To think this person should never have bothered having kids?

[doubleshotespresso]

See below link to a local forum with an advert for a part-time nanny all round slave

Doesn't she sound lovely?

www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?25,1385026

I know lots of people who have au pairs who do all that and they get as much per week as this person is offering per day. The only thing I think is odd in the job description is that s/he wants someone with teacher training experience. If instead s/he had said someone with experience of the 7-11 age group I would say the job description is actually fine. Most of those jobs are pretty small and the children are at school most of the day to time to do it.

The only think I think is wrong is suggesting this should be a self employed post. Perhaps that is lack of experience in the law in this area though.

I am not outraged because of sexism. I'm actually a full time working mum on matermity leave. DD is in full time nursery until October when my 90% SMP runs out. I have a cleaner. I grew up with a full time working mum and a nanny. I'm very comfortable with outsourcing childcare and domestic work. I would hire a nanny if I can afford it.

I'm merely surprised how little she's offering for quite a qualified position (teacher experienced with 7-11). I don't agree with the OP sentiment on not having children. I will take it she's jealous she can't afford help.

Or that she is a closet anti feminist who believe women should do women's work. And convenient forget those who could have always been outsourcing.

The wage isnt great buf i dont get the 'why bother having kids' comment by the OP. it's 3 days a week. There are 7 days in a week. By my reckoning that means she will still have four (which i think is more than 3?) days with her dc (who will be at school between 9 and 3 anyway) really not sure why that makes a bad parent? Lots of parents would love to have 4 days a week with their DCs.

There is no such think as a 'self employed' nanny. Oh there are plenty of people doing it but the reality is that if you work for someone on their premises you are an employee (according to my ex boss, I was their nanny.) this is just a scam to avoid paying tax.

frumpy I don't think it's the sorting out the uniform and helping with homework that people are 'sneering' at. It's the very high expectations for very little pay.

I agree that most people are debating whether the wage is fair for the duties, and the fact that it isn't really on (in fact it isn't legal at all) to try and hire a nanny as 'self-employed' in this way.

But my comment about sneering was in response to the poster who said "My main point was though, really what, if anything do these folks actually do with their own children ? They clearly want to just return from work to a showhome where the kids have homework done, are fit for bed and excel in all they do. They assume no respeonsibility for the school uniform , cooking etc of their own children, why on earth did they bother?"

Which did look quite a lot like sneering at the employer for not sorting out her kids' school uniform etc. As though the point of having children is not because you love your children but the endless drudgery work of looking after them

Given the point about "Monday 1 November" I think this has to be a leg-pull. Can anyone guess why it has been done because I can't!

OP yabu to ask why the women bothered having children. She is outsourcing some of the slog work of family life on a part-time basis. So what?
Critics have conveniently overlooked the fact she wants to spend the school holidays with her children- unlike many MNers.

The wage is too low but the responsibilities are fairly normal for a nanny. I agree with some of the other posters, most of the posts on here smack of jealousy that they can't afford help.

Woman not women

I pay my cleaner £10 per hour. Thats the London going rate.

Tutors charge £40 per hour per child. They are effectively asking for an 11+ tutor for older girl, to work as a nanny and help them both with school work.

At a cleaners salary....

I think its the 'teacher training' part that is the worst. Basically its a nanny but she can't expect a trained teacher on a nanny salary.

...or a cleaners salary for that matter....

So you shouldn't have children if you're going to employ a nanny

The only dubious thing is the "you're self employed and are responsible for your own tax" thing, but many people don't know the ins and outs of nanny tax. And MANY people pay their nannies/cleaners cash in hand, rightly or wrongly. Probably just better not to advertise this on an internet forum.

I also am not sure the poster will find a qualified teacher, but good luck to her.

The only thing wrong with that advert is the pay rate, and wanting the nanny to be self- employed.

The Op is WAY out of line to say that the parent should never have bothered having children. It's 3 days a week, FFS!

The kids aren't home during the day, so to make it easier to find someone they found appropriate jobs to fill the day.

Apart from unpacking the shopping and taking the dog for a walk, all the chores are related to the child, so absolutely spot on for a nanny position.

Seriously, some people need to get a grip.

Oh fgs
They're asking for someone to take kids to school, pick them up, organise, clothe and feed kids and sort their activities. Help with homework and take the dog for a walk.
Oh and not make a mess.

It's advertised as 12 hours, but really she'll work 7.45 til 9, and then 3-8, and take the dog for a walk during the day
It's hardly slave labour.

But at the same time, they must be available in the day, and to do some chores at home, so cant be a student in the day, or have another job.

Very odd that she's trying to hire a 'freelance' nanny fully 14 months ahead of start date.

I don't think that the person "should never have had kids" but I do think they are insane to get all that for 10 pound an hour

But at the same time, they must be available in the day, and to do some chores at home, so cant be a student in the day, or have another job.

Yes, and I'm sure the parents will find bits to "keep her occupied"

areyouthere of course you should have children if you are intending to hire a nanny... My point was not that the oarents should stay home. It was merely that their list of requirements way exceeded the pay they intended, especially given the self-employed nature of it.

And ok yes, perhaps my title was harsh, the advert just read very clearly to me that the parents wanted to be ab,e to come home and unwind from work without assuming any of the daily joys/responsibilities/child-rekated tasks. Perfectly accept that some of these tasks would need to be outsourced but you would think she mightjust want to do one.

Is she a bad parent for not sorting out uniform, passing bath-time,homework, tutoring, cooking, cleaning et al onto a nanny? Of course not.... But is does undeniably make her a shocking employer. The hours are not lart-time, the contract arrangement is illegal and her expectation that somebody will use, maintain and insure a car for her purposes whilst only receiving fuel money is laughable. East Dulwich is an exceptionally wealthy area, where a standard nanny would cost more than £10 per hour without the qualifications and expertise this lady is seeking...

It's 3 days
Do you really think this woman is going to be sitting on her arse while the nanny does all the work. No, to me it looks like she'll be working from 8.45 to 6.45 herself.
For 3 days
Maybe, this is her only shot at getting her career back, maybe she's crying herself to sleep at the thought of going back to work. Maybe she's just trying to juggle everything.
Are you in her shoes- obviously not, so don't fucking judge.
I am appalled at your attitude to someone who is just trying to make it work for their family.
And the rest of you that have jumped on this bandwagon

And they're not going to be on call all day.
And all they have to do is tidy up after meals and do a few wash loads

My mum does a similar thing for my brothers kids, she's a retired teacher.
And the homework- she'd love to get paid £125 a day

ppaka no she won't be idle for 3 days I am sure and nobody has said she won't agonise over being a working Mum, who wouldn't?

The point is her list of qualifications,expectations,personal costs,responsibilities etc for a very low wage with no job security for the nanny she clearly intends to greatly assist in raising her two children. I am not in her shoes no, but she has placed a ridiculous and somewhat illegal advert on a public forum.
So if it is quite okay with you I will judge away.

And here is an idea: Perhaps the rest of you who have jumped on this bandwagon do not all agree with your view. It may just be possible!

My appalling attitude to someone just trying to make it work for their family stems from the fact that these parents clearly are avoiding paying appropriate wages, tax, NI , car insurance etc whilst expecting the full "Mary Poppins " package. Not a great example to the two daughters' she is raising and not a great prospect for the nanny who lands this role. That appalled me as in trying to make things work for their family it seems they were happy to make somebody else's life hell. For little renumeration. I find that attitude appalling.

I await your approval!

So to reiterate- the real problem here is with fair pay and terms/realistic expectations, not the rights of any parent to work or hire in some much needed help.

Our nanny helps with homework too - because my boys (aged 6, 4 and 3 - 4 year old started today; the 3 year old doesn't have homework!) are too tired once I get home from work at 6.

She also cooks their dinner - because they'd be too hungry if they had to wait for me to cook once I'm home.

I do get to do bath and bedtime. But then I work 5 days per week, and so am undoubtedly inferior to that mother....

Honestly, the only duty I can see which isn't within a nanny's normal duties is tutoring for the 11+.

The rate is a bit low for a nanny, but nannies do earn less per hour than you'd expect compared by comparison to a cleaner because a cleaner does perhaps 3 hours per week whereas a nanny does 36 hours per week.

The self-employment thing isn't on though.

My mum does a similar thing for my brothers kids, she's a retired teacher. And the homework- she'd love to get paid £125 a day

HAHAHAHAHA exactly the same as looking after yoru own grandchildren expecting an unrelated person to come and look after your children for a pittance of 10 pound an hour while being self employed and having no benefits!