To think pre-paid benefits cards are a stigmatizing, punitive scheme?

[ArsenicFaceCream]

Just announced at the Conservative Party conference.

They will initially be 'voluntary' for claimants with addiction issues, apparently.

But of course the intention is to roll it out.

Universal Credit is going national in February so this could get interesting, given that UC will be paid to working claimants as well as those not working.

Chance would be a fine thing Badvoc

There is a long list of things that people might need to pay for that won't necessarily be covered. Small sums to schools crop up all the time, even for the unemployed who could claim free school meals. Public transport. Will white goods be available? A lot of people afford such things via caralogue, paying on installments....

I really don't think this has been thought through.

Vivienne it has been tried out, on asylum seekers, and was such a resounding failure that it was dropped, even though it only affected people with no vote.

An estimated one in 15 working-age benefit claimants in England suffer from addiction to opiates, such as crack-cocaine and heroin, while an estimated one in 25 working-age benefit claimants are suffering from alcohol dependency

/\ From the bbc article.

I'm surprised at that, Id be interested in how those figures were estimated and by who.

YANBU. I can also imagine them rolling it out to all benefit claimants. The article says it won't apply to pensioners and disabled claimants, but its a bit ambiguous I think;

The scheme will be initially piloted on a voluntary basis and will be targeted on those with addiction problems

Does that mean the pilot will be targeted on those with addictions, or the whole scheme?

It doesn't need thinking through, Arsenic.

It punishes the poor and guarantees that benefits will be channelled through "participating stores" eg Tescos.

What's not to like?

Vivienne it has been tried out, on asylum seekers, and was such a resounding failure that it was dropped, even though it only affected people with no vote.

Of course.

The asylum seekers voucher scheme was sold to stores as "Keep the change".

Which is exactly what it sounded like.

Your tax money, straight to pocket of supermarket, without actually buying anything for asylum seeker.

Exactly arsenic, or buy stuff of Facebook sites & eBay vastly cheaper than most 'proper' shops - I just got 2 books for my course for less than a fiver for both, brand new they would have cost £20+ each which I can't afford - stupid idea but then those making these things up aren't the ones that will have to live with it, pisses me off!

What about petrol, car tax, car insurance? Or will car ownership be verboten until you find a new job? How's that going to work in rural areas? What about parking meters?

Gas, electricity, water and content insurance for that matter?

What if a claimant wants to buy a second hand book or a brand new revise guide for their child? Or pay a small library fine?

Mind-boggling. And they are trialling it from today with no previous mention? This will go well.

I think its a dreadful idea, i remenber when i was at school, kids who had free dinners had different cards than those paying, my friend went without most days as she was too embarrassed to use it, perhaps things have changed a bit now and tbe benefits stigma is not so prevalent, but still makes me shudder and feel sad when i think of those times, lets move forward not back.

Couldn't agree more extreme.

You're kidding Pausing!?

Given the trouble people already report on MN with supermarkets' ahem, individual... interpretations of what fruit & veg vouchers can be spent on, the scope for abuse here by "participating stores" is immense.

I thought it was just for food/heating, is it not?

It doesn't need thinking through, Arsenic.

It punishes the poor and guarantees that benefits will be channelled through "participating stores" eg Tescos.

What's not to like?

Okay, it's evil and badly implemented. But good, I hope it does result in chaos, ridicule and a rash of bad press at trial stage. Just, please god, no tragedies.

Wardrobe no cash will be paid.

No kidding, Arsenic, I paid out of my own pocket for the guy in front of me once, because the cashier was saying his food was a lot less than the voucher value and he should buy more. And he clearly didn't understand English.

I'd read about it, so realised what was happening. And thought, better from my pocket directly, than from everyone's pocket straight to supermarket profit.

I think the foodbanks will be needing extra donations.

It's a terrible idea and won't work. There are a lot of asylum seekers in the city where I live and they have been given these cards for quite some time. You could use them in supermarkets etc but not on fags or booze.

It didn't stop them getting drink and fags though, they just sold on the cards to other people for less than face value. My area used to be awash with the cards and people would buy them because you could use them to get a £50 shop at Tesco and only pay £30.00.

Same thing will happen here. I suspect it may also lead to a rise in crime as people will get the money somehow if they're addicted. I also don't begrudge someone on benefits having a couple of beers at home on a Friday, booze is so cheap in supermarkets it shouldn't mean that they or their children miss out on essentials.

The kind of family who would by booze or fags instead of feeding their kids would have far deeper problems and this wouldn't fix them, they should be dealt with by social services.

I don't know why we don't the pretence and vote for big businesess instead of political parties. At least we'd know what we were getting.

you could see them rolling it out to people with junk food addiction....

I could do with a card like that that stopped me buying crap food that tastes lovely.

Babiecakes, the amount of travel to "participating stores" was exactly one of the problems with asylum seeker vouchers.

It also denudes the local economy of earnings, because local independents can't afford the start-up costs, delays redeeming vouchers, and general extra admin.

Never mind all the small payments everyone's mentioned - I'm disabled and pay the window cleaner to help me move plant pots occasionally. Home hairdresser. All that small stuff.

Arsenic... Thanks, that patently won't work then. A card for heating/food would have been great in my mum's time (dad a gambler). I thought the card was just for that. Agree that it's a bad idea then.

What a croc - if the torys gave a shit about people with addiction issues they'd be funding treatment and social support. Bollocks do they believe it'll 'help' anyone. They know damn well all it'll do is prompt a black market and drive people to crime when they have no way of getting hold of cash to buy a fix of whatever it is they're addicted to.

Which is great for the continuing campaign of 'let's hate anyone who isn't perfect'.

I'm practically fucking spitting to hear this crap trotted out again. Centuries of social inequality have already proved denial of basic rights and needs does sweet fuck all and creates a slum class of disease and fucking misery.

Perhaps if they weren't busy comparing their bow tied cocks they could have a fucking look at the world around them and realise what absolute fucking tools they really are.

Don't even get me started on the transparent desire to firmly put every one who isn't them or able to provide any connections for them in their fucking place.

Rrrrr