to want to never do anything for my 2 dc ever ever again. Inc no dinner tonight.

[staples]

So 2 dc started a sports club (last year) (at their begging). Costs quite a bit annual fee. I took them most times in the beginning because I had an appointment in that direction so it fit well time/route. I no longer have this appointment and they (14 and 15) are more than capable of going on the bus.

They haven't been for ages (summer holidays, clashes etc). dc1 had major tantrum last week about getting bus. He didn't go. He is angry about having to get bus cos it's longer. I explain why should I drive him, sit around for 1.5 hours and drive him back just to save him say 20 minutes?

So, this week, same again, except both dc having this tantrum. Ds2 usually gets grumpy but once he's used to the idea is all smiles and ok. Not this week. Ds1 however really massive tantrum inc throwing his sports stuff all over the entrance floor (and leaving it there so the entire entrance is covered in his crap.

I suppose at least they went.

but I am so angry they expect me to run around after them. Maybe I have been too soft/a bit of a mug. I don't think I've been that bad, truly. I wouldn't describe myself as a doormat at all. They have to help out and do jobs. It's just, like in this example, it was no real inconvenience for me to take them, now it is, and they are TANTRUMMING and genuinely seem to think I should give up 3 hours of my time to save them a bus journey which isn't much longer than the car journey.

So how do I respond, other than murder. I feel so angry. I can't even think of any consequence - confiscating phone is just nightmare for me as often need to get hold of them. Tried changing wifi password but that was just a total pita for me coven the tv is on it and spent the entire bloody evening last time cos the router went funny. And the printer still isn't happy. Fuming at the total lack of respect and outright anger and fury they thought it was ok to dish out to me. I want to really stamp this out.

I wouldn't take them, they have to learn how to get themselves around. FWIW I used to drop DS off at youth club because it was on the same night as DDs Brownies. It was convenient for me so he got a lift. It doesn't suit this year so he's taking the train/bus. If he wants a lift anywhere then it has to suit me or be up to me. Any huffing or bad behaviour means no lift. However I forsee it biting me on the bum when he gets his droving licence and I want to go out for a glass of wine

Driving...

In response to only taking them when it suited me. well, it never really suited me s such. It meant I had to leave earlier, go (slightly) out of my way there, and back but it was roughly on the way to my appt so I offered as I was going that way. And I deliberately timed the appt (for ds) to coincide. Now ds has chosen to attend his appt another day so that he can go to the sport, but he still wants me to drive him even though I no longer need to iyswim

YANBU at all OP

I'm currently doing nothing apart from food and picking up from school for one of my 13yr olds.

I wouldn't cook for them tonight, and I wouldn't engage with them beyond telling them calmly that their behaviour was outrageous and that there will be consequences.

Maybe tomorrow, when everyone's calmer, you could initiate a discussion about how it's going to work.

Perhaps they want to drop it but feel guilty about how much money has been spent on this activity so far?

Perhaps there's a genuine reason why they don't want to catch the bus? DS once had a tantrum in similar circumstances but it turned out there was a crowd of kids on the bus that were giving him a hard time at school (just a thought since they were pushing for train tickets so presumably weren't completely reluctant to make their own way there).

Depending on their response to this situation, I personally would be willing to negotiate - a lift one way or every other week.

Ask them what they suggest as a solution to your dilemma with the younger child and cooking dinner. They are old enough to think about it - they might surprise you with their ideas!

Wow - no wonder you are livid. They sound like toddlers. A tantrum because they are tired/hungry? REALLY? Collect up sports stuff from all over the floor and bin it. Tell them calmly that you will not be engaging in any more discussion of the lift issue, and that you will monitor the situation for the next 4 weeks. If they go to the (very expensive) activity that they begged to do under their own steam without behaving like selfish babies they can keep doing it. If they don't, cancel it. Sell the sports equipment to go towards the cost and charge them for the rest.

I can't believe people are suggesting that you reward this kind of behaviour by caving in and taking them!

I don't think I could bear not to make food for dc that had been at school and club all day, however awful they had been. Chucking stuff around, shouting, refusing to listen to reasonable arguments looks ridiculous in child of that age but it's also a pretty normal teen response to frustration and it's important not to descend to that level yourself.

Your reasons for not wanting to drive them are perfectly valid so I would calmly tell them that you won't be taking them any more and it's a condition of doing the club that they take they bus. End of conversation.

When I was that age: I walked to church and to choir practice, to judo club and to the shops. I walked to my friends' houses, up to say two miles, or took the 'bus. I took the 'bus into town or anywhere else I wanted to go (this was suburban London). I took the 'bus to school. I took the train if I wanted to go up to town. I only got a lift if I was going out into the serious boondocks and only then because I wasn't allowed a bicycle. When I went to work I took the 'bus or the train. When I went to Uni (70 miles) I took the train.

If I could do it so can they, assuming public transport is available and suitable.

You need to tell them straight. Calmly and cooly.

Theor behaviour is not acceptable. They are not childish beats, they are becoming Young men and should have some self control and self respect.

You are not their servant, you are their mother and deserve to be treated with respect.

If they cannot do this you will cancel the membership, even if you do not get any money back.

It's a privilege, not a right.

Be cold. Don't shout and throw the sports kit he threw all over the floor in the bin.

Tell them you expect an apology and do not cool their tea. They are old enough to make themselves s sandwich if they choose, but they better clan the kitchen up after themselves.

As a compromise, could you take them, drop them off and let them find their own way back? At least that way you know that they are actually attending the activity.

Alternatively, try turning it round on them. If they can prove that they are mature enough to travel independently to the activity then maybe (just maybe) they might also be proving themselves mature enough to handle [enter desirable teen activity here]...but of course if they aren't capable and you need to look after them like they are still at primary school, well you are going to have to treat them like 10 year olds the rest of the time too.

Come down like a tonne of bricks OP. That would be my advice. My mum didn't; similar scenario to you and my brothers are just completely dismissive and unappreciative of anything she does/did for them. They don't even remember that she did the things that you're saying you do too.

Why do you need to contact the boys so often? Do they really need phones? They would find a way to contact you if they needed to, surely? I wouldn't cook for them, I would give them a list of things they each need to do as part of the household and, if you cook something for yourself that doesn't mean that they get the benefit of it, unless you want them to. Definitely knock the idea of being servile to them right out of their heads (and yours).

I wouldn't cancel the sports activity, it's paid for so if they don't go they don't benefit from it but you'll never pay for it again. Definitely don't chauffeur them! It's not ice hockey, is it?

What does their dad say? Is he supportive of you?

Having grown up in a family where no one drove, jesus wept children today are spoiled arses sometimes! If I wanted to get somewhere I had to walk, get public transport or beg a lift from a friend. Either way, I sorted it out entirely by myself at that age.

So no, I wouldn't be offering lifts again, I wouldn't be cooking tea for them (plenty of toast/cereal available they can make themselves I'm sure), I'd sit them down calmly and say that they didn't have to do the activity if they didn't want to and that I would happily write off the money that had already been spent, but that I would not be paying for another activity ever, ever again. If they want to do anything from now on in then they will have to pay for it out of pocket money (if they get it) or any part time earnings they can scrape together. The lack of respect and fair treatment has just closed the bank of Mum & Dad! FeckTMD has it above - ice cold and emotionless is what you need.

I don't understand.

You have made your situation clear - you are NOT ferrying them to and from this sport.

End of.

This is the new reality. They have to get on with it and if you stand firm they probably will and hopefully you have had the last of tantrums. Don't think you need to punish further. Just make some nice plans for the time you now have when they are at sport - cinema? nice relaxing bath? mumsnet?

As predicted, ds2 comes bounding in, all smiles and is his usual sweet self, having totally forgotten any incident. I speak to him, confiscate his phone, he apologises. Feel satisfied with his response.

Ds1 follows in, all glowering. I ask for his phone. He slams it into my hand. I tell him I don't accept his disrespectful behaviour. Cue eye rolling, in his opinion he was "a little bit rude" and I, as usual totally overreact. He talks to me like a piece of shit. He ridicules me. and talks with such rudeness and contempt. Then tomorrow he'll say he's sorry and he was just so tired and give me a hug and be all nice. Then in 2 days it'll be the same all over.

Dh is supportive and strict.

Agree with doziedoozie, you are not ferrying them around, end of. No further discussion, no further action required. Stick to your guns & they will get the message.

Perhaps DH needs to sort out his 'glowering' son as well; show him that he can't behave like this towards either of you. Apologies if you're both doing that, you've only referred to the interaction between you and your sons on this thread so far.

Throwing things around is not typical teen response, silkchiffon. They try it once and once only in this house.
If it is the norm for some teens that's because they've been allowed to get away with it. You wouldn't allow a toddler to it, so why tolerate an older child behaving like that? It's highly intolerant, selfish and manipulative to try to hold a parent hostage by behaving like a spoilt brat.

Ds1 is sometimes a bit rude with dh but not as much and nowhere near the extent he is with me. Actually, ds2 and I have a pretty harmonious relationship, whereas ds2 and dh clash massively.

Ds1 loves to get a moody on, and let it drag on for hours, days. I keep trying to teach him (once he's come back down of his sulk mountain,) that he needs to be able to negotiate and resolve conflict much more maturely, to at least talk. It's also in his interest. He'll accept that once he's calmed down. Then it'll all go off again.

My parents live in the middle of nowhere - buses were every 2 hours to town where we went to school and so all our friends were there - it took an hour to do a 20min journey as it went through all the villages. Mostly I got the bus but if I had to come back after the last bus at 6pm I relied on lifts - but my parents chose where we lived and where we went to school so if we never had a lift we would never have done anything - totally different to living in a town or city though.

Good grief stop enabling them to such little shits. Have an adult conversation with them and say how their behaviour made you feel but you have now cancelled the sports club membership. If the phones are payg stop giving them credit, if they are contract then consider ending it.

My lovely MIL once told me 'we create the monsters our children are' and harsh but true. Lady up and stop this abuse.

Tbh if this is the only time they ask for a lift, I think I would be inclined to do it. Probably compromise on bus one way, lift the other, whichever is more convenient to you, then you don't need to hang around.

Probably not straight after this tantrum, but I'd probably negotiate it later, in return for babysitting or additional chores from them.

I was harsher earlier, but if this is the only lift requested, then I think that changes things a bit.

If it was requested, then that would be different. But this was demanded, which is entirely different.
Negotiation is a two wY street and it does not sound as if DS1 has the maturity or empathy to be see any point of view other than his own. Yes, he is still young but it is a worrying pattern of behaviour.

So what do you do about it KK? (improving empathy and maturity?

I am prepared to compromise on the bus. My concern is really for younger dc who would also have to come.

But the sheer contempt and arrogance of ds1 and the way he talks to me is astonishing.

OK question - I have confiscated his phone. He will ask for it back tomorrow. If fI carry on a punishment/confiscation for more than say a couple of days, especially if in the mean time he has apologised and is behaving well (he can be very very nice and polite and fun and helpful, but when he's annoyed it's pre rudeness and contempt), anyway, say he's behaving well, it's 3 days after the event, he has been helpful, polite blah blah, he asks for his phone back. I say no, he gets angry, I feel petty and bang, straight into another argument. So, how long to issue punishments that are effective and useful?

staples there's a 'teen' section in Parenting in case you hadn't noticed it - can be quite helpful.

Personally I wouldn't compromise on the bus thing as you are sending out mixed messages.

Despite what other posters seem to suggest your ds1 behaviour sounds very normal for a teen. That doesn't mean you have to tolerate any of it but it seems unrealistic to expect to find some punishment or method that will transform him permanently.