To think being "well off" is the least important quality in a man?

[HollyGuacamolly]

I am single and pregnant and bitter but went for lunch with a group of friends (also single) and were discussing what qualities we want in a man; I was surprised that all of them listed "well off" as an important factor, but not one of them mentioned anything along the lines of kind/treats me with respect.

Is this standard attitude? Or do I hang around with gold diggers weirdos?

FWIW obviously I don't want someone who's shit with money and a total liability, but when assessing someone's potential as a new partner I can honestly say I don't take wealth into account.

'Yes men have a similar choice but they get much more harshly judged for it. My DH will be a SAHD when the baby is here.'

To me it seems as if it is the other way round. It is OK for anyone to look after the baby except the mother!

We have some SAHDs in DC's class and they are very admired and even seen as 'super dads'.

And yes I fully intended to be home with my children when they were babies and now work part time.

None of this came as a surprise to DH by the way. We did this thing before we got married and really talked about what we wanted/when we wanted it/whatthe plan was.

DH had a 'list' as well. We lucked out and found each other early in life.

A "list" is relatively easy early on in life. You know someone's background, they come without baggage, and you are probably starting from the same point.

Fast forward 20 or so years and someone has probably reached their earning potential, or at least you can see where it's going, they may be trailing an ex-wife and children and associated costs, and so finding someone who ticks your boxes is going to be that much harder.

So the outcome might be that you don't find anyone who suits? Is that so awful?

Thebookofruth - your grandmas saying is briliant. Have written it in my diary to pass on to my daughter when she is a bit older!

IME the women I know who have 'settled' are more unhappy than the women who are single and choosy.

I've just come back to this (I was on my phone earlier) and I Just have to comment on this

I think it was the fact, ICanHearYou, that you wanted Mr Big Salary, Mr Fantastic in Bed, Mr Great with your Existing Children, and Mr Super Sperm too. No pressure for any suitors, then.

To clarify

The only reason I could see myself getting married again, would be to have more children, I cannot have more children if I am in the house I am in now, nor can I have more children (or live with someone) if I lose more than I gain (financially) by them being a part of our lives

So yes, in order for me to marry (and have more children) I will need to find a man with a decent salary who can be a proactive part of making that happen, otherwise my existing children will suffer and I am not prepared to sacrifice that.

I have just got out of a 10 year relationship with a man who was shite in bed, in fact it destroyed my confidence and self esteem, I am just finding myself again and no, I am not interested in having another relationship without that spark and connection. Life is too short for any more shit sex.

I haven't said anything about a future mate being great with my existing children, but of course he would have to be or how would he be a part of our family? That seems like a strange thing to pick someone apart for laying down as an absolute at the beginning of a relationship.

I haven't said anything about super sperm, I would be quite happy having a relationship with a person who did not want (more) children, stop putting words into my mouth to fit your frankly warped perception of life.

The things I would demand from a future mate are not crazy or unheard of, they are basic normal things to expect from someone who is going to be a PARTNER to you and part of your childrens family.

From what I see on MN in particular women should be more choosy not less.

"We have some SAHDs in DC's class and they are very admired and even seen as 'super dads'."

Really jelly? That's actually really nice to hear. I seem to get a lot of head shaking and assumptions a man can't possibly run a house. Maybe I need to stop extrapolating my mum's opinion to society's opinion as a whole!

In many ways I'm glad I'm a woman as I'd be concerned otherwise that I might marry a bright ambitious woman with a well paid job who decides after having a child that she now wants to stay at home and emotionally manipulates me to get that. As a woman you expect your partner to keep working. If you both decide before living together or getting married that's what you want it's different.

I don't understand as well why there's an assumption that ambitious, well off men don't want woman who want to be SAHMs/work parttime and not be as driven as them. It could be because the area I live in has a great train links to Cannon Street (so straight into the City) and is therefore full of people working in the banking sector. Most of the Dads are on trains around 7am (at the office after 8am is 'late'), then getting home early is being home around 7pm - most mums here try to keep little ones on 8pm rather than 7pm bedtimes so daddy can be home for bathtime.

Men in those sorts of well paid industries who want families themselves do really need a wife who isn't going to expect them to do half of drop off and pick ups from childcare, aren't going to expect them to take a day off when the DCs are sick, often working until 10-11pm at night, at that point, they don't want to start cooking, cleaning, ironing or gardening themselves, so expect their DW to do it or arrange someone else to be paid to do it.

While you can say that these woman are looking for a man to fund their lifestyle preferences, there are a lot of men looking for woman who'll facilitiate their lifestyle and career preferences. They might not be as clearly vocal in what they are looking for, but don't assume that 'high acheiving men' are actually looking for the female version of them, rather than someone who'll make it possible for them to have the lifestyle they want.

Exactly Mary, people being picky should not be frowned upon.

I want a man that will make me happy, that includes being financially secure and probably allowing me to have 2 more children with him.

If he doesn't exist then that is fine too.

He may not! I've been told I'm picky but that's only in the last decade. My x was awful. Now, if it's not too cocky or 'transactional' I'm looking for what I can offer myself and NO less. I want all the goods. Good company, good heart, good humoured. And just a bit good -looking !? Have not found this person. Thinking about that seems like a sad idea but I'm fine somehow.

very true marywestcott, and my relationship broke up the moment I could no longer 'facilitate' somebody else's career+family. If I myself wanted career+family then that was not going to be supported.

morloth that is an excellent point, and I think of it often when I berate myself for having merged genes with such an uncompromising, selfish man. But I had just waited so long for a decent man and didn't meet one, when I met my x I thought I'd just try not being single for a while because I was so lonely and so tired of being single and I thought, for a while, it won't do any harm. Are there enough decent men to go around? I know they exist but seriously, I don't think there is one decent man per woman.

So anyway, I forgive myself. I'd never do it again, will stay single for ever if no good men appear.

I'm with ICanHearYou. I'm financially healthy, support my children and have removed an ex husband from my life who squandered everything leaving me and the DC penniless. He was also selfish in bed

I'm happy to remain single rather than settle for someone. So yes my wish list is kind, solvent, home owner, good with my children ...but no more children. I own my own home and it's my children's home. To give half of it to someone else on marriage...nah

However nor do I expect to be supported. I just don't wish to carry anyone else financially. My choice and if it rules out a few men I can live with that.

I would love to have two more children...

I am happy with my boys though.

People are bad at knowing what they want from relationships and tend to assume the "nice/respectful" etc part is a given, in practice that means you're not actively looking for it and focusing more on shallower aspects, probably because it's hard to tell if someone is nice, kind, respectful, grumpy, sexist etc at first glance whereas the other things have more instant feedback. It's easy to tell if someone likes the same kind of music as you or whether they're going to be a football/xbox bore. Not so easy to figure out how supportive they're going to be when you've got food poisoning and a toddler running around

I have to disagree with your answer to this ^ Holly....

Ok some people take being kind/respectful as a given, but I think that is where they make the fundamental error

I think where so many people make a fundamental error is that they commit to a partner - often including having children with them - before they take the time to get to know them properly.

You quite often see threads on here, where, if anyone expresses an opinion about really getting to know someone / 'going out with each other' for a time before deciding to have sex, they get jumped on and ridiculed by so many. Seems like a wise choice to me, to find out all those things - how they react when things aren't going well - in advance of making any kind of commitment to them.

I also agree with whoever it was that said up thread - we're only talking about a "theoretical wish list" here - a list of things you would find appealing if you were ever in the position of having a selection of partners to choose from. When you meet and just 'click' with your soulmate, all the 'lists of qualities' can easily be cast aside.

Surely there is a massive leap from sleeping with someone quickly to assuming they then won't get to know them at all?

I still rate highly the 'spark' and good sex and i am in my 50s.
I cant do with lazy men and the ones who are too special to do a job they dont 'love'. A hard working man who doesnt earn a super salary but have several skills and can do many jobs would be fine for me.
Dh has a professional job but he can do -and has done- other jobs too.
I wouldn't want someone who earns a lot more than me because
a) the balance wouldnt feel right for me
b) i would feel like changing my ID. I wouldn't fancy living in Fulham or having a dh who is embarassed to go to Asda or someone who is embarrassed to be seen with my family and who has very different childhood and experiences to me. I know a woman who worked very hard at changing her accent for her dh, i wouldnt like that.

Political views also very important to me.

I hope that I don't fall for somebody that doesn't have the qualities on my list, seeing as how they are just basic common decency, good humour, good company............. If i fall for somebody that doesn't have these qualities, I will have to start a thread on mn and yall can tell me to cop on!

Not all women decide that they want to be a SAHM and marry a well off man. I met my dh at university when we were 21. When we both got our first jobs, I was earning much more than he was and we lived in crappy rented bedsits for years. As the years went on, we matched each other pretty much earnings wise. However, when we had our first dc and I went part-time, his salary accelerated and mine stagnated. Once we had dc2, we decided that I would be a SAHM, as I wanted to, he wanted me to and it made financial and practical sense for us to do this. Now he is earning 60k and I earn nothing. It's enabled me to be a SAHM now, but it's certainly not how we started out on our journey together.

MaryWest. Great point about professional men wanting a particular type of wife. I went to a posh American business school and interestingly many of the men/boys in my class were kind of looking for girls who were at Uni but not so ambitious and just there to get their M.R.S. degree! The girls in our v competitive degree class were slightly mystified that none of the boys wanted to date them! These guys knew what they wanted (hedge fund life, hedge fund life). Men have their lists too...

Funny enough you know what men seem to want on their list? Not money but a girl who is 'easy going and fun'. I hear that a lot. It makes me think that men just don't want to deal with serious stuff and complicated women. Guess I'm a malt loaf and they're looking for angel food cake.
I digress....