To wonder why some atheists are so obsessed with being atheist?

[Fanfeckintastic]

I say this as an atheist myself, so many people seem obsessed with "not believing"! I don't mean just being vocal in their disgust at the Catholic church etc (completely understandable) I mean Ricky Gervais for example, somehow I have "liked" him on Facebook and he never stops posting skeptic stuff.

Why do non believers put so much effort and thought into "not believing"

On a side note, I'm in Ireland and sometimes get very pissed off with how much control the church still has, it sickens me actually. But I'm talking about just atheists almost making a hobby of being atheists?

AIBU in my observation?

PhaedraIsMyName, When I said about not knowing I did NOT mean "I'm not sure... maybe..."

I am quite sure that all the religions I have encountered are as likely to be true as fairies so I dismiss them all as I dismissed fairies.

As I've said before, strictly speaking we can't say that there isn't 'something out there' because if it's put as vaguely as that it could mean anything, but if there is it never had any contact or effect on the world or there'd be evidence.

If I said "my uncle jim made the world out of chocolate" that would have the same amount of supporting evidence as the religions do, so it would be ridiculous to go around believing in them.

I don't have to rely on faith to tell me they are not true. I don't have any use for faith at all. I regard faith as the result of not thinking things through properly.

Oxford some fundamentalists believe that. Most Christians do not. To claim that most christians believe the old testament - which is a hotch potch of oral tradition, myth, fable etc - is believed to be literal truth by all christians is to purposely misrepresent them.

The problem is, Herc, that believing in religion full-stop makes people look insane, troubled, or intellectually challenged. It's only slightly weirder to literally believe in Adam & Eve or whatever. It's like a Scientologist also believing in fairies - it's not like that would make Atheists think "Well, I thought it was totally normal to believe in the alien shit, but believing in fairies is just absurd". It's all really stupid and absurd; the degree to which an individual aspect of that is stupid and absurd is pretty irrelevant. Believing in a deity is ridiculous - christians (and others) don't need any help misrepresenting themselves. If you don't want people to sneer at your beliefs, don't hold beliefs that are so bizarre that it's impossible to respect them. Note: this is not the same as respecting the right to believe them.

I agree Oxfordbags

Why is it hard to accept that "clever" people can be theists, atheists and agnostics? I have no trouble accepting this.

what is happening in North Korea is not as simple as saying it is personality cult and that is the same as religion it is not

people there have no choice they live in fear so not believing is not an option

also with a personality cult of modern times people are able to see the person, hear their preaching it is not word of mouth or what has been written down it is not ancient scriptures that will be interpreted by scholars

I think if you had read the bible, Koran or other religious scriptures much of what is said it what you are likely to believe. they are complex not as simple as a few little stories that teach people good and bad or what to fear

I can not say there is not a god or a power of good because it has not been proved to me. there are many things that I believe in that have no scientific proof am I stupid to believe them or is it foolish to believe that I can only believe in something that has scientific proof

Ok, Herc, still waiting - how many Christians believe their holy book is just made up stories to get them to be nice to each other? 50 percent? 75 percent? 100 percent?

Or very few indeed worldwide? I'm also waiting expectantly for the Herc Guide to What Is A Load Of Old Shite In the Old Testament. All the parts that don't play well in the media?

The majority of Christian denominations believe things like the Genesis creation story is allegorical.
This is not just Herc's opinion.

Most atheists (at least the ones I know or encounter online) don't want to ban religion, in the way of totalitarian states like North Korea; they just want a secular society where people are completely free to believe or not believe whatever they like, and, crucially, where the state has no input from or into any religion, state schools are not religious, and no religious groups have privileged status over anyone else.

Just want to say as someone who is Christian - but liberal and feminist - and who sees the bible as mainly allegorical, I think a lot of atheists are as literal as some bible belt fundamentalist.

Also, OP, YANBU. You, like (most) of my friends are an atheist. But you treat people like respect. That what we should all be doing ... isn't it?

Oxford ... your post is really contradictory. As you point out, it's people who are cuntish, not religions or 'imaginary' stories.

There's nothing contradictory about my post. As I said, if people are cunty and use something as an excuse or a reason to be cuntish, then it makes perfect sense to try to eradicate or at least heavily diminish that thing. At the very least, it is insanity and the utmost immorality to give it privilege and status.

Also, many of the stories, rules and beliefs within religious texts are absolutely abhorrent. Religion is not some neutral,benign thing that some humans twist for their own sick or pathetic bad reasons and needs, it was, and is, created by humans precisely to try to give themselves unfair privilege and benefits and to justify, excuse and even promote hatred and nastiness towards others deemed as Other.

Love your enemy, hate those who curse you? Be kind to foreigners, as you were once foreigners? The Golden Rule?

Yes it's all about promoting hatred.

But all those things, all the good stuff, are all things that Atheists do and feel and think without requiring a book of instructions or holy pronouncements.

In fact, religious people do those things because they are innately good and moral, nothing to do with religion at all, no matter what they might tell themselves. It's a kind of low self-esteem, really, to believe you're only a good person because you've learnt it from a special book, or because you're scared of punishment.

You don't need religion to be good, but religion allows innumerous people to be cunts, even kill. All the more reason to call it the dangerous, unnecessary bullshit it is and get rid of it, and allow adults to stop demeaning themselves by looking ridiculous and childish and to think fully for themselves and take responsibility for their own lives and choices properly.

I know it's a bit of an aside but since it's been mentioned a number of times I thought it might be worth mentioning that, whilst North Korea is officially an atheist state, freedom of religious worship is actually enshrined in law - 35% of the population identify as religious (mainly Buddhism I think).

Obviously state propaganda encourages the 'worship' of their political leaders (dead and living) primarily, but wrong to suggest that religion is banned.

do you really think OxfordBags that if there was no religion people would not do bad things and find another reason to do bad things

I agree you do not need religion to be a good person I believe people are good and there are many reasons why people do bad things religion is just one excuse that people use as a reason

Also, I accept that intelligent people can be religious. Because I wholeheartedly believe that religious belief is a form of functional mental illness, where the person with that disorder is capable of leading a life that's mentally sound in all or most other respects. A bit like how many functional anorexics live full and successful lives but are mentally ill about food, bodies and so on.

There's no stigma to being mentally ill, nor should there be. But mentally ill beliefs shouldn't be given equal status or even greater status than mentally sound, logical, rational beliefs.

I'm also amused by the concept that Atheists can be 'too literal'. Is the suggestion that we place too much importance on truth, logic and facts?! Yeah, that's making a load of sense

No, Freudian, I think people would still do bad shit, although what that would entail would probably not be entirely the same as bad shit that has been done, or is being done, in the name of religion AND I also think that not as much bad shit in total might be done. All I'm saying is that it is the no. 1 reason/excuse for bad shit in the world, so it doesn't make sense that it is privileged, much less presented as some wonderful, positive force.

People are responsible for their own actions, always, but I don't see why we should aggressively promote major triggers for bad shit.

I really hope you aren't an employer Oxford.

seriously being religious is a form of mental illness

that is quite a statement

Explain people believing that an invisible giant lives in the sky, watching and controlling everything and everyone simultaneously, despite there being zero evidence or logic to it, and plenty of evidence and logic to prove that it's bullshit, then Freudian.

Would you say someone had a form of (however minor) functional mental illness if they genuinely believed in fairies? Or would you say that was as mentally sound as everyone who doesn't? Religious believers can't add accepting a hierarchy of what's bonkers and what's not to the list of privilege they already get for not thinking straight.

who believes that there is a giant in the sky controlling things

that is one interpretation and not one that is believed in all religions

would I say that someone was mentally ill because they believed in fairies no I would not or any other spirt

Well, how would you like a believe in something invisible that there's no proof of to be described, then? What description of God would make it easier for people to keep convicing themselves it's not a bonkers thing to believe in? Even if it's some wishy-washy 'force', it's still a load of bollocks.

Ps Handy tip: 'spirits' don't exist.

Belief, not believe.

to you they do not but to many many people they do they feel them who am I to tell that they are talking rubbish and unable to understand what they really feel as I can not feel or see it