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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to ask to collect my dd when she wets herself

85 replies

Itsjustmeagain · 15/10/2014 13:05

dd (4) has had trouble settling into reception, I have posted many times about it (so sorry for another one!) but she wets herself multiple times daily especially when she is anxious (which she is more often at school than home)

It has got to the point now where she is coming home very sore because obviously the school just don't have the facilities to deal with it to this extent.

We have a referral to the hospital from our gp but we have been told that it will take some time to come through and at the moment since its pretty much under control at home and both dh and I and the school have tried everything all we can do is wait.

I want to ask the teacher that if (when) she wets herself the school call me and I collect her to bring her home and wash her and change her properly I feel like it is not fair to keep her in school when she is sore and smelly (even with changing she still needs a wash).

AIBU to ask this I really cant decide if I am.

She only turned 4 in August so I cant decide if I am just being precious. She is my 4th child and the only one to have had problems like this.

OP posts:

MrsCakesPrecognition · 15/10/2014 13:35

Have you tried getting in touch with www.eric.org.uk? They have lots of advice and resources for parents coping with continence issues and they might be able to suggest some new ideas for handling your situation.

BarbarianMum · 15/10/2014 13:36

You can insist on part time until Easter or no attendance at all til Easter (after which she would need to start full time or would lose her place). They cannot say no pull ups and they can bloody well make suitable arrangements to change her properly, if that's what she needs. That's the law.

Original poster

Itsjustmeagain · 15/10/2014 13:38

Its - I send in a bag of clothes every day she gets changed as soon as anyone notices she is wet but she tries to hide it as long as possible and that is where the soreness comes in I think. I don't actually know why she is wetting herself. If you ask she just says " I didn't know I needed the toilet".

Isancerre - She was exactly the same at nursery, she was at nursery full time because I was working but by Christmas last year things at nursery were so bad I had to cut my hours to part time and then in May she had to leave altogether and I now only work very part time hours from home - I was going to go back more hours when she was in school but at the moment I feel like she needs me here. (luckily I work for DH and so it has been ok). If I took her out she wouldn't go to nursery she would just stay with me (and younger dd) at home.

OP posts:

hairygodmother · 15/10/2014 13:39

Well, that's what I meant really, that if her mum was there, she'd be able to change her more effectively than a 4 year old would be able to manage by herself under supervision. Rather than waiting until the end of the day. But I was in quite a small school, it might not be practical in a larger one.

Littlefish · 15/10/2014 13:39

It's just me - I would arrange to go and see the head and SENCO together. Your dd has been referred for medical investigations, it's not just a case of her trying harder. It is, however, a case of the school needing to try harder!

You can insist on part-time attendance - again, I would suggest you speak to the admissions team at your local authority so that you can quote the correct part of the admissions code. At my school, in a case such as yours, it would certainly be supported as long as your dd has a regular pattern of daily attendance - eg every morning. However, we would also be trying everything possible first to see if we could resolve the issue.

Saying they don't have changing facilities is a cop-out. If your dd is in pull-ups, the presumably she can just take them off herself and give them to a TA to have them put in a nappy sack.

Does she get sore in a pull up, or would it be adequate for the pull up to be changed at break time and lunch time. E.g 10.30 and 1.00?

moaningminnie2 · 15/10/2014 13:39

If she can stay dry at home then it would seem the problem is behavioural rather than physical.
You need to get to the bottom of sorting out what the problems are at school, otherwise she'll just piss herself every time she wants to come home.

Shelby2010 · 15/10/2014 13:40

I would suggest a pull-up under her pants and then you go in at lunchtime to clean her with wipes & re-apply barrier cream. Also get the teacher/TA to make sure she is actually going to the toilet regularly while she is at school. Maybe she is nervous about using the school toilets?

Littlefish · 15/10/2014 13:40

Barbarian said it much more succinctly than me!

NoMarymary · 15/10/2014 13:41

I don't think you have a choice about deferring for a year and going into year 1. She's clearly not ready and you are just adding to her stress by insisting she stays there. She will still manage in year 1 although I sympathise with the school place issue.

thegreylady · 15/10/2014 13:42

Could she not manage pullups herself? You could give her a carrier bag for used ones and a supply of clean ones. Surely her teacher would put the wet ones in the bin for her.

ChippingInLatteLover · 15/10/2014 13:42

I would apply for a deferral to start Reception next year. They can do it now.

Original poster

Itsjustmeagain · 15/10/2014 13:43

moaning - I think she is only dry at home because I physically take her to the toilet every 30 minutes not because she is correctly using the toilet. I went away on the weekend and she had numerous accidents because dh is not used to it and expected her to remember to go alone.

OP posts:

Littlefish · 15/10/2014 13:43

Mary - parents have the right to request that their summer born child enter school in reception the following year. The Headteacher then has the final say so. If the place is deferred for a summer born child, they do not have to go straight to year 1, they can start in Reception the following year. All schools should be aware of this, but sadly, many still aren't.

waithorse · 15/10/2014 13:48

I'd honestly take her out and try school again next year. Good luck.

KatherinaMinola · 15/10/2014 13:48

What BarbarianMum said. You can send her at Easter (or only send p/t until Easter) and not lose your place. (She would only have a term in Reception if you deferred until Easter, of course).

You can absolutely insist on this - it is the law. It is also the law that the school must take proper care of your daughter while she is there (including toileting needs if she has continence issues - which is perfectly reasonable and commonplace at just turned four).

spiderlight · 15/10/2014 13:49

Could you work with the school to set up some sort of system of reminders at regular intervals so she remembers to go to the loo? We had to do this with DS in Reception because he was hanging on all day and ending up with tummy-ache and the TA was brilliant about it and helped us to resolve it very quickly. I know they have thirty kids to deal with, but surely a TA whizzing her to the loo once an hour, say, would be quicker and less disruptive than having to be out of the classroom for the time it takes to change her? At least then she would be meeting some of her anxiety triggers with an empty bladder, which might help to break the cycle.

insancerre · 15/10/2014 13:49

I wonder if it is just a developmental thing
If she is relying in a grown up to take her to the toilet then she is not really toilet trained
I would advise to stop taking her and let her learn to recognise for herself when she needs to go. I just think she hasn't quite worked it out yet

Starting school has just added to her anxiety. She needs a break from school when hopefully she will become confident at going to the toilet herself.
Then she can start back at school

Original poster

Itsjustmeagain · 15/10/2014 13:49

Ok so my plan! Today I am going to ask again for a meeting but this time with other staff not just the class teacher. I am going to ask about part time and possibly pull ups. Tonight I am going to talk to dh again about withdrawing her either until Easter or in general and what the plan would be for that.

OP posts:

Nanny0gg · 15/10/2014 13:51

Why don't you put her in pull-ups? It's not that unusual.

There should also be a care plan in place.

Shelby2010 · 15/10/2014 13:54

Reading your further posts it's sounds like she never actually became toilet trained, you're just making sure her bladder is always empty. How long until the hospital referral comes through? I'm surprised that her nursery didn't help you get a better handle on this as they must be used to toileting issues. It doesn't sound that it is particularly related to her being anxious at school though, just that they aren't being much help.

I think I'd be inclined to just tell the teacher that it is a medical issue & she WILL be using pull-ups. If you send her in one in the morning & change it at lunchtime would that be enough to get her through the day?

Embolio · 15/10/2014 14:00

My son is young in the year (but not yet school age). I think in this situation I would be taking your dd out of school and trying to defer until next year, or at least until easter - if the wetting is anxiety related/behavioural it suggests to me she's just not ready. Personally I would take the risk of losing the place. The school don't sound very supportive in any case.

Original poster

Itsjustmeagain · 15/10/2014 14:00

Shelby - I don't think she has ever been toilet trained for wees - she has used the toilet for poos perfectly since just after her second birthday, she never has any pooing accidents even at night she will wake up to go and use the toilet just the weeing seems to be totally out of her control.

I have taken her to the doctor numerous times, each time they rule out an infection and say she will grow out of it or suggest a sticker chart (as though I have already tried that!). Finally the last time they said that since the school is now an issue they will refer us. I have no idea how long it will take the doctor said we should get an appointment in the next few weeks but who knows when the appointment will actually be!.

The nursery were fine at first but as each thing failed she got more and more upset day and tbh the day I went to get her and she was sitting wet crying in a corner while the staff ignored her I decided she wasn't going back. She was fine over Summer (we have a system in the house of going every 30 minutes - any longer than that and she will wet - even an hour is too long). The as soon as she started school the problems started again.

OP posts:

TheresLotsOfFarmyardAnimals · 15/10/2014 14:06

From your last post it sounds as though the habit of you taking her every 30 minutes at home needs to be broken. She essentially needs to get to know when she needs to wee and by being taken every 30 minutes when she's at home, this isn't happening.

Could be worth a try? The relationship between feeling the need to wee and then going to the loo needs to happen.

WowserBowser · 15/10/2014 14:11

Oh poor little sod. Hope you get the help you need to sort it quickly.

and for dd

for you.

makeminered · 15/10/2014 14:13

This needs to treated the same as any medical issue. They would not be telling a child with diabetes that they must try harder.
At your meeting tell them that she has been referred and that a care plan needs to be put into place. They may refuse to do that until she has an official diagnosis but then I think you can insist on pull ups and part time until then - at least until Easter.

I also think you are not helping by taking her every 30 minutes at home. She is never having to learn the signals because she goes before they happen. Perhaps lots of reminders but she makes the decision when she needs to go? Praise and rewards when she does get there in time? If this is successful can the school do similar?

I've heard that the support group mentioned above is very good.

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