to think no one should own land and ignore a sign saying private woods

[mls3]

Ok o will probably get flamed here.

But there is a badly managed woods near me with am old broken sign that say private woods. Aibu to collect a few broken branches for the wood burner? I know it is stealing, but this woods is overgrown and I'm thinking how unethical it is for anyone to own land.

Land used to all be free, until someone carved it all up to hoard for themselves. If land was still free now maybe we wouldn't have to all be working such stupid hours wasting our lives doing a job we don't like.

The Keeper has not accepted a non domino titles without extensive evidence of occupation for the prescriptive period, openly, peaceably and without judicial interruption for many years.

an a non domino title presented as part of the prescription progress in an application for registration was always subject to checks, and it was normal for indemnity to be excluded. However, most titles were presented in the Sasine register as they were for no consideration and therefore did not induce registration. However, a title presented and recorded in the Sasine Register and then allowing the prescriptive period to run did give a valid title that could then be supported by affidavits averting peaceable occupation for the prescriptive period. This could then be used in an application for registration. If the true proprietor then emerged the title could not be rectified without the consent of the proprietor in possession in terms of the 1979 Act, which was clearly not going to happen.

This represents one of the binaural inaccuracies which the 2012 Act will sort.

The Keeper accepted a non domino titles in the format A to B until relatively recently. I was called as an expert witness in a court challenge to one about 12 years' ago where the pursuers were challenging it just before the 10 year prescriptive period had run out. The title was accepted on the Record with no investigation but as the applicant was challenged before prescription had run his title was not perfected by occupation.

A non domino titles were in every case I've come across granted for no consideration to allow them to go in the Sasine register not the Land Register so talking of " scrutiny " and "exclusion of indemnity" is completely irrelevant.

In the case I refer to the a non domino title had been granted by the applicant's wife to her husband. A title by the applicant to the applicant would never have been an effective deed for prescription to run on.

That is possibly the case that resulted in the Keepers change of policy re a non domino disps.

12 years ago is quite a long time when you consider the period registration has been running for.

If you care to scrutinise the Land Register you will find examples of a non domino disps that were previously accepted as voluntary registrations, allowable under the Keepers discretion. It was not unusual for these to be accepted back in the 80s. I saw one during a title search on Friday.

Oh and it sounds as if the case you were involved in was a perfect example of binaural inaccuracy. As an expert witness you will be well aware that the 1979 Act would not permit rectification where the proprietor in possession did not consent and that therefore a court decree was required.

bijural

No it wasn't the case. The ones that made the Keeper change his mind were ones involving blatant fraud and often involving houses. My case was a piece of land in the countryside which to be fair to the applicant probably did look as if it had been abandoned. It was only discovered when the estate chartularies were updated and the estate mapped by a private title researcher.

12 years is nothing when you consider how long the Sasine system was running.

The case I was involved in involved a Sasine title so rectification of the Register and the 1979 Act was not relevant. It settled out of court on the basis the applicant granted a reconveyance to the real owner.

I bring home sticks to the light the fire nearly every day in winter.I don't regard this as stealing.Simliarly picking blackberries and other hedgerow foraging isn't stealing either.

Your knowledge about the Keepers policies suggests you worked at Meadowbank House.

Flicktuck - I bring home sticks to the light the fire nearly every day in winter.I don't regard this as stealing.Simliarly picking blackberries and other hedgerow foraging isn't stealing either

Yes it is, if the land has been clearly labelled or sign-posted as PRIVATE PROPERTY. If it is clearly labelled as PRIVATE PROPERTY, then picking fruit, foraging and collecting sticks that don't belong to you is, actually STEALING!!!!!
Have you read the thread, out of interest?? Just because you, personally don't "regard" it as stealing, doesn't necessarily mean you are actually correct, because it actually is! If the land is privately owned, as per the OP.

Yes it's stealing in English law too (and I am sure Scottish law). If people pick the blackberries on my hedge which were just about the heaviest crop I can remember I doubt I would report them to the police (although I have been picking them and eating them a lot this year) but it is theft just as much as if someone came in through your open kitchen door and took a piece of steak out of your fridge.

Now, I was under the impression that picking mushrooms and blackberries and other wild fruits counts as foraging and is not stealing, whereas picking up firewood is stealing.

There was a link to a Daily Telegraph article upthread which I think said that, but something more authoritative would be welcome.

Before you head out into the wilderness, remember to check whether the land you are foraging on is protected, and whether it is public – get permission if it isn’t. Always follow the country code and don’t overharvest: birds and animals depend on wild foods for their survival.

^^ The above taken from "The Ecologist" website.

I think, generally speaking, an area designated as a public space is safe to forage from (if done in a reasonable manner), foraging on private land is a definite no-no, unless you first seek permission.

Just own your shit and admit it's stealing.

I don't think anyone would really care that you stole a few branches, but let's not dress is up and try to make a moral crusade over scrap wood.

If it's private land it is not allowed to take anything from it (that would be stealing) just as no one can come into my garden and take a bench or seat or pick my fruits.

If it is public land then as people say there may be different rules.

hahaha really

'officer I would like to report the theft of some blackberries' mn is a parallel universe it really is.

yanbu op

Its just a few twigs that would rot anyway.

Though luck, OP the Landowner already knows that you've been trespassing & stealing. So expect a Sols letter within the next week or so, asking WARNING you to stay away from & off the property in question OR ELSE!.

OP...I don't think you realise the amount of power/clout that landowners' have, when comes to protecting their stuff.

I'm going out on a limb with the following:-

So is it a naice village you're living in? Lived there long? & have you complained about the smells & sounds (like the church bells/clock chiming every 15 mins.) yet?.

Please be careful op. By us, many woodlands that look run-down are actually pheasant hatcheries.
The grouse, duck & partridge season has started & at the beginning of October the pheasant season starts. Take care, you don't want to end up getting shot for a bit of kindling.

Lots of old English sayings come from this kind of thing - might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb and far too many people jailed for stealing one loaf of bread etc. Although i agree that it is unlikely most landowners (other than allotment holders and those with a small garden) would prosecute someone on a public footpath stealing blackberries.

Tobysmum - I do take your point that the police aren't likely to get too excited about the theft of a few blackberries - but they might take a view on trespass, if someone had had to go onto private land to pick those blackberries.

If, as Greengrow is suggesting, they can be picked from a public footpath, I think that might not be theft at all - if something overhangs the public footpath, it can be cut back by either the council or (if I am correct in what I am thinking) by anyone - for example, if the blackberries we are discussing were spreading over the path and causing a hazard, anyone could cut them back - and by the same principle, would they not be able to pick the blackberries?

If my neighbour were growing fruit, and some of the plant came over/through my fence into my garden, I think I am right in saying that I could cut it back, and, by extension, I could pick the fruit that overhung my garden.

can police arrest for a civil offence these days?

(genuine q, I know the lines between civil and criminal offences get blurrier and blurrier)

(that refers to the idea that police might be interested in trespass btw)

On over growing branches if a neighbour's branches in English law come into your garden you have a right to cut them off but the law is clear that the neighbour owns the wood and you cannot take it and burn it - you need to return it to them if they want it.

Trespass is not a criminal offence. Criminal damage is which could be burning a fire on private land I suppose. The police will prosecute if there might be a breach of the peace - so a typical landowner red faced approaching you with his stick - you caught red handed stealing his crops, police called. There will be a lot of case law on this based on what hunt sabateurs do on private land when following hunts with cameras and the RSPCA.

I really don't think people should worry about picking a few blackberries as they walk along even if it is private land but do check. Some landowners might have sprayed with a poison for example. be very careful with mushrooms. 2 people in Scotland a famous musician I think it was ate some gathered whilst out and I think they both were on kidney dialysis for life. It was very very serious.