferable over a Comprehensive for that child.

No. That's not necessarily the case. And I can honestly say that I think you are being very obtuse here. People keep on explaining why you cannot be described as hypocritical based on the educational choices your own parents made but clearly, this isn't a message you are prepared to take on board. Nor do you seem willing to accept that everyone isn't prepared to sign up to the idea that grammar and private schooling is necessarily the right or preferred option for their own dcs.

Smokepole
You live in Kent - east Kent to be precise.
There are no Comps within 70 miles of you
ie comps that take the vast majority of kids in an area

please do not slag off comps until you've really experienced them

part of the reason I am anti segregated education is that I'm very aware how badly it prepared me for the real world

OP I think it's more unreasonable for you to criticise a system (fully comprehensive) that you haven't experienced, than for other posters to criticise one they have (grammar, single sex, private whatever).

I'm shocked at how many people didn't choose their own schools.

Also, what is the difference between a secondary modern and a comp?