To ask how you'd feel if your midwife asked you this question?

[SeattleGraceMercyDeath]

I'm a midwife at a large unit currently going for BFI status and we have been instructed to ask all women regardless of their stated intentions if they want to give their baby a breastfeed.

So even if a woman comes in very clear in their mind that they want to bottle fees and for whatever reason they don't want to breastfeed we have to ignore that and ask them if they will offer a breastfeed instead.

I have had a heated debate with the breastfeeding coordinator as I refuse to do it as I feel it will undermine my relationship with the bottle feeding women I look after.

So if you have made the decision to bottlefeed how would you feel if your midwife ignored that information and instead asked you to give your baby a first breastfeed, would you as the coordinator feels, think that you might have your mind changed or would you think 'that midwife hasn't listened to a word I say' and feel under pressure or made to feel guilty.

I'm prepared to have my mind changed but it just feels so wrong to me!

I wouldn't have minded being asked although I do think you'd have to chose your words carefully.

I regret not trying to bf my 2nd dc.

I'd feel ignored and disrespected and it would make me question the rest of my relationship with that MW.

Even prefacing it with 'I'm really sorry, but I have to ask you this, even though you have juts told me X, Y and Z' would still hack me off. I would still question my relationship with the MW as it would point to the fact that she/he prioritising box ticking over treating me as an intelligent individual. On a wider level, it would make me question the service as a whole, for the same box ticking reasons.

Are other departments of the NHS allowed to nag patients who are also carers into complying? If someone's spouse (or Mil) was repeatedly ignoring their wishes re how to feed their baby, bullying and emotional abuse would be mentioned. I fed mine well into toddlerdom, and tandem fed, but I wouldn't have appreciated being nagged into it at a very vulnerable time. Especially if I wanted to resume taking meds I had stopped while carrying the child.

Problem is midwives will prioritise box ticking. Its a fact that if you don't tick all the boxes then you're disciplined. If you carry on then you're on supervised practice and risk being stripped of your registration.

It just needs to be a simple are you planning to breast feed or bottle feed..

I hated after I had ds, I wanted to breast feed, he couldn't latch at all I just wanted to get home but oh no I was not allowed to bottle I till I had then seen te breast feeding leader who then clearly pointed out that ds could not breast feed and I finally got given a bottle.. But I shouldn't of had to see her I asked to bottle feed in the end and that should of been it no forcing me to do anything else.

Amen to that Viva.

It wouldn't upset me at all if said sensitively and not forced on me. If a woman has already expressed her wish to ff isn't that question as good as asked?

Much less annoying than Bounty woman.

I wouldn't have been offended, but I would have said no. I wouldn't have done 'skin to skin' either .
Personally I think it would be better just to include this message info about the colostrum in a leaflet to be given to the woman during her pregnancy (along with all the other info), then she is free to make an informed choice.
Once I made the choice I expected it to be accepted by the midwife (and it was, in my case).

My DW had a similar experience to this when she had our twins early last year.

She was a little volatile after the birth (for her anyway - she's usually a very calm and considered woman). She felt henpecked into BF (she tried and had awful trouble so switched to formula). They kept on at her so she rang up a friend who is a director of the trust (DW is a consultant - albeit in a different area of the hospital) and kicked off a shitstorm.

Apparently the maternity dept have changed their policy now.

Don't mess with a hormonal woman.... but I learnt that years ago!

Why don't you just don't tick "yes" in all your boxes? Will your supervisors check the results?

Yep. They do random checks and do audits.

Anyone caught falsifying stuff would be in serious shit.

I have known people tick "no" boxes for smoking status without checking. They got caught.

I'm unable to breastfeed for medical reasons so it would really irritate me amd make me feel like my midwife hadn't even bothered looking at my medical notes.

So does your supervisor ask the same women AGAIN if they want to try BF? Even though they may have made their wishes quite clear?

We are supposed to offer assistance with a breastfeed irrespective of method of feeding. So for those women who actively want to formula feed then we have to ask if they want help with a breastfeed. These women are then approached by another member of staff, they are asked if we offered them a breastfeed (irrespective of how they want to feed) and that is then recorded, our notes are randomly audited all the time in our supervision meetings.

The levels of checking and double checking and auditing on this sort of stuff is unreal. Would make your head spin.

This auditing must impact relationships and take up valuable time that could be used for care. I wouldn't mind if the resources were there to provide good care. But they aren't.

It's all about meeting standards for accreditations and insurance. It's just another example of the paperwork being more important than the actual people we are supposed to be caring for. If it ain't written down then it's not been done.

Yep. Its at the stage now where you can have a woman distressed on the bed but you know if you concentrate on her you won't get the admission paperwork done. If you don't get the paperwork done youre investigated.

So what do you choose?

Well aside from the fact that HIV women can breastfeed if viral load is low, I haven't been in a situation where a woman is formula feeding through anything other than choice (since this all came in anyway). Tbh I'm using common sense and think that if I can justify why I have not done something, I am acting within the constraints of 'The Code' and can therefore protect myself.

I love being a midwife but all this politics and paperwork makes me want to run away screaming.

I think this is standard practice in Scotland, though they warn you you'll be asked post delivery throughout your care.

I changed my mind on the delivery bed and I'm probably not alone. Though I'd had an easy birth and wasn't exhausted / vulnerable so didn't mind being asked but I can't imagine that would always be the case.

If I ever had another baby, I would formula feed from day 1.

Ds I had a horrendous first 6 months and I still can't bear to look at his baby pictures because I can remember feeling so resentful to him because all I did was feed and feed and feed, with sore cracked nipples that bleed and boobs so big that my back hurt all the time.

Dd ( 2nd born) after 3 days gave up and felt really guilty I couldn't feed her my milk.

I feel like breastfeeding actually put a wedge between Ds and me, I think it wasn't until the hell that was breastfeeding and actually for the first time in 8ish months I had a proper sleep did I start the bonding process.

I would not like it if a MW which hardly knew me asked this so soon after giving birth to satisfy a box ticking exercise.

Tbh, I don't really get the strong objections to being asked. I do understand the objections to being pressurised into doing it.

If you have said you want/don't want the vitamin K injection in your birth plan,nod you then object to being asked about it,when it comes to the time to do it?
If you have said you want a totally natural birth and then when in serious pain, do you object to being asked if you would like to know about pain relief options?
If you said in your birth plan that your DH/DP didn't want to cut the cord, would you think it was odd if they just checked with you, when it came to it?

To me, being asked if you would like baby to be put to the breast,sounds like a very similar question. And clearly from this thread,some women DO change their mind and decide to,for whatever reason. Without making any judgements about feeding methods, surely it was good for them to have that option opened up to them, because it might have been much harder to do, if left until they were at home, alone.

The thing that is different to the examples I mention above, is that feeding is an on-going thing, rather than cutting the cord etc which is one off. And the fact is that given a number of opportunities to say 'yes' to the offer of help with breastfeeding more women will have a go. As long as there is the option to say 'no' then I think it is fine to be asked several times.

I'm not sure the answers on this thread are representative of all people who experience the Q. The midwife on here wanted to know how people would feel about it. Those who have replied frequently are those who have had very bad experiences of breast feeding and absolutely don't want to do it or think it harmed them. I'm not doubti g their strength of feeling or experience, but I think far more people who ff, are not nearly as aggrieved by being asked, but just say 'yes' or 'no' to the offer. And I think it is a mistake to decide not to ask the Q about breastfeeding and to offer help, because there is a fear that a few people might be offended.

So, I agree it is a shame if it is all a tick boxing exercise. And I agree that people should not be pressurised. However, I don't agree that simply being asked the question several times is a problem.