to think parents should make room for adults by getting their kids to sit on their laps.

[Bouttimeforwine]

I have always done this, in waiting rooms, on buses, anywhere really. Even till they were too big really to be sitting on laps. Even now I will get them to sit on the floor at friends houses so that adults get the chairs. It's polite and the way I was brought up.

I often see children taking up a space, when it would be easy just to pop them on your knee for a short period of time. I know for a fact that some of these parents have no physical reason not to do this. They just think that their child has as much right as an adult to have that seat. True but it's not good manners is it?

AIBU?

Woodlice no I didn't get seats very often when I was pg either.

I think the little ones tend to be noticeable as you can hear them, and of course they aren't on the tube at rush hour in town so much, and people are just super-aware that it's a bad situation. I have seen little ones sort of handed along to get to a seat before now

My DS2 was so tired standing up on the tube (aged 3) that he actually fell asleep on his feet & I had to try to hold him up! Bit tricky that - too heavy to carry.
No one offered him a seat though...wish Seven had been there...

After sticking with Aircraft Child Reclining Seat Gate I can't read all of this thread but in answer to the OP's original question if I had a smallish child (say under 7) I would put them on my lap if adults were standing. If the child was older I would ask them to give up their seat until it was a natural reaction for dc to do without my prompting.

Does the equalization of rights acquired through mere payment (eg: transportation tickets) never end? Childhood is a short time in life, it's about the only time we have to learn respect, humility, generosity and courtesy before we become adults. If we don't learn these basic things as children when do we learn them or are these things no longer considered worth knowing?

Also pretty unlikely that a little one is going to turn out not to be a little one, whereas people who aren't pregnant / that old actually etc it can go a bit wrong!

I think those badges they have for pg women now are great. IME it's women who tend to give up seats more often for pregnant women - I think if they've been there done that type of thing there is a bit more empathy.

At home or in a waiting room...or at a function, on a town centre bench, anywhere really..adults get first dibs. They just do.

If there are not enough seats, mine get a tap and a 'up you get so the lady/gent can sit'. There are no arguments and at 6 ds1 is now starting to do this without prompting. Similarly, guests get dibs over dh and me. If there are not enough seats we'll happily sit on the floor so all adult guests get a chair.

Not to do so is just rude.

floats - the tickets thing is even more of a reason for a child to give up their seat, because their ticket on a train will not have been full price. I can take ds on the train at weekends for £2, thanks to my season ticket. All the more reason why he should give up his seat to a grown up who has paid full fare.

Float has nailed it for me. I want my DS (still a lap-sitter) to practise being thoughtful and well-mannered. It's not about his entitlements or rights, or anyone else's, for me. It's about installing in him the values I'd like him to have as an adult, such as awareness of others around him and a willingness to put himself out to do another person a kindness.

I may change as he gets older, who knows. But I don't think these things come naturally. I automatically look up at each stop (and I commute every day) to check that no one needs my seat more than I do, principally because my parents would have been appalled had any of their children not stood for adults when old enough. It's not innate, it was taught and reinforced through practice, for which I'm grateful.

Seven, I found exactly the opposite when pregnant and commuting into and in London. Most likely to stand: slightly scary-looking late teen/early 20s boys/men. Least likely: 40-something women, who would fix one with gimlet eye implying 'we didn't have badges in my day, missy', followed closely by middle-aged men in expensive suits.

It was interesting sociology.

I don't see why the cost thing matters. If you buy something using a coupon, you still own it. If you get a deal on a train fare as an adult, you have as much right to your place and seat on the train as anyone else. I don't see why kids should be penalised for something they can't help or do anything about anyway. My mother is older but hikes all over and wouldn't need a seat more than a little one most of the time, but she doesn't pay.

I found the same, Jassy - the most likely people to stand up on the Tube were teenagers, in particular any lad with massive headphones and low slung jeans. Early 20s women never stood up, though they'd make eye contact. Middle aged men just stared at their paper and pretend not to have seen you!

Interesting isn't it jassy. Different lines seem to have different "personalities" as well.

But Jassy, do you stand for other adults who appear as equally fit to stand as yourself, not just the ones who need it more?

If these are your values, I imagine you never sit down on a train. If that is true, fair enough. But most of us sit, if there's a free seat and a person with greater need doesn't board, at which point we extend the courtesy of standing. A value I want my children to have is self-respect, including not feeling they are lesser than any person for something as arbitrary as age.

I must admit I wasn't great at standing when I was younger. I always had my nose buried in a book and was miles away.

When people don't get up it's not usually on purpose I don't think. I think you are probably right about young women.

I had a nightmare commuting when pg it was absolute hell.

Jassy and Thurlow, I noticed something similar when I was commuting on crutches for a number of weeks. The "scariest" men were always the ones to give me a seat :). Suited older men and young women least likely. Younger suited men were a wild card.

OP, YANBU.

Tabby

I mean Yanbu!!! Fucking Autocorrect Fgs

A value I want my children to have is self-respect, including not feeling they are lesser than any person for something as arbitrary as age

Standing up for an adult is not a sign that they are a' 'lesser' person

It's a sign of respect and good manners.

I find women in their 30s and 40s quite likely to get up, young men likewise and middle aged, older men quite unlikely. I do get a seat nearly everytime now (at 7 months pregnant).

I'm not too fussed about whether or not children get up, depends on age, tiredness, business of train I suppose.

But why?

Why is that adult worthy of the respect of being given a seat, and not a child? Why should the child be expected to display those manners, but not an adult?

Any woman who has been pregnant and isn't at that moment will jump to their feet!

I used to find quite often that I'd stand for a stop or two, getting increasingly grumpy, and then someone would look up from their book, spot me, and be mortified that they'd been in their own world and not noticed. And then I'd feel bad for feeling grumpy!

Yes I am very eager to leap to my feet for all and sundry these days! I was so so so grateful when someone let me sit when I was pg - I didn't get a seat very often unfortunately. Like payback or karma or something, I'm passing on the favours that were done for me

That;s quite cheesy isn;t it. Never mind

The OP is talking about children sitting on parents' laps. So why are people talking about standing ?

Totally agree with you OP. I was on holiday last week and the Brits had all reserved sun loungers for each of their children, most of whom never used them. The Spanish and Germans only reserved loungers for the adults I noticed.

I will own that I'm baffled how someone thinks their 4yo is safe standing on a packed tube. Not been to London for a long time, but have been on a busy tube train and it's hellish.

I have been on the Tyneside Metro with DS1. Never at rush hour and, even when it's been standing room only, it's not been packed (and it's a much gentler standing experience than a bus, anyhow). I did use it regularly at rush hour as a student, though and, even in the late 80s/early 90s, it was a truly nose to armpit experience. You only didn't fall over because there was nowhere to fall, as it was so tightly packed. I regularly had to tell someone to take their backpack out of my face. I would not want to subject a child to that. I don't even think I could handle it now I'm older and a lot less robust.

That's what I want to know letter

Why would I a healthy thirty something yr old, at 5ft7 and strong and sturdy who is capable of standing for any distance required, be more entitled to a seat and take one from a six yr old who is at far more risk of injury and being separated from family?

Why would I do that?

That's mean