To consider having DC3 on basis of hiring a Night Nanny and Perhaps a Day one too!

[splodge2001]

DS is now 12 and DD is 5. I really can't be arsed with night time feeds, sleep deprivation, depression, anxiety and all the stuff that's really awful about little babies (i'm an awful worrier)

So, having ruled out DC3 I was sitting here wondering if, well, I could have my cake and eat it by having a Night Nanny and maybe a day one too! I'm not rolling in cash -far from it but I live in London and could probably re-mortgage to come up with the money.

Are night nannies any good? I suffered dreadful insomnia/sleep deprivation with DS and DD.

As hideous as night feeds are, it's such an important stage more than just hunger, whereby baby establishes a trusting relationship with primary carer, learning that their needs will be responded to. Like Ig said it's about bonding.... Mum learns babies cries etc

Sorry but I think unless it's essential for a day AND night nanny, it seems very sad for the baby...and mum really. You'd miss so much.

I'd always thought I'd like three children but given how hard pregnancy and early baby days are I'm reconsidering.

Can I just say I take that allll back with regards to breastfeeding mums of twins having a bit of help in the early days...huge respect to you!!

Mrs chickpea, are you serious?!

I've spent the past 9 months being awoken every single hour at night! Even an angel wouldn't enjoy that. Get real.

OP - do what you please.

I would get a night nanny for a few nights a week if I could afford it. I am fortunate I have family close by who visit few times a week and play with dd while I can shove a wash on. I also know they're there if I need someone to watch dd , which is very rare - bit I am lucky I have this choice. Very lucky.

I don't think it is fair to judge other women on their choices. As pp have stated, many women have loads of help from family visiting them etc .

I think this has really helped. Don't understand why everyone is so against re-mortgaging though!

Why would you put years of extra payments on your mortgage just to avoid parenting duties for a few months. Sheer madness, finances can change at any point. What does your husband think of the remortgage?

A day and night nanny does seem very strange, how can you bond if the whole parenting is practically outsourced.

If you live in a small flat, will it hold five people or will you need to move and further increase the mortgage again.

If you want a little help, why not just save for it. Pretend your salary has gone down to maternity pay (which presumably you can manage on) and save the difference. If you don't use all the savings you'll have a starting hand on childcare for when you return to work.

My concern would be about bonding, if you aren't looking after the baby day or night when will you spend time with it?

As a maternity nurse I can assure all of the above who are worried about the baby bonding with mother and father that it is more than possible. All of my past charges numbering up into the hundreds now have great bonds with their parents. I often am the only support the parents have and firmly believe it takes a whole community to raise a child and living in the western world is not really a community environment.

Even when I'm on 24 hour positions it doesn't mean the babies spend no time with their parents. I can bring parents breakfast in bed or make breakfast while baby is with parents. Help run errands or cook other meals freeing up time for bonding time. Help settle the baby both during the day and at night so parents can eat, shower and sleep. I guess much like an auntie, sister, mother, mother in law etc would do in a culture that we lived in close communities.

Mrswishywashy that sounds amazing. How much would would that cost until the baby was in a good sleep pattern and do you sleep train as well?

Op have you decided what to do?

I would only remortgage for something that would add value to my home, so new kitchen, bathroom, roof, extension etc.

Not a fab car, holiday, school fees, and not a nanny.

If you have equity, then think about buying a larger place.

Heraldgerald - maternity nurses range for a single baby from about £140-200 per 24 hours. I'm mid range. My first maternity nurse positions were 24/6 however I much prefer the ones now that are 24/5 as it gives the parents more time alone with their baby. What I think works well is the first two weeks after birth when partner is on paternity leave the parents going it alone with support from midwifes and often I pop in or give advice over email. Then me coming in for a month after, I do a minimum of 24/4. This gives parents time to rest but I can also advise on implementing a routine and teaching tips to make things easier in the long run. By then the baby at six weeks is usually quite predictable and going to sleep in the evenings with one or two night feedings and days are on a flexible routine. Parents are well rested and ready for the next stages. Longer term placements that I've had of 12 weeks or longer the babies are usually sleeping 12 hours at night with possibly one feed. I've had a couple of babies sleep 10 hours at night at 8 weeks. I also to sleep and feeding consultations. I love my job and wish there was a system where parents got more support in the home.

I'm confused. You have 2 kids already, you can't face the baby stage again, and you don't have much money to spare. Seems like a no brainer to me. Why not stay as you are?

If you want someone else to look after the baby during the day and the night, why not just leave someone else to do the pregnancy and delivery too, and just get on with your life as it is?

If what you want is an older child, then adopting would be the logical answer.

No judgement from me!

I do love the baby stage but second time round I was exhausted as I had a toddler and non sleeping baby. I think any sane person would find that hard. I was up 5 times a night and barely functioning....

We must be nuts as I'm pregnant again, and my first two are 4 and 2. I've decided two years hard work is worth it long term and I will do the following differently -

• might give a bottle of formula at night to achieve more sleep. My two solely breastfed babies were hungry and the night feeds second time nearly broke me. Formula babies seem to sleep better

• find a student/trainee nurse for a couple of hours a day even three days a week for the first few months. For me, the horrendous time is 4 pm to 6 pm when trying to make dinner/still breastfeeding

• I found the baby whisperer book when DC2 was 4 months and it saved me. Going to use it from day 1 this time.

Do whatever works! For me, a day nanny wouldn't be my choice as the time with a newborn is so special.

Re mortgage ha ha

I'm nine weeks in with my second and it's exhausting! Great, but so tiring and I know I wouldn't do it again. What I think would be the ideal though, is if they re-jigged the shared parental leave so that the father could take his portion concurrently with the mother. So, say the mother planned to take 9 months off and the father take 3 months after that - instead, both parents have the first three months together and the mother the following six months on her own. Then, you could parent together, it would soften the worst of the sleep deprivation, you'd both be confident and familiar with the baby's routine. I'd consider a third under those circumstances (never mind I'd quite like to outsource pregnancy as well, come to think of it, after two lots of hyperemesis...)

I would have had a third if I could have coped with more sleep deprivation. Part time nanny who lets you catch up on sleep/me time, would have been my idea of heaven.

It sounds very sensible to me OP. When I had my third or would have been so handy to have an extra pair of hands. Good luck whatever you decide.

YANBU but you might not need both. Having the night nanny might set you up to cope better with the days. Daytimes with a baby might be fun if you weren't utterly knackered and you could probably get a cleaner much more cheaply. You could have a nice daily routine based on getting out and about with the baby for a couple of hours each morning while someone did some laundry and cleaning and you might quite enjoy life if you had slept 8 hours.

Or, if you want to bf, you could have a night nanny (who would bring the baby to you for feeds and otherwise soothe it) and a part time day nanny (who would look after the baby and the other dcs while you sleep in in the morning) and then you would feel better for the afternoons.

I don't blame you for not wanting to go through all that again.

To the people whining about "bonding" etc, it is utterly unreasonable and a historical anomaly that we expect tiny babies to be supported 24 hours a day off the body of one woman. Traditionally you would have had a lot of help, whether paid or unpaid (your neighbours, mother, sisters, or even, going back a while, your lactating friends and sisters). If you want another baby, do what you need to do to enjoy it. I wish I had had enough help and sleep to enjoy my babies' babyhoods more.

Personally I'd enjoy the two children that you have. All the outside help in the world isn't going to make the age differences any smaller.

So you remortgage - let's say you add 50k to your mortgage which would just about cover a nanny for the first year, with overnight assistance for the first 12 weeks. ? In the context of the value of a smallish Central London flat, it's not a huge sum of money but the actual cost to you is closer to 100k by the time it is paid off, PLUS the cost of raising the child.
Mostly though - there'd be the point after that first year when all the help would vanish and you would be at home with a moody pre-teen, a toddler and a early years school child. Madness . Get a puppy

What allhail said at the end. Spot on.

It is nuts to have a consider having a third child if you could only do it if you borrowed money to employ a night nanny plus a day nanny. Anyway I doubt that it would stop you worrying and feeling anxious. It could make things worse.

I'm going to buck the trend. I don't see the issue with remortgaging, on the assumption that you won't be on the breadline if you do. How much would these staff cost you? Say, £80k? If you've got a multiple of that in equity I say go for it. Money comes and money goes, but another child...

Ultimately it depends how badly you want this third child.

Final point, don't forget the ongoing costs: are you going to privately educate? Do you take foreign holidays? Will you need to move house? A third child can often propel you into a whole new league of spending that the second child didn't, well after the maternity nurse has packed her bags and left.

Fascinating. Thanks mrswishywashy for your post. If only I could afford it and you sound lovely.

Yes it does seem madness that one woman is expecTed to do it all.

I'm going to buck the trend. I don't see the issue with remortgaging, on the assumption that you won't be on the breadline if you do.

Borrowing money to pay a nanny to look after your child seems like an issue to me. OP has said that she isn't rolling in cash so presumably could find it hard to pay the mortgage if interest rates go up. Unlike an unsecured loan if she falls behind with payments she could lose the home. Also if house prices go down in the future, OP might end up in negative equity.

Maybe adopt an older child?

Or buy a dog.