To wonder if this means I'll never be a Mum?

[snowflakecookie]

Options are - adopt, or IVF.

I / we have reasons pertaining to our religion as to why we are uncomfortable with IVF. (This is personal and not applicable to everyone who has it by the way!)

So it looks like adoption is our only option. But there are so many things about it that again make us uncomfortable and unsure it is right for us.

So - I suppose this means we won't be parents. And that breaks my heart.

I've no idea why I'm posting really. Perhaps I am wondering if anyone else has gone through this.

No, I haven't created these barriers - my religious beliefs are not a barrier I need to work through with cbt but what I believe to be true.

It's probably true I have a fear of adoption and will continue to look into it, but I just don't know. The element of additional needs also scares me with adopting - I know this is a risk of faith with any child but adopting seems to bring a can of worms with it and the fact you are repeatedly told no matter how much you adore that child it won't be enough - does scare me to death!

Becoming a parent is frightening. Full stop.

Yes, adopting a child which brings 'known' or at least foreseeable additional baggage, but embarking on having any child is a leap of faith (religious or otherwise ).

Any child can be born with difficulties or can acquire them after birth - I don't think that people who give birth to their own children consider this v much tbh. Adoptive parents are made (rightly IMO) to consider and reconsider their desire to adopt and what that might mean for them as individuals, as a couple and as a family. There's a danger that the hoops to jumps through seem too daunting even if they are there for v good reasons (that's for another thread maybe…).

CBT or any other form of talking therapy (and that could be with a minister or priest of your trust and choosing) may help you to unravel you complex thoughts and feelings on all of this, but are not designed to work through your beliefs.

Pacific I know that - but while I understand the point that any child is a leap of faith, I am just not convinced we are up to parenting an adopted child with their needs. I suppose, in short, I don't know if we are for adoption or adoption is for us. Talking to a minister or priest would be both immensely painful and largely irrelevant as they certainly wouldn't tell us what to do but pray with us - which we are able to do as well of course.

Sometimes, there just isn't an easy answer and in this instance there isn't but it still breaks my heart.

the just do not know is maybe what needs to be explored

agree therapy may be the way forward (would not have thought CBT so much as this is more about dealing and working with anxiety rather than exploring the fear) and also talking to parents who have adopted.

your fears and feelings are valid, I am sure many have faced similar fears as you and could be of support. could you ask of the adoption board some questions ?

OP, if you really believe in God and really sincerely believe that he's made you infertile for a reason, then the best thing for you to do is work out what you think God actually wants you to do with your life and go and do it.

it could be you still come to the answer that adoption is not for you, but it would be terribly sad if this was not fully explored and you are left with I just do not know

there are therapist who specialise in working with women/couples who are not able to have children (if you look on the bacp website they are listed if you choose to go to therapy)

i wish you the best op

Are you a Christian, hackmum?

I believe that God has a plan for us, but these plans aren't set out in stone and they are not as simple as 'I will make person X infertile so she can do other things.' (FWIW, I'm not infertile.) The plans he has for us are immensely complex, fluid and they are not revealed to us. You must know that surely, even if you are not religious? Perhaps you didn't mean your post to sound dismissive or unkind.

Freudians - I've lurked on the adoption board for a few months weeks now :) and time and time again I see people post with similar fears and these fears are answered kindly and with compassion. But they are still there. The fear that choosing your child's name means the child won't feel like yours, for example - people - wonderful, compassionate, big hearted people reply explaining they felt the same but then it stopped being important. That might be true - but what if it isn't, in our case? I suppose that's one example.

Another pertinent fact is that there appear to be less children than adoptive families,currently, and this would mean if we were accepted we would in effect be taking a child from a home that desperately wanted him. He would deserve better.

Am having some talk therapy at the moment. That's probably why it's all weighing heavily on me at the moment as I'm being forced to come to terms with some very difficult facts.

I think hackmum is right.

aww snowflake you may find you may desperately want him/her too and provide a wonderful loving home

its true in time it might still be important but does that change how you feel about being a parent?

it is a leap of faith (i am not talking about a religious kind) there are successful adoptions and ones that work out not quite so successfully. i think all parents will agree it is not quite how you thought it would be but would we change that? sadly some still feel yes but often this is to do with their own insecurities about being a parent not how they feel about being a parent (if that makes sense)

So because you believe in God, you have to know exactly what your life will be like. Right.

Freudian'thanks. There's a while to think about it - we'll see. :)

Sometimes, there just isn't an easy answer and in this instance there isn't but it still breaks my heart.

I agree, entirely.

In which case you need to find a way to make peace with the hand dealt to you in whichever way you find possible.

I know pacific and that's what I'm doing my best with. It doesn't mean it is easy or that having made that decision it isn't a decision that doesn't break my heart

ah i see that you are having therapy

mmm does often make you feel more confuse than before its a process but its hopefully getting to the answer to what is right for you :)

Snowflake, I can see what a difficult choice this must be for you and you have my sympathies. I've recently been in a situation where there were no 'easy' options, simply 'less difficult' ones. In the end I had to decide what I would compromise on. Your situation feels very similar (though the details are different)

Given your reservations about ivf/adoption your default position right now seems to be remaining childless. The implications of this are causing you pain, so you need to think again about ivf/adoption and whether your reservations are insurmountable. This is what you're doing right now, I know, but I'd encourage you to get as much info as you can, talk to as many people as possible, pray, do research, anything that will help you. You're making a very difficult choice, you owe it to yourself to be as informed as it's possible to be.

In the end, it will come down to the compromises you are most happy to make. Do your concerns about adoption override your desire to be a mum, for example? You need to work this out for yourself. But one thing I've learnt is that a perfect solution isn't going to just present itself. You'll have to work through the difficult choices and find out what you're most happy with.

Name change for this

You have two perfectly acceptable routes to becoming a parent and fulfilling your wishes and yet you are willing to reject both. Making the decision to reject both means you cannot complain, moan, feel sorry for your situation etc

My husband was a practising catholic. He was rejected from his church when we turned to ivf. His parents in turn have now themselves left the church at the treatment of their son and have never been happier. We are now all looking forward to the birth of our first child and their first grandchild.

Do what makes you and your husband happy. Ignore anyone else's input. It is the two of your after all who have to live with the choice you make. I would hate hindsight and regret to hit you in five or ten years when you may be considered too old for either option.

Note, in ivf there are no discarded embryos if you choose. Any embryos excluding those that do not develop can be frozen and you can have every single one transferred if you wish over a time frame.

Good luck in your choice.

Although I've may not be what path the church may want you to have / take all God wants is his people to be happy. You would not be sinning you would be branching out. How do we know what God would think now-- there was no help 2000 years ago - perhaps if there were he would be pleased because he wouldn't like to see those loyal to him unhappy.

In case you think I'm being flippant I really am not I am just offering a different outlook.

Hi Snowflake I totally get what you mean about adoption. If it were a matter of rescuing a desperately needy child or baby who no one wanted from an orphanage it would be different. But the modern reality of adoption is not like that and while there are still needy children I can understand why you wonder if it is the right thing for you.
I am a christian and one thing I do think is that you are putting all the religious restrictions on yourself but not accepting any of the help and support available from the church. If you are of a strong enough faith to believe God doesn't want you to do certain things that you would like to do and not do them, then you should look to the community of believers for help. I know many Christians can be all too humanly fallible, but still I do believe God can work through the church as a community. I mean don't dismiss them praying with you or the religious advice of a minister or vicar (even if you prefer a secular counsellor), those things can help you.

Just out of interest, if you feel uncomfortable about God's approval of fertility treatment to create life, are you also uncomfortable about the use of modern medicine to exend peoples lifespans past what they 'naturally' should be? E.g. use of insulin in managing diabetes, organ transplants etc.

snowflake I'm a Christian too and our path to having a family has been rather dreadful so even though I'm 18 weeks I'm not entirely sure it will be successful.
We too have completely ruled out adoption, it really isn't for us.
My issues aren't fertility related so IVF isn't an issue but if it were then I might feel like you do.

Would you consider ICS (sperm directly guided into host) with a surrogate? That would mean the baby is biologic your DH but not biologically your bit you would have the same legal rights.

I understand your feelings about Gods plan in your life, infertility exists but it doesn't mean he selected you to be infertile its not like your have been personally selected.

My own way to cope is to understand the above but also recognise that God may still have other plans for me, another path to being fulfilled.
The worst thing I've found about constantly striving for a family and failing was the feeling of limbo so I've moved forward with plans for my future to help me feel more stable and less frightened about a future without children.

OP, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to be unkind and I realise this is painful for you. But I suppose (as someone who doesn't believe in God) that if you firmly believe that God doesn't want you to have IVF, then you have to consider the adoption route. And if you have strong objections to adoption, then you have to put the whole thing out of your mind and consider what to do next.

You say: "The plans he has for us are immensely complex, fluid and they are not revealed to us". But if that's true, how can you be absolutely sure that God is opposed to IVF? If God's plans are so unknowable, how can you be certain about one aspect of God's plans but not the others?

Just reading that through, I hope I haven't made it worse. If so, please ignore me.

Have you looked into Naprotechnology?
lifefertilitycare.co.uk
I'm not particularly religious but used this technique for a while when I was having fertility problems. I did conceive using it but it didn't work out. I eventually had ivf and have a little boy. We had to try very hard to get him here and he's very loved obviously!

I don't think people should try to talk you into adoption if you feel it isn't for you. I don;t think you'd get through the assessment process and the various ups and downs that happen inevitably along the way. The only thing that keeps you going at times is the total singlemindedness which most prospective adopters have.

I was aware of the potential problems with adoption but in the end my desperation to become a parent overwhelmed my fear of the unknown. If you are more scared of unknown additional needs than being childless then I don't think you can adopt.

IVF in a different way is also grim and I don;t blame anyone for not wanting to do it. You should however make sure you have investigated all fertility options available to you as IVF isn't the only option and you might feel comfortable with some of the other less invasive options?

Just to correct something

If it were a matter of rescuing a desperately needy child or baby who no one wanted from an orphanage it would be different

Very few children are in "orphanages" because they aren't wanted, or even frankly because they are orphans. And if you think that someone relinquishing their child they are too poor or lack the family support to keep them is easier to reconcile yourself to than domestic adoption, then think again.