To think its ok to tell voters that businesses will move south if its a yes?

[Loopylala7]

If these businesses do intend to shift south of the border if its a yes, shouldn't the voters know this is a possible outcome? Why is it considered unfair for this information to be out? Can somebody please explain? Am I being a bit dense?

They may as well tell their employees vote 'no' or we'll sack you. I've seen this in the US where employers have ordered their employees to attend political meetings and have instructed them how to vote.

I think the media reporting on the referendum stinks too. The press has portrayed 'yes' voters as drunken scumbags who hate the English. The news channels gave extensive coverage to the visit from Cameron and pals and to all the businesses threatening to leave. They barely mentioned Nigel Farage and the Orange Order.

Haha! I apologise I miss read your list old lady, but you have to admit it is an interesting article. I certainly wouldn't google those terms - thats a bit low for my tastes ;)

It's an interesting read indeed; ex-single mother who made her money writing (brilliant) books on someone else's leccy bill seeks to cut benefits to current single parents... I think she's probably a nice enough person, but her disconnect makes my teeth itch. Have you checked out Ian Taylor, Vitol, and Arkan yet?

Ok, Loopy, we had an xpost there; why would googling Ian Taylor, Vitol and Arkan be "a bit low for yours tastes"? Don't you want to know how your campaign is funded, and by whom? You started this thread by saying "voters should know", but you don't think they/we should know that?

Am I wrong but didn't thousands of people working in financial services lose their jobs not so long ago when Scotland was better together? Didn't many shop-workers also lose their jobs? Maybe I'm cynical but RBS and co. are probably planning to further downsize regardless of the referendum result. Those workers' salaries need to go so some chairman can buy himself a nice Morningside mansion with his bonus.

Yes, looks like they're all a bunch of crooks - but why oh why does it cost all that money to decide whether or not to separate a peaceful country? craziness, surely all this money would be better spent giving those single parents a boost?

When are you going to mention Ian Taylor, Vitol, and Arkan? (Hint, if you don't already know, Google it. I've suggested search terms.)

Jesus! When people talked about the UK becoming Balkanised in the case of independence I'd assumed it was a dig at the 'Yes' campaign. I didn't realise it was the 'Better Togethers' who had warlord credentials.

All what money? You're surely not suggesting that central gvt (which is supposed to represent, and advocate for, er, all UK citizens) has spent taxpayers money on the No vote?

Where were the Wm plans to alleviate the problems of lone parents published?

Nick, I'm really sorry if that upset you. It's a reality that needs to be known.

It's the 'Yes' campaigners who are being branded as intimidating thugs, but the 'No' campaign is getting away with having the white-collar thugs in banking, business and the media threaten and bully people into voting their way. It's a massive power imbalance.

OldLady

Oh no, it didn't upset me. The hypocrisy of the people talking of Balkanisation being in cahoots with Arkan of all people positively tickled me.

Ach, having a wee look into who is actually funding/benefiting from any given campaign, and why that might be important, is always a good thing. My eyes have certainly been opened during indyref discussions, and I was no naif before!

business threaten to leave the US all the time if they don't get their precious tax breaks. We've called their bluff a few times, and nothing has come of it.

AON, one of the largest if not the largest global Brooking House left the USA and moved to England 2/3 years ago. These are not just threats business do and can move.

Of course, businesses can and do "move elsewhere" whenever it suits them. But I fail to see the connection with a Yes vote. International companies already deal in diffenent currencies, different laws...

Frankly, I don't care if Scotland vote Yes or No. I was simply making the point that people should not be so naive as to think when global or any business says they will move to a different territory, that what they say are empty threats.

Sound point. But in Scotland, we have heard the same threats, from the same people, over decades... At which point do we stick our fingers in our ears and go "lalalala", and when do we finally Wake Up?

The same thing could be said in the US (AON as one example, the business rumour mill is that Marsh will follow suit), France and lots of other territories but it happens. So people can if they so wish choose to stick their fingers in the ears and go "la la la" till the wake up one day and their looking for new employment.

It's a very naive argument to say that the reality that these business will move is an empty threat. It's your country, your choice but people need to wake up to that reality.

If businesses are likely to move, then of course people should be told about it. The complaints about timing do seem like a diversionary tactic to me.

HSBC left Hong Kong because it feared turmoil as handover fom Britush control neared. So, yes banks really do move for political reasons to more stable location.

I'd find the BP report more worrying, plus of course Sillars response that SNP might seek to nationalise its Scottish operations.

Though the symbolism of the Royal Bank of Scotland taking its HQ out of Scotland (probably leaving not much more than retail banking) is unfortunate. Especially as it's a note issuer (but aren't the notes themselves printed in England?)

Will the Scots continue current note issuing arrangements? Or will they move towards a single central bank and issuer?

"Of course, businesses can and do "move elsewhere" whenever it suits them. But I fail to see the connection with a Yes vote. International companies already deal in diffenent currencies, different laws..."

I think it's to do with wanting to be backed by the Bank of England, not taking chances with a brand new and untested central bank (which may or may not have to use the euro (or even be in EU))

Bank of Scotland will also leave (part of Lloyds, who announced their move without anyone squabbling over manner of release).

To me it just smells of the establishment trying to scare people into voting no. Having said that I'm sure there will be some economic impact on all sides if it is a yes vote, I just don't believe it will be the doomsday scenario that is being painted by the NO side.

But I do think YABU, they are allowed to express their view. What I do think is wrong is the way the government launched the new "devo max" proposals with only 2 weeks to go - that was out of order and a bit desperate if you ask me.

I guess the reality is a lot of larger companies need to be inside the eu. If on the day Scotland finally leaves the uk, they join instantly the eu, then this would be fine, unfortunately, whatever the yes campaign say, the legal situation looks different.

At the point of a yes vote, businesses in Scotland have about a year before independence happens, so do they use that to move, or do they sit tight with confidence that salmond can deliver eu membership for them.

And yes, the financial institutions will have to move hq to the uk.

The reality is, iScotland will be ok in the long term, but it'll hurt in the very short term (say the first 2-3 years), and the mid-short term (first 10-15 years) they'll be worse off than if they were still in the uk, that doesn't mean financial melt down, just a bit poorer, fewer jobs about, less stable.

If you are in a position to ride out that first decade, then a yes vote might not be that bad.

Pretending it'll be smooth from day 1 might get more over to the yes vote, but when it bites, the SNP are going to be slaughtered in elections.

There doesn't seem to be a ground swell of "yes it'll hurt, but we want self determination" - people are more likely to accept cuts and unemployment if they know it is coming.

Long term, it'll be fine. Possibly even great. Short term, it'll hurt, admitting that isn't a bad thing.

I guess the reality is a lot of larger companies need to be inside the eu. If on the day Scotland finally leaves the uk, they join instantly the eu, then this would be fine, unfortunately, whatever the yes campaign say, the legal situation looks different.

At the point of a yes vote, businesses in Scotland have about a year before independence happens, so do they use that to move, or do they sit tight with confidence that salmond can deliver eu membership for them.

And yes, the financial institutions will have to move hq to the uk.

The reality is, iScotland will be ok in the long term, but it'll hurt in the very short term (say the first 2-3 years), and the mid-short term (first 10-15 years) they'll be worse off than if they were still in the uk, that doesn't mean financial melt down, just a bit poorer, fewer jobs about, less stable.

If you are in a position to ride out that first decade, then a yes vote might not be that bad.

Pretending it'll be smooth from day 1 might get more over to the yes vote, but when it bites, the SNP are going to be slaughtered in elections.

There doesn't seem to be a ground swell of "yes it'll hurt, but we want self determination" - people are more likely to accept cuts and unemployment if they know it is coming.

Long term, it'll be fine. Possibly even great. Short term, it'll hurt, admitting that isn't a bad thing.

I think all the facts should be on the table - such as - business moving south of the border.

I also think the English should be asked whether Westminster should keep on subsidising The Scots - this morning they seem to want our military etc.

look they have to move until scotland goes back into the EU if they decide to because they can't trade in the EU unless there head office is in the EU and as most of them have offices in london anyway simple answer is switch it all to london

We are also extremely concerned Roonerspism. We are in a similar position with my husband's job at least and you're not wrong about the property prices either. My father is currently putting his house on the market in Glasgow and the effects have already been seen there.

I just hope campaigners stay aware from the polling stations on the day (from both camps). Let people cast their vote in peace.