to think the poorest pensioners in the UK aren't actually that poor

[twistedsista]

The minimum amount a pensioner will get at the moment if they have made no provisions is 7714.2 pa tax free + free bus / train (depending on areas) + winter fuel allowances + warm home discount + free perscriptins + consesionry prices for many things etc and most bought homes when they were reasonable so they have minimal housing costs.

Compare this to a single person on nmw who could be paying 25 a week on bus travel, 130 a week on rent with no hope of buying. they have to pay tax and if they are under 45 they will never get the benefits that they are paying for pensionrs to have at the moment.

I'm not being ageist, just looking at the sums

Agree with Fatal Cabbage.

The reality of growing old is that your health inevitably gets worse and life gets harder and more expensive.

Also, less money for pensioners only helps younger generations if they don't then have to foot the bill for their parent's care. Equally it's my experience that pensioners generally spend any extra money on their children and grandchildren.

I use to work with the elderly and the conditions some live in still haunts me. I live in a retirement town and there are lots of older people whose house have had no work done in 20+ yrs so no central hearing or double glazing = freezing and so many do not have the money to have it done and if they own their own home or d

I use to work with the elderly and the conditions some live in still haunts me. I live in a retirement town and there are lots of older people whose house have had no work done in 20+ yrs so no central hearing or double glazing = freezing and so many do not have the money to have it done now. My DH gran had a lovely life style after she retired BUT her husband died quite young and she work her whole life so she was v entitled to enjoy her retirement. My grandad on the other hand barely makes ends meet and he worked all his life also. The major difference is DH gran owned properties and had her husband private pension. My Gd always rented and my nan didn't have a pension

I'm a "comfortable" pensioner, although I still work part time. I've worked part or full time since I was 14. I worked part time while I was at university and started back to work part time when the boys were very young. We didn't have more children than we could afford, although more would have been nice.

Both DCs left university without debt because we supported them (and they worked part time) and I'm sure it's the same for a lot of people in our position. We both do voluntary work in the community, as do a lot of baby boomers. Some charities would collapse without the voluntary support of our generation.

It's insulting of the OP to imply that our generation is somehow leeching on society. Many of us have put a great deal in, saved and invested wisely and are reaping some benefits from that. We aren't "lucky" we've worked bloody hard to get what we have. And we are still putting a lot back in. I'm still working (for a community organisation) because they can't get anyone younger prepared to work for what they pay me.

Women get equal pay, in general, now because women my age fought for that right. Abortion is legal and birth control easily available because we as a generation made it so.

Both DCs are working, paying into pension schemes and saving because they know they are going to get old, just like we have.

Some of you need to stop whining at us and look to those individuals and companies avoiding and evading tax. Turning ordinary people against each other lets those with the real money and power hold on to it.

Don't waste your time complaining about us or moaning about having to support older people who haven't been able to save and direct your complaints to those in power who let the rich get away with their tax behaviour.

There will always be those people, rich and poor, who play the system, complain about the system if you don't like it. Don't try to start a generation war.

I was with you until you said you weren't lucky and have worked bloody hard for what you've got. boomer.

No.

You didn't lift a finger to make house prices go insane, and that's the driver for wealth among the older "haves". And the cause of lower living standards for the young - who are also working bloody hard but getting less for it.

When you were young, mortgage limits were typically 2.5 times salary (or less). Now it's 5 times salary. Renting was deregulated in 1984 and social housing sold off.

So you may have worked bloody hard, but that's not all that's making you comfortable. You happen - through no fault or merit of your own - to be riding a peak which means a particular cohort got the benefit of everything that was going. From free NHS care from childhood, to free university education, to house prices which started low enough to buy then shot up to deliver a profit, to a retirement age of 60/65, to a state pension from the UK's non-paid up NI system that younger people simply WILL NOT GET no matter how hard they work (system has to shift to fully paid up or shrink).

I'm glad for you. But a little acknowledgement on your part that your comfort is partly due to your lucky position in history, wouldn't go amiss. And might make you appreciate that people 40 years younger than you will have different lives no matter how hard they work.

conference, you'll probably find the school buses "laid on" to transport children to school are paid for by the children's families.

Round here the cost is £700 per year, per child, (with a small reduction of the second child), termly in advance and with no concessions for those on a low income.

Well said partial!

Guess what boomer the generation after you will be working just as hard if not harder and will get even less for their hard work. Now you just like to beat them down so they carry on working to support a while generation that took out more than they paid in? This won't end well.

An acknowledgement from some younger people about the benefits they have thanks to we older people would also be good. I was born at a time when it was easier to buy property more cheaply, and took the decision to buy. I didn't buy my council house taking another social house out of the reach of those in need of housing, like others younger than me have done.

I was also born at a time of low wages for women, no family allowance for the first child, no after school clubs or wrap around care, no DLA, no carers' allowance, no housing benefit. And that's just the short list.

My university education wasn't free, my parents had to pay towards my living expenses. My grant allowed me £6 a term. I paid into the system and others benefited from that - I'm not complaining but I'm also not refusing it now that it's my turn.

There are pluses and minuses for every generation. Property is our plus. Our minus is that we started work for less pay than men for the same job. We had to pay through the nose for private childcare - nowhere easily available to send our children before and after school. Parents of children with disabilities got no extra support from the state, etc.

I repeat what I said - don't have a go at us. Do something about it - get out on the streets and march, demand that your MPs vote to bring back council housing and stop the sale of council houses demand that high profile and rich people pay their fair share of tax and not hide their money away. Demand changes to the tax system that allows huge companies to pay no tax despite taking millions from our pockets. That's where your enemies are - not your parents and grandparents.

twistedsista what on earth do you mean by, "This won't end well?" That sounds very much like a threat.

Are you going to drag us from our care homes and back to the workhouse? Push our mobility scooters into the canal? Invade our homes and throw us out on the street so you can have our houses?

Weird.

Well said Boomer.

This divide and conquer has to stop, people need to fight the government, not fight each other to get a t the scraps.

The title of this thread is an example of begrudgery and envy. Let's set the poor against the poor.

Let's make out that the only reason there are not better benefits for the young is because the old are allowed a certain questionable degree of comfort! And lets campaign to remove whatever comforts the old have instead of campaign to get better benefits for everyone!

Get more training and qualifications and you would not be on minimal wage.

"Are you going to drag us from our care homes and back to the workhouse? Push our mobility scooters into the canal? Invade our homes and throw us out on the street so you can have our houses?"

No, but I do anticipate an enormous section of the baby boomer generation, (unless there is at least some private acknowledgement - even if only behind closed doors - and that is not a threat, not that you are in any way affected by any kind of "threat" about it anyway are you???) ending their days in a much greater state of lonliness and isolation than they anticipate due to the refusal to have any debate about intergenerational issues now.

ending their days in a much greater state of lonliness and isolation than they anticipate due to the refusal to have any debate about intergenerational issues now.

I'm not really sure what you mean by that. Are you going to put us all in solitary confinement? Really, I have no idea what you mean, please explain.

Most of us have friends and families why should we anticipate loneliness?

Bubbles this whole generation of people you speak about have no duty towards you whatsoever. The government has. Pick your battles and get them to ensure there is care for all through a better tax system, no a handful of people who are doing their best.

Divide and conquer.

Working poor have it bad.
Unemployed have it bad.
OAPs have it bad.
Disabled and long term sick have it bad.
Carers have it bad.
Single parents have it bad.
Working parents have it bad.
SAHPs have it bad.
Natives have it bad.
Immigrants have it bad.

Divide and conquer.

Boomer51 you wont be in "solitary confinement" you will all have each other
I would be very happy to see total generational apartheid and I am sure as the years go on this is increasingly what will happen (if it is not happening already). I know many young people who feel the same

OK the Baby Boomers don't feel like that is what is happening at the moment because they have such enormous financial muscle they just go & spend some money and (I guess) that makes them feel less lonely, or they go on "Question time" and belt out some noises about what lazy entitled stupid wastful people those under the age of 60 are, and why don't they all start "protesting" outside number 10 downing street, taking their clothes off, singing "we shall not be moved" and "rebelling against the establishment". It worked for you didn't it? So why don't all those unemployed folk in the age bracket 16 - 30 try it I wonder

Divide and conquer....

And the rich have never had it so good.

Bubbles in the real world politics actually is what changes things. If you want to let politicians do what they feel like doing carry on as you are, whingeing.

Agree agree agree, Beyond.

When not spending pots and pots of money what I do now is work with disadvantaged teenagers, Bubbles, and they quite like me. Some I first knew 17 years ago are still in touch, so I don't anticipate loneliness any time soon.

Then there are my friends and family, I don't expect to be the last one to die. Do you think they'll all turn against me because I own my own house?

Then I'm involved in some community action and local politics to try to make changes that will benefit all of society, not just my generation. I'm not as narrow minded as you seem to be.

What are you doing to bring about the change you desire apart from whining, "It's not fair!" on an internet forum?

Direct action did work for us. Why don't you try it some time?

Total generational apartheid? Don't be daft. Thank God the younger generations aren't all like you.

And agree with boomer. An acknowledgement by all generations - and economic strata - of the things we benefit from that are thanks to luck or other people's fights for our rights, would be welcome.

And an antidote to the divide and conquer.

Any pensioner renting is going to be hideously badly off. So yes, they could be in desperate poverty.