Ive Just shopped someone for benefit fraud, do I deserve to burn in hell.

[Gulitladen]

I feel quite bad.

This person is an acquaintance, She was a single parent for a few months, then she met someone who pretty much moved in, he was paying her bills for her and moved in properly earlier this year.

She has always worked full time with a salary of around 20k.

She seems to have an awful lot of money, and, as a single parent myself, I couldnt quite work it out. However, I have seen her tax credits renewal form as she didnt understand something and asked me to have a look for her, and shes claiming to be a lone parent, working 16.3 hours a week, earning 12k a year less than she actually is.

She is also claiming housing benefit as a single parent.

So, I have completed the DWP form and sent it off. I couldnt help it, it makes me see red.

But I now feel terrible.

, have an accidental pregnancy, Was it an immaculate conception Downey

We have had classism from you and now misogyny.

What are you going to come out with for the hat trick I wonder.

And they are not offhand throwaway comments. They are extremely harmful ones and perpetuate a myth.

Yes you stand by what you and others have done..........you are playing different rules for different folks though. Because you are applying different rules to those who you perceive to be lower than you.

Corey you chose you route and the moral legal way. Be secure in your choice. You could cheat, buy your flat and become a self sufficient secure homeowner, but you choose not to and to do it the right way and that's admirable, in some ways, but I support my cousin for getting out of the system and not having the life she was expected to and was on track for.

Yes your cousin got out of it on the back of someone else

Your cousin to be fair is a very poor example. It takes loads of people 5 years plus and more to save for a house deposit.

Why was the only option fiddling benefits or being unemployed forever? Its just made her a few quid to put down on the flat, a little bit quicker.

We could all make false claims and travel the world.

Like I said before, I had every empathy with the situation you were in, your cousin, erm not so much!

Darkest how on earth was it misogynistic to say accidental pregnancy?? She was young, had an oops, decided to keep it and was given a council flat to move out of her mother's council flat. I don't judge her for that at all. I don't even judge her for saying she wasn't returning to work because she got more on benefits than in her previous job, that's just logical financial sense, however ludicrous it is. What I judge her for is then saying she had no intention of ever trying to get out and that she'd try to get pg again "to get more money".

I'm not classist either, I have nothing against any class, but I do have a problem with those who have an attitude that the state owes them a living and who never try to change their lives and get out of the benefit system, legally or by cheating, and I do have a problem with those tarring everyone with the same brush.

No wonder people say benefits need changed when someone is able to claim jsa, work cash in hand, save a deposit then buy a council flat at a knock down price to sell it on at a massive profit on the back of others.

No-one gets more money for being out of work than for being in work. That's a myth. I work the minimum hours you can, on minimum wage to get WTC and CTC. I asked a few weeks ago when I thought I'd have to leave work due to childcare issues how much I'd get on JSA. I'd be £50 a week worse off.

Harold I said another 5+ years, it already took her that to save up for the flat. So she claims for 5 ish whilst cheating then is out of the system forever, or she claims for 10+, 15 even, maybe more, to get out of the system legitimately. Which is better for the taxpayer who doesn't want to pay for her life? Pay for her for 5 years, or pay for her for 15? Surely it's simple maths? Isn't it? Or would you prefer to pay for those doing it honestly for 3 times longer?

Doin I get 170pw more working 16hrs than claiming benefits.

You keep saying that people's only option is to cheat or be in the system forever.

In reality she would have been working, paying taxes, and still able to live in her council flat.

How do we know she wouldn't have got promotions or training opportunities in the time she was working which meant a payrise bonuses and the chance to buy just as soon?

Sorry your cousin is still a poor example, in my opinion.

I still wouldn't have shopped her though.

You don't like people who feels the state owes them a living, it you don't mind people who feel the state owes them a house deposit.

I am getting mightily confused, and I started out agreeing with you here.

But why would she be in the system for year's, that would be her choice to stay in he system. She could have not fiddled the system and worked where she was. Again why would she choose to be on benefits just because she was in a council flat.

Sheer greed imo.

Cleanin this was 20 years ago, I'm sure it's changed now (I hope!) though I certainly would have been far worse off by a huge amount if I'd gone into a minimum wage job legitimately at the time. There was no way I could have survived, even the benefits advisor at the jobcentre agreed. My choice was simple. Stay on benefits only, lose everything I had left, or go to work at whatever I could find be it bar or shop work or cleaning or whatever was available till my proper job came up and still lose everything including the car and phone to get me to and from work and get me interviews, or cheat for a while and then be back on track having nor lost everything and be out of the system. Sorry but I cannot see any way it would make any logical sense to do either of the 2 legal and moral options.

Isnt it weird how benefit claiments have such extreme lifestyles.

According to the experts on there they are all either sitting smoking weed all day and never ever working whilst they have 15 kids or they are travelling the world and buying handbags.

Gosh.

Its all go in the world of benefits Daily Mail innit?

And yes, I do think I am cool, and rather groovy and happening too.

You don't like people who feels the state owes them a living, it you don't mind people who feel the state owes them a house deposit

That ^^

I am just so so confused now devere.

I got confused at the point where an accidental pregnancy is misogynistic and swearing makes us cool kids.

I'm not classist either, I have nothing against any class, but I do have a problem with those who have an attitude that the state owes them a living and who never try to change their lives and get out of the benefit system, legally or by cheating, and I do have a problem with those tarring everyone with the same brush.

How long do you hunk the welfare system would last with people like you and your cousin milking it. It's meant to be there for people who need it not people to use it to get where they want to be as quick as they can. Seriously how long do you think it would last? RTB was the biggest fuck up ever enabling people to make a fast buck whilst taking away much needed housing. Most of its now in the hands of BTL landlords on my estate

I don't think the state owes them a house deposit, she did that with her own incredibly hard work. She could have not bothered and stayed where she was and everyone else would have been paying for her for another 15 years. I'd personally rather she cheat and get out earlier and then be in a position to pay back tenfold, than stay where she was, work legally and 15 years later the state is still paying for her house. I'm not saying the only option is cheat of stay there, I'm saying that is some people's only option. My friend with the council tax for example. Her choice is simple. She is in an expensive house with a higher tax bracket because when she was married to a wealthy man he bought it. They've now split up and the house is on the market to sell. She's training and claiming benefit as well as looking after 3 kids. The council has just changed the law on council tax benefit and she has to magic this money out of thin air and has had court summonses to pay it. She doesn't have a magic wand and can not claim any benefit to cover this and has no way of cutting back any more. If she gets a legitimate job she loses the benefit she already gets, pays out more for her training, legal fees and expenses as well as the council tax. She has 6 months left of training before she will get a decent wage and be able to afford these bills on her own. So she can do cleaning in the mean time around her kids just to cover this bill, or she can get herself in an even worse situation, lose her benefit, have insurmountable legal and training costs, give up on the training, represent herself in court against her rich ex husband's expensive lawyer and end up with less in the long run, still not be able to afford the bills afforded claim for far longer than 6 months. I don't understand how afford day one can think it's better to do it the "right" way for longer than the "wrong" way short term and be out of it? The benefits system is seriously fucked up and I was very
very close to being sucked in and staying there. I started getting the mentality that I may as well give up, accept my fate, lose everything, and stay there, it's easier and others seem happy, and even now I sometimes think maybe it would have been better than struggling to find money and pay my way and the stress of the possibility of losing my house etc, but I didn't want to give up yet, I want a property to leave to my kids one day. I was stuck in a situation where I could have spiraled out of control and I know me, I would have given up and stayed there, or I could fight while I still had the strength and get out of it. As did my cousin, as is my friend, and I can't see how that's wrong.

If she gets a legitimate job she gets more benefits. You are never worse off for working.

I am cool. And groovy.

I buy handbags as well. Is that not allowed?

Are handbags only allowed for fraudulent benefit claimants and the "tax payers" have to walk around with their stuff in a tesco carrier bag, telling everyone that they cannot possibly buy a handbag because even though they work 79 hours a week they cannot afford it and that one next door never worked a day in her life, has got her boyfriend living with her AND can afford a proper bag?

My last word on this subject is......

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

(the noise that brainless sheep make as they are herded to their destruction whilst believing every bit of processed shit that has been fed to them)

Oh I thought that was your goat MrsD

Corey I don't think the benefits system is sustainable while so many people are either trapped in it or are happy to stay in it long term and until people are actually helped to get out of it, I mean really helped, not facing more and more red tape and restrictions and bills for doing the right thing, I can't see the situation improving. If they offered some sort of break like 1 year on benefits including council tax and education & legal if they need it depending on the circumstances, plus during that time you can work cash in hand (with a cut off obviously, not saying you can earn £20k and still claim, but minimum wage) then at the end of that year they cut you off but by then you should be well on your way to being back on your feet then great. I would have taken that deal! Thousands would and would be out of the system forever if they were instead of struggling for far longer. I think real help for a limited time would be far better than minimal help long term. I think if they could do something like that and offer a choice... I mean in your situation, if people had got off your back for one year, let you stay where you were and gave you one year to sort your life out, could you have done it and not had to go into a council house and on benefits longer term? What's better for the country? 1 year of decent help then out of the system, or 10 years of basic help and housing? I dunno I'm just throwing ideas around, I've not really thought about it, but all I know is that I know a lot of people who have fallen on hard times and faced the choice of cheating and getting back on their feet or staying legal and nd making their situation worse and it's not a choice anyone should have to make.