Can I ask those of you who would refuse a male nurse

[Thefishewife]

Just wanted to know really why those who would refuse a male nurse would at the same time accpect a male

Athisisitst
Surgon
Surb nurse
Jr doctor
Odp

Afte much chat about this on here I was telling oh about this who is a male nurse and he told me about a lady who didn't want a male nurse as which is her right but then went on to be examined by the male jr doctor and then the male consultant and operated on her and quite frankly saw more the oh ever would as he just wanted to take obs the scrub nurse was male saw also saw the lady half naked I would imagin

It wasn't a emergancy op btw

I just have always found this very very strange

LeBearPolar - people don't have issues with opposite gender HCPS because they have gender prejudice. That's not what it's about at all, so it cannot be compared with you as a teacher.

I know that now picandminx but could you go back in time and tell my 22year old self that! I thought I was in the wrong to feel odd about it, but I know better now. Luckily she was very nice and not the mouthy mum of someone I used to go to school with other one.

Have scan read posts so apologies if this has been said before. Many years ago when working in a Maternity Unit a colleague "came out" and said she was a lesbian. The backlash was awful. Why can't people realise that caring is not a sexual turn on!

I can assure you all holding a man's penis is not sexy

It's odd that those claiming this is some sort of irrational prejudice haven't mentioned that mixed sex wards are now banned as they were hugely unpopular with patients.

When a male paramedic came in when I was giving birth to DS, it stressed me out a lot and the labour slowed. Nothing I could do about it.

However, I had a male gynaecologist when I had my colposcopy and subsequent treatment a couple of years later, and he was the kindest, sweetest man you could imagine. He was of Indian extraction, and we chatted about food and he told me about his family, and put his arm around me when I cried. He was lovely.

Sometimes, you just can't help it and your body wants what it wants.

It should always be about the individual requirements, needs and wishes of the patient whether female or male - it's not sexist, it's about personal boundaries which, where possible, should always be respected.

However, on a general level, the fact that so many women don't want male nurses is shit for the feminist cause, particularly in relation to gender roles in the workplace.

Most, if not all, male nurses and ODPs that I know wouldn't even be slightly offended if a female patient had a preference for female staff. Offering personal, intimate care to people is not like any other job in my opinion and cant be compared to other jobs in terms of sex discrimination.

LPolarBear... I suppose it depends if they've been raped, abused or assaulted by someone like you and you're aiming to do something intimate to them which might trigger severe stress reactions, doesn't it? That's what I'm talking about here.

Unless you're suggesting that I and women who have been through similar circumstances should just suck it up, have a male nurse when it makes us not just uncomfortable, but unable to continue with the procedure, simply because they might go home have a moan and their friend feel sad for them?

If the boys in your class's family felt strongly enough about their son not being taught by a woman, they could quite reasonably for them remove him from your class. In the same way as I would remove myself from any intimate procedure where it was going to be performed by a male nurse.

I had double pneumonia Once I came down with it after I had to have a late termination, I was so ill I thought I was going to die to be honest.

I remember being in a holding ward off of A&E waiting for a bed, I was still bleeding heavily from the op and couldn't breath so was on oxygen. My mum had popped out for a minute and an elderly male consultant came in with a few male students to see me.
I couldn't move to let him examine me, so he took hold of my gown at the shoulders and pulled it down to my waist and exposed me completely. I had never been so humiliated in my life and was so helpless I couldn't do anything. They then all stood there discussing me like I wasn't there.

Who I was up on the ward I had a lovely male nurse called Andy who was married with kids. He had to come and get me out of the bath because I was so weak, I'll always remember his kindness and his being male had no baring on his care for me.

I will have and have had a panic attack if/when a man physically examines me, even non intimately. I'm fine with one watching or someone doing it while I'm unconscious as logically I know I'm okay but that doesn't help me one bit. Most of the men I've dealt with have been nothing but considerate and sensitive.

For me, it wouldn't be anything to do with him being a nurse - I have, and probably always will, refuse male doctors/midwives/nurses/HCAs doing anything 'intimate' - I just don't feel comfortable with a man doing that, probably because of past sexual abuse. I'd be as happy with a male nurse as a female one for anything else - then it would be all about how good they were rather than anything else, but for intimate care, I couldn't bear a man.

I'm disabled and from a teen and probably younger I've had it drilled into me that male carers do not help you to the loo or the shower or to get dressed unless they are family. The message was it's not appropriate and it was implied it's not safe which now I know isn't true. But i think because of that conditioning I may, if I ended up in hospital, find it difficult to accept a male nurse helping with those tasks - I'd be fine with other stuff like dressing changes from male nurses and definitely with being examined by male doctors though.

"However, on a general level, the fact that so many women don't want male nurses is shit for the feminist cause, particularly in relation to gender roles in the workplace"

Bloomin - ha! Have you ever heard of the Glass Escalator? Male nurses are far from disadvantaged.

Also, IMHO any feminist cause which involves trampling over what women actually want isn't really feminist.

Telling women that their feelings and wishes are silly and irrational sounds more like chauvinism then feminism.

well I have worked a decade in healthcare and THANKFULLY have not come across many male nurses that share the same sentiments of some of those mentioned on this thread. No nurse has a given right to touch anyone, if ANYONE for ANY reason doesn't want to be touched by a particular nurse that is totally their right and they can always request another! FFS! I dispair that there are nurses that don't get that! Their desire to get stuck in and "do nursing" to someone does not trump that person's autonomy over their body !

You could turn the question around - If you are a male nurse and a female patient says she doesn't want to receive treatment from you, then why would you feel entitled to touch her against her wishes?

exactly, I never feel entitled to touch anyone, even if they are on DOLs (Deprivation of liberties - ie unable to consent so we act in their best interests) I never see it as that dynamic, and the male nurses I've worked with have felt the same. I would have serious worries about anyone who felt differently. I have honestly never heard a male nurse or HCA huff about it, if anything they're usually very busy anywas so happy to have one less wash/bell/catheter to do, I've never heard one question it or comment when a male doctor goes in. And lets face it it is MUCH easier to pass a job over to a female HCA or nurse when there's usually a selection of them on any given ward, than it is to call another doctor - that would usually involve a wait or seeing someone from a team that's not your consultant - it's not illogical, but even if it is, if someone's reason for feeling uncomfortable seems illogical TO YOU, that does not matter, that does not make them feel less uncomfortable

IPity I think you miss my point. I wasn't for a second suggesting that male nurses are disadvantaged and nowhere did I say women were silly or irrational

However on a very general level if the few men than already go into nursing, find it awkward or difficult because women don't want them doing their care ( and even if they are totally understanding and don't huff, it will still be a pita to have to find a swap or a worry that they may not be able to complete a midwifery rotation because they can't get enough cases), they will either leave or fight harder to get to the management levels as a route out. The profession will be continued to be dominated by women which re-enforces the stereotype that nursing is 'womens work'. This attitude continues to filter down and perpetuate into the other 'caring' roles in society such as childcare and looking after elderly relatives.

This perception results in even fewer men wanting to join the profession. Also, as we live in a patriarchal society, there is little incentive to improve pay a conditions in a job that is seen almost purely as a women's role.

As I am sure you are aware this is very much be a feminist issue. It does not, however, as I made very clear in my first post, over ride anyone's individual needs to be cared for by a member of the same sex.

if a lot of women prefer to be treated by female nurses, do men not want to be treated by male nurses? until now they have not had the choice, can't male nurses work with them?

Clapping at BloominNora's post.

I was disturbed to see that that the Times referred to Will Pooley (ebola) as a "male nurse" when covering his transfer back to the UK.

I nearly died when I realised I had to have a smear done by a male doctor once. But it was the quickest and least uncomfortable one ever, he was fantastic. A female nurse was present (the law I think?) but it put any fears I had into perspective.

I used to work in home care for the local authority. One of only 2 males in a very large team. Most of the time we had to do paperwork in the office because so many people didn't want us. In the end it became department policy to not have a male carer go to a female client alone. I left as I wanted to care in the community not work in an office. My colleague is still there, he hasn't been in anyones home for years.
It was male clients that didn't want us as well as females. And their families.
Sometimes clients or client's families did not want a male even if there was no 'personal' care involved, just shopping, housework etc.
Sometimes they didn't mind a male giving personal care like washing or dressing but didn't like me doing clotes washing, ironing, hoovering. It was strange and did get me down a bit sometimes.
I occasionally still do this type of work, as a friend has her own care agency and gives me work. There is not enough work for me to do it full time though as I get turned away too often or agency gets asked for a female after my first visit.

Recently I took over care for 90 year old male. I would just do his shopping, make him breakfast and lunch, clean his house and help him in and out of the bath (he was able to wash himself). He was delighted to have me as we had great chats about football, pubs, the jobs we used to do etc. He much preferred having a male as he liked the 'banter' we used to have which he did not really have with all his previous female carers. He enjoyed me coming and was much happier. After a couple of weeks, his sisters (who were arranging and paying for his care) found out I was male and demanded a female carer. Their main concern was "what about when he needs his washing and ironing done?".
So I lost a nice job and client lost a carer he had a good relationship with. He now has several different female carers each week doesn't really know them and is not happy.

I get this a lot. Some people are happy with males coming into their house (or a family members house) to do plumbing or decorating etc, even male doctors, nurses or OTs but are uncomfortable with a male doing housework type things. They seem to see it as 'women's work' I think.

'Tis strange and depressing.

Creighton It has never bothered me. When I had concerns (groundless about my prostate my female GP offered to arrange for a male colleague to examine me which would have led to a few days' delay. I told her that in the consulting room she was a doctor, not a woman, and I was a patient, not a man. I did not care about the gender of the doctor with her finger and thumb up my backside, just about that doctor's professional ability.

creighton some men do prefer intimate care to be handled by another man. My father requested a male nurse bathe him after an operation for example.

There are several reasons why men as a demographic may not be as averse to women providing their intimate care as vice versa.

Firstly, fewer men have been sexually assaulted (or indeed, assaulted in general) by women and would therefore intimate care triggering/violating if provided by a woman.

Secondly, one sad consequence of living in what feminists term a "rape culture" (ie one where sexual assault and abuse are so prevalent, so often unpunished, so often supported by social structures and where victims are so often blamed) is that women who haven't been sexually assaulted are socialised to consider men as a demographic intrinsically threatening. Many of these women would therefore prefer intimate care done by another woman, who does not present this same threat. Men are not socialised to think of women in this way, and would not therefore consider a threat in a woman providing this sort of care.

Thirdly, historically nurses are female, and women in society do much more general care/looking after people than men do. Therefore men (and women) are socialised against finding it discomforting when a woman is looking after you as a nurse.

I had major surgery to my vulva when I was twenty (labiaplasty and resectioning of clitoral hood).

I had a spinal anaesthetic, as we agreed that was the better option, and some "light" sedation. There were a lot of people in the room, including students, and at least half were male. I knew only one person in the room (my consultant). The rest never introduced themselves.

I didn't cope well at all - three years on I still have flashbacks. I was wearing only a hospital gown and I remember them asking me to crawl down the bed to have the spinal placed. I was taken out to recovery, legs still apart, with a nurse telling me to hold a sanitary pad on. I lost every shred of dignity I had that day.

Two years on I had a mirena coil fitted, again under spinal, no sedation. This time - everyone in the room was female. They even locked the door so noone could enter for no reason. They gave me a blanket, and they helped me keep my dignity.

I have since been told the first surgery was mismanaged, slightly experimental as it's rarely done in the NHS except in cases of vulval cancer etc - and that if it was done now, would be done differently and more like the latter procedure.

But I have to admit, having only females in the room the second time made a huge dfference. I felt so much more comfortable and relaxed.

That said, I had a male doctor in A&E a few months ago when I had severe thrush. He was absolutely wonderful - even when I was nigh on hysterical as he wanted to put a speculum in. He stopped immediately when I got upset, apologised afterwards, he was lovely.

Sometimes when you are upset or sore male doctors can be much more sympathetic - I've had female consultants who have been absolutely horrible (trying to force a speculum in whilst telling me to "get over it, it doesn't hurt that much" and male doctors who have been far nicer.