To not want ds singing the bloody national anthem every day at school?

[lecce]

I am reeling about this and would love some opinions.

Last night the dc and I were taking it turns to play songs on Youtube, when ds1 (7, Yr 3) announced he wanted 'Land of Hope and Glory' for his next choice . I was stunned - I didn't even know he'd heard of it. In the interrogation that followed, it transpired that his class has been singing 'God Save the Queen' every day before home time. It has no relation to their current topic, which is India, of all things... Mention has been made of 'loving our country' and that, as 'we are English' we should know these lyrics.

On Friday, those who had completed their art work early were given the lyrics of 'Land of...' (not ds - never have I been so happy about his lack of artistic talent) but, apparently, they will all be 'doing' it soon.

I absolutely do not want my children singing these nationalistic, jingoistic lyrics every day. I don't want the school promoting this kind of cheap patriotism to them, either. This is not what education is about.

Is this Gove's fault? I am a teacher (sec) and have heard nothing about this particular type of brainwashing. AIBU to kick up a stink about this?

Fwiw, I'd be bloody horrified if this happened in ds school. YADNBU. Clearly others see it differently

Cherie Blair ???
WTAF has she got to do with it
Poor Cherie

It really puts perspective on things though, doesn't it?

I have long admired your username from afar Janine. And yes, we have been watching your ex in BCS

I have no doubt OP is all about hating England whilst learning how wonder every other nation is better in every possible way.

Perhaps you would prefer mandatory privilege checking sessions.

So dreary.

quenelle

Too much, too much fucking perspective.

GSTQ is not about loving England- it's about loving the Monarchy.

I didn't read the whole 19 pages of the thread. Could it be related to the British Empire and the Britain's rule in India?
GSTQ in Scotland is associated with bigoted football fans on the terraces. I used to sing it with pride and a tear in my eye. I'm old enough to remember it being sung after theatre performances. Today I associate it with nastiness.

Patriotism is what keeps a country strong and united. You are the reason Why countries have extremist.

OP, if previous generations hadn't been so patriotic you wouldn't be free to be so cynical, and you'd be suffering a far worse degree of 'brainwashing'.
Have my very first F.O.

This is one of the scariest threads I've ever read...........

ComposHat

I am an atheist with republican tendencies. GSTQ leaves me cold I'm afraid.

If we had a national anthem that praised its citizens and espoused values that I consider to be important I would have no objection to DS singing it as often as he likes.

Hak nor does it mention the country it is supposed to be the anthem for. It is set to a tune that is the aural equivalent to a slow fart, is divisive (leaves us atheists and republicans out in the cold) and the lyrics are dismal. It has also been co-opted by the English, so is no longer representative of the UK.

Time for a change and please not Land of Hope and Glory.

I think a bit more patriotism - real patriotism, not racism or xenophobia dressed up as patriotism - would be a good thing for Britain.

Think of British born children going to join ISIS for goodness sake - they clearly don't feel a connection with or pride for this country do they?

It really pissed me off that England flags and Union Flags are now the badge of the racist - lets try and take back such symbolism. I am proud to be British I think, for the most part. I really fail to see how having children sing the national anthem is 'brainwashing'.

YANBU OP. I wouldn't like this one bit. ' Long to Reign Over Us' indeed. Balls to that.

YANBU at all.

I am Scottish/Irish and grew up mainly in England. I can still remember reams of unfunny and unpleasant Irish and Scottish jokes, in the playground, on the TV, everywhere - and you were roundly abused if you didn't find them amusing or worse still, objected.

I wouldn't want my kids to be singing that nonsense every day.

If my kids started grand- standing about Our Country I would be seriously perturbed. This is just the place where they happened to emerge from me foof. That's all. It's a relatively nice place, but that's just dumb luck.

I was very struck when the Charlie Hebdo shootings occurred that the French parliament spontaneously sang their national anthem. I thought it was a great expression of solidarity and I thought at the time that it was a pity that it couldn't happen here.
OP I think you are making far too much of it.

It's a relatively nice place, but that's just dumb luck.

It's just dumb luck that your kids were born here, yes.
But it is certainly not a nice place by dumb luck. It's a nice place because generations have fought to make and keep it that way. If the present and future generations have no sense of patriotism, it will be a nice place no longer.

I think if they're studying India in the time of the Empire,it's a great time to learn the national anthem and talk about the lyrics and what they meant when they were written and whether they still have resonance now. And how the feelings it prompted would be different for people in India. Singing it every day for a week could be a great prompt for discussion too, about why we don't do that any more and why some other countries too and how pupils feel about their nationality. I don't live in the UK and I hope DS is taught the Dutch national anthem at school and gets to dissect its frankly bonkers lyrics. I remember learning the French national anthem at school and discussing what it said about France.

If any of my kids displayed 'a sense of patriotism' I would feel like an utter failure. Many of the things that our governments have done appall me; I teach my kids to behave respectfully and kindly to others. Nothing more is required.

I've just scanned through all six million pages and still haven't got closure. Did the OP ever come back and I missed it?

I expect there was some reasonable explanation and all the frothing was for nothing.

At our school the children learn it (and other songs) in a weekly singing lesson with a specialist teacher, during the Spring term and as part of their topic work. One of the classes may also include it in their assembly.

They also look at the national anthems of other countries but I think they get a bit less air time, and historical context is explained too.

It honestly never occurred to me that anyone might object.

If any of my kids displayed 'a sense of patriotism' I would feel like an utter failure.
That is just disgusting. Without the patriotism of those who died to keep this country in existence, you would not have the freedom to teach your kids to be respectful. They would be taught whatever the regime saw fit.

Yes, governments have done appalling things, no doubt about it. It's not long since we had a Prime Minister take our country into an illegal war. But that doesn't mean the country is worthless - only that we should try harder to keep it safe and free from corruption, whether internal or external.

Of course this country isn't worthless! None of the many countries that we have lived in have been worthless either. I want my children to respect and love people, all people, not some artificial construct.

England has never done hand on breast fighting back a manly tear patriotism. Much more understated and shambolic.

This idea of singing the national anthem in school is a cynical political sop to Middle Englanders tending to lean towards UKIP. And rather repulsive. And very unEnglish.

No I woukdent mind it! What's the fuss. I know in some countries they sing the National Anthem before school. Would rather that, Than Slim Shady or Gangham Style.