To ask when this whole parenting thing gets easier?

[PenelopeChipShop]

This is actually a serious question. I wonder how many people who clicked on this are expecting me to say I have a 12-week-old, struggling with breastfeeding, or similar. Nope. DC has just turned 2. I'm really down today because:

He has still never slept through the night, not once. DH hasn't helped much up to now so I feel like the living dead

He's a really fussy eater - basically wants to live on fruit and/ or rice cakes, not interested in proper meals

Is super, super clingy - to the extent that he won't usually even be comforted by his dad. DH tried to get up with him at the weekend to let me sleep in and they could only manage half an hour before he was shrieking 'Mummy see' and demanding to be let at me

Am an unhappy SAHM - made redundant on mat leave despite wanting to return. Have been offered 2 jobs since then but both turned down flexible working requests so I didn't feel able to take them (my mum is not well at the mo either so this was partly bc of her needs, not just the DC)

Of course, I love love love him - plus side is he very cute, language very good so communication is getting easier, I am v lucky to have him I know. But two years ago I was at the peak of my career, and now I feel utterly stuck, isolated, drained - if I could just sleep through the night things wouldn't look so bad but I can't imagine him ever doing it. I don't think DH understands why looking after one toddler is tiring, in fact most of the time I think it shouldn't be.

I just want to know what age does it get a BIT less intense - when can you stop following their every step for example, or when do even the worst sleepers give up the fight? I guess I just hoped things would be a bit easier by now. Feel that I can't talk to people in RL as I know a lot of mums with toddlers his age or a bit older who already have or are expecting no.2 so they obviously don't feel the same!

You need to get your DH more involved. This DH hasn't helped much up to now so I feel like the living dead means that it's not surprising that he still wanted you at the weekend.

So get going now! Bath times, meal times, nappy changing, play.

Whatever, something every day and more at weekends.

That will make a huge difference to all of you.

We resorted to sleep training our bad sleeper at 3, and he was sleeping through the night at 3.5 (still getting up early, but we counted our blessings). Was ok to leave for a bit at 3-4 (depending on child). DS (the bad sleeper) was still clingy all the way through infants school but it did gradually reduce.

I think I started feeling human again when he was around 4-5 (sorry, I know that's not what you wanted to hear, and I should point out that I also had a younger child to look after which would obviously have added to my perception of it being hard).

You will get probably get lots of posts from people who had "easy" babies/toddler and will not get what your problem is. (DD was one such and in her case she was easy as a young child and is now a nightmare at 8, about the age when DS became very easy!)

Not sure I can offer any solace but I feel your pain.

Dd is now three and sounds a lot like your son. She sleeps better through the night but the slightest cold and she's up again in the night. I refused to go in to her anymore as I had a newborn so dh co sleeps with her when she wakes in the night.

She is less clingy than she was. She still follows me around everywhere 95% of the time but she can now play one her own for a bit and is able to make up her own games (thank god).

She is still a pain in the arse a lot of the time but is getting better in a lot of ways.

I have a horrible feeling you will get lots of people on here telling you all ages are hard in there own way I'm praying these people are wrong

Best of luck

You poor soul its hard isnt it toddlers are sent to torture us they are exhausting could you have him In bed with you or sleep with him its not ideal but least you have a sleep I used to sleep with dd1 sometimes she was the same, do you leave himnwith his dad at all if not do it even for half an hour just tp get somd breathing space, its ok to leave him to cty if he is being a limpet during the day tell him he can sit beside mummy not on mummy, give it a year when he is at preschool he will change again , have you thought about a childmider or nursery a couple of days a week just to get abreaks

When you say 'following his every step' what exactly do you mean by that?

Ah poor you. I know how you feel - my DD 19 mo sleeps a bit better than your DS - we get about 1 "through the night" out of 10 nights - but still a whole heap worse than most toddlers I know, and she's hard work in the day too.

I have definitely noticed a correlation between her sleep and behaviour in the day so I do think sleep is at the root of it all. If your DS is tired from a broken night then that will probably make the clinginess worse. Fussy eating could also be linked to bad sleep and/or the other way round.

Right, the sleeping. What's his pattern? Does he nap in the day and when/how much, how does he go to sleep at night, when and how often are the wake ups and what does he want/ what do you do. Any clues as to what is waking him, ie is it worse when teething, worse in the winter, etc.

You asked when do the worst sleepers give up - I started a thread on Sleep about my DD's sleeping and got lots of tales from parents of bad sleepers... most seemed to start sleeping through somewhere between 2 and 3. One or two said older but not many.

Have you ever just gone out for the day (at a weekend) and left him with DH? if so what happens? could you instigate a regular "daddy and DS" activity on sat mornings so you can get a nap?

On the job front - it sounds like you would benefit hugely from going back to work. Could you take a full time job, stick it out for a few months to "prove yourself", then apply for a flexible arrangement after that? IMO companies are much more willing to consider flexi working once you've demonstrated you are reliable.

Mrsjayy yes we coslept for ages - in fact for most of his life on and off but in the last week or so I snapped and I feel that I can't anymore. He prefers to be in with me but I think we both sleep better with more space to be honest, and we're still breastfeeding (surprise surprise!) so I need to be apart from him in order to not be mauled all night.

I've never had any childcare (regrettably no reason to!) but have just started settling him in a nursery for two mornings a week, ostensibly so I can do some freelance work to try to at least keep my hand in my erstwhile career (ha) but if I'm being honest, for a break! Even when sitting at my computer doing bits of freelance work or polishing my CV I feel so much more relaxed than when 'on duty'. I know I probably sound awful but I'm just finding things so draining at the moment.

NannyOgg I think you've hit the nail on the head there tbh. DH is good but… not quite what I expected if I'm honest. He works long hours and it's not unusual for him to miss bedtime most evenings so most of the time he's only around at the weekends. If I'd gone back to work we would have had to both arrange our weeks around our responsibilities but because I didn't, I've just become the default, 24 hour career and he's there when he's there, basically.

For me, about 3 or 4 was a turning point - my DS had always woken in the early hours and not gone back to sleep, but as he got older I think he was able to amuse himself when he woke up and didn't immediately want attention.

I think you need to get DH more involved - but that will have to mean him taking DS out somewhere, or you going out and leaving them to it, as DS will always look to you if he knows you are in the house. Half an hour then demanding you is par for the course when he expects to be with you.

He's also plenty old enough to do some kind of sleep training. When he wakes, does he actually need anything? Or does he just expect attention? You can deal with any actual needs, then leave him. It takes persistence, and I know I can't talk as I really didn't do it myself, but the world looks a different place if you can get a decent night's sleep!

Ah cross-posted there. His own bed sounds like a requirement then - it may take a little while to get him used to the idea, but persevere!

beccajoh, I mean at the park or playgroups, having to constantly keep an eye to make sure he hasn't climbed something he shouldn't, or at home making sure he hasn't gone and licked the loo seat or similar. I have noticed some mums with more than one are a bit more relaxed about the younger ones but I find that if I turn my back I find him dangling off the sofa upside down or standing on a shelf or something!

I feel very sorry for you and I have been there.

My DS1 was very clingy. Would takes ages to warm up on a playdate, wanted me all the time, very quiet etc. Awful eater and at 2, went through a poor sleeping stage.

He is now 5.5 and in Reception. He sleeps fine, although gets up at 6am, but hey. He is still shyer than your average kid but has thrived at school and loves his chums. He is a joy to manage/teach, according to his teacher, and is happy and well adjusted. He loves his friends more than me now! Still a poor eater, yes (like your boy, he has a very limited diet) but you know, we just limit the treaty stuff and encourage him to try new stuff. What he likes, he eats alot of. I've stopped worrying as I was also very fussy and now I eat anything as a adult.

I guess my point is, watered down versions of some of his traits may not go away, but it gets ALOT better. The clingyness will get lots better, as will the sleeping. Fussy eating may remain, but you will accept that in time. It may take another two years of teeth gritting, but I guarantee, he will be much more bog-standard little boy, getting into scrapes and running off without a backward glance to play two years from now.

Agree that your DH needs to force himself into the picture though. Two is a very difficult age and a difficult baby is often still hard work at 2. But he will change. Something clicks for clingy kids at around 4 and they realise there is alot of fun to be had they are perhaps missing out on!

I found it got a little bit easier every six months or so and then suddenly much, much easier when they started school aged 4/5. And a non-sleeping clingy child is really, really, really exhausting (speaking from experience - though I just gave up and co-slept till she was 4 to stay sane!), so try not to compare yourself to other parents whose experiences might be very different.

minipie, I do adapt things based on how bad the night has actually been! But generally he settles between 7 and 8 (usually nearer 8), bath, jim jams, BF, stories then he goes in the cot and I sing or tell soft stories while he drifts off. On the best nights I just sit there and shhh, takes maybe half an hour average.

He wakes up usually twice a night since being night weaned. This is lots better than previously, when I fed him it would be more like 5/6 times. But now that we're insisting he stays in his room it means actually getting up and settling him which takes up to an hour each time. Last two days we haven't been able to resettle at 4.30am and he;s been up from then! We gave it over an hour both times then gave up. He naps for about an hour and a half in the day, around midday if he's slept 'in' til 6/6.30 but earlier if he's been up at 5 or 4.30!! He does seem to really need the nap, he will 'agree' if I suggest it by heading to the stairs which again was previously unheard of. When he wakes it's as if he just wants to check we're still there, really. Just moans, sounds so tired, but if we don't go in after a few minutes he starts calling our names and getting upset. We just can't see how to convince him not to wake up. I suppose it just takes time but we've given it SO much time already!

Re DH: my DH also works long hours, not there for bedtime. He does the early mornings (DD wakes at 6-6.30 and DH looks after her till about 7.15) so I get an extra bit of sleep then. Could your DH do the same?

I try to be pretty firm about DH doing his fair share at weekends - DH was a bit crap at first "I don't know what to give her for lunch" but I put my foot down and left him to it, and he got somewhat better. Can you do this? Also as I say, can you try to institute a habit of DH taking DS out for a few hours on a Saturday morning? (we haven't quite got there yet...)

Ok, so you've been co sleeping but recently stopped. There will be a painful transition period but you may find he sleeps better in the end. It's up to you how you handle the transition - CC, gradual retreat etc - important thing is consistency, and that you share the load between you and DH...

Thanks for the sympathy everyone btw! I just think everyone's experiences are so different. I think it gets me down that so many people seem to have their second or get pg with the next around now, as DH and I both agree that we are so not ready!

Some days I feel as exhausted as I did in the first six months, but of course I wouldn't dare say that to someone with 2 kids or with a newborn as they naturally assume that at this point things are really different.

Cross post sorry!

If he is used to you being there when he falls asleep, that may be why he needs you when he wakes in the night. But it's harder to get him to settle in the night than at bedtime, because he isn't so tired.

Can you try to get him going to sleep by himself at bedtime? Carry on with the stories etc but leave before he's actually asleep, try to get him doing the last bit himself.

Similarly, in the night, my suggestion would be that you DO go in when he wakes, give him a quick cuddle then put him down and tell him it's sleep time, give him a few strokes and reassurances, then leave the room. If you totally ignore him when he wakes he'll probably just think you haven't heard and will yell louder. At least if you go in and tell him sleep time, he knows what he's meant to be doing iyswim.

Hopefully once he's got the knack of going back to sleep by himself, you won't need to go in any more.

It will be tough...

Oh, you poor thing. 2 is a tough age. Dd is now 6, and 2 seems a long time ago - it definitely will get better! The clingyness and the sleep will get better. As for food, if the stuff he is eating is reasonably healthy, I wouldn't worry if he's eating small and often rather than in proper meals.

It's a relief to get to the stage when your dc has enough common sense for you to leave them to potter around in their bedroom doing their thing and not have to hover over them all the time. The constant need to hover is exhausting.

Oh, and don't assume that mums with no. 2 are finding it easier - often people decide just to get the tough years over with as quickly as possible.

Thanks minipie, all that makes a LOT of sense… I'm afraid mine is not very proactive and I did have a bit of a meltdown at him quite recently as he just seems to 'hang around' at the weekend - he'd never offer to take DS out on his own, wouldn't even think to make his meals, he just assumes I'll do it. If I say 'can you make the lunch' he says, like yours, 'I don't know what he wants'! That's a really good suggestion about the early shift in the morning… I could ask but I think I'd get an incredulous look as DH would want his space to get ready for work I suspect! Also if he knows I'm there DS will just badger me. I really think parenthood is easier for dads!! I will suggest that though.

Right there is nothing wrong with feeling relaxed when he isnt on you you need w break you are touched out especially if you are still breast feeding him are you trying to wean him off bf I guess he is adjsting to that and id keep sending your husband to him even if he is upset, but its just hard and if dad is being lazy you need to get him doing more , it wil get better you have started with having him in nursery and in his own bed be consistent, although my eldest dd was a terrible sleeper

Oh, and I co-slept till dd was past her sixth birthday. Round about then, she decided she was fine on her own and airily dismissed me.

You know on Saturday just go out even if you need to give your dh instructions leave lunch if you have too folk might say you are treating dad like a child but if he is used to you doing evrrything then he is just going to act clueless be assertive say im going to town you can stsy here with son ill be back in2 hours and just go,

I slept on and off with d1 till her sister was born she was nearly 5, not every night just when she wouldnt settle

I found it really hard becoming a mum. It wasn't really what I expected. Sometimes I'm not sure if having a child was the right thing for me. DD is nearly 8. I spent the best part of 2 years feeling like shit and not wanting to be near her because she was a terrible feeder and then eater. My life revolved around her meals, which took hours....
Today, she is still fussy eater, but eats meals within 20mins or so, which is something I thought she would never do. I do love her, she is the kindest, funniest, most intelligent little girl, but she is becoming moody and argues back. Her behaviour isn't great at the moment either. I feel that I am always doing something wrong, and will never be a good a mum as my mum is to me. I am finding it difficult to feel unconditional love for her. Luckily DP (her dad too) love her to bits and has more patience than I do, and my parents adore her. I feel guilty, sad and angry with myself for my attitude.
Mothering isn't easy. It doesn't come naturally to everyone. And it's not necessarily the best thing in the world.