To spy on my nanny?

[Pugaboo]

I think I probably am BU but I'm not sure my nanny is telling me the truth about a few things. Things don't seem to add up.

I don't want to go into a lot of detail as it will out me but it includes leaving my son to cry and/or ignoring him for long periods. So not life threatening but not what I would want for him either.

I don't want to disrupt my son too much but equally I want to be reassured she is treating him in the right way.

So would all of you be happy being spied in at work? Allowing your bosses to secretly film you because they had a 'gut feeling'?

I wouldn't care if there were camera's in my place of work, as long as they're not in the toilet. It is a work not home. There are cameras everywhere nowadays.

Being slightly facetious.
The op could film her child, that would be fine. If the Nanny happens to get in the pictures....

I would be fine to be filmed at work, indeed I often am as an academic, as I record all my lectures, often am filmed for videos and students now ask if they can record conversations we have if say they come to see me to question an essay mark or get feedback. I don't allow them to record other students, but I like to think if I were secretly filmed that I would be ok- I might swear a bit and say the odd thing about my university in an unguarded moment, but my basic advice and interaction with students would be above board.

I am not advocating this, just saying I tend to act at work in a way that if anyone called by or taped it secretly, I would be fine.

I would also say though, if you don't want to go the nanny cam route, that just popping in quietly, letting yourself through the front door and going into the room might well reveal something- if your little one is sobbing and she's in another room, you would see that. Unannounced visits would be good. As would 'accidentally' leaving your digi-recorder running one morning...sounds might reassure you or alarm you.

Have you talked with your husband or anyone else about your worries- and what are the reasons you are concerned?

Could you not just start by talking to her? Outline your concerns?

Nannys have employment rights as well and you cannot just get rid, there are the usual steps to take. Warnings ect.

If I remember correctly you can install cameras but if you have sound you have to inform the nanny of their presence.

Also is she live in or out? Would you have the cameras in communal spaces where in her down/off time you could still spy?

As others have said if there is a break down of trust something obviously needs to be done. How long has she been with you? Were her references happy with her performance? Could you have weekly or monthly meetings where you could both lay out your concerns or worries?

I would. I think it's morally and ethically dubious, and possibly illegal, but if it were my DD then moral/ethical/legal boundaries go out the window, as far as I'm concerned.

If I had any concerns I would raise them with her asap. If I didn't trust her I would look for someone else. As a nanny if found out I was being filmed without my knowledge then I would leave.

How about taping but not filming. You'd be able to hear if your dd was being left to cry but wouldn't see the nanny scratching her bum!

It might be someone else's home but it is still a place of work, of course you can still expect privacy, I certainly wouldn't be expecting to be recorded without my knowledge or consent.

A decent employer would raise concerns and follow procedures. Did you set out disciplinary procedures in your contract? Why don't you do an appraisal with her and tell her your concerns.
Filming her without her consent is immoral.

I agree Ploppy.

What is giving you these niggles? Is it somethig someone has said, or something you have witnessed ordo you have a gut feeling?

My take on this is that if you have concerns that your child is being mistreated, take whatever action you deem reasonable to make sure that they are safe and happy. I feel a little bad for the nanny not knowing about the nanny cam but still, I'm recorded all day at work and don't give a damn about it as I do nothing wrong (apart from posting on here....)

I'd feel far more guilty and upset finding out that my child was being mistreated and not having done anything about it.

From the flip side, if you have ever read "The boy who was raised as a dog" you will appreciate the impact of leaving a child for long periods of time without adequate loving nurturing care and attention. I think, as suggested above, that the you should film your child, to determine if he is OK. You will be able to see how long he is left crying and how long he is left alone without stimulation or loving attentive care.

If its too long, you then have evidence that your nanny was not taking care of the child, rather than attacking her personally. It becomes about your child, and her ability to take care of him.

If nothing else, it will put your mind at rest, You may think he is being left for long periods, but it may just be 3 minutes. But if you have proof that he is being left for an hour sobbing, you must act to safeguard your child.

"What's wrong with a professional conversation stating expectations, then checking back?"

Ah, the helpful "I just want to clarify, Nannysname, that my expectations are that you don't neglect my child or lie to me." followed up a few weeks later by "So, Nannysname, I wanted to check whether you've been lying to me at all? No? How about the neglect thing? All going well? Good..."

TortoiseUpATreeAgain - Totally agree - this is not a ' Please can you make sure you keep all the receipts for petty cash' situation If you 'raise your concerns' ie Are you neglecting my child ?? You are potentially putting your child at even further risk of neglect or even harm !

Video her

Well being of my child trumps morality of spying.

If I had concerns I'd
A. Get a new nanny
B. Spy

The problem with a. Is that the nanny loses her job, maybe wrongly. Is that fair to the nanny? I'd find it difficult to give a good reference too, as I'd feel guilty I case she does it with her new charges.

So for my own piece of mind and to save my own guilty feelings, I'd spy.

She's brought it upon herself if my suspicions were correct, if they aren't then she will be rewarded with greater trust and going up in my estimations.

Op? How do you know your child's being left to cry if you're not there?

I agree with what someone said up thread about just coming home unexpectedly and quietly. I remember before Christmas, I was sat on the floor with the kids with my back to the door. We were on the laptop finding Christmas songs to sing along to on YouTube and it was a good 10 minutes before I realised my boss was stood behind us.
She wasn't spying, she was just enjoying watching us (as normally kids stop everything they're doing when parents walk in, so parents miss out on seeing our interactions).
My boss eventually said 'isn't anyone going to say hello to me?!' Which is when we realised she was there! So you could easily do this as a way of checking up.
Also, couldn't you ring during the day? Surely if she's leaving the child to cry, then you would hear that in the background of the phone call?
I've found out after leaving a job that I'd been filmed for the past year, and although I hadn't done anything wrong, I was really embarrassed like someone else said. It's really not nice.

A feeling of being in private (specifically feeling unobserved because the vulnerable nonverbal person doesn't count as they can't say anything) is precisely what lets people who abuse the vulnerable do it.

This nanny is not in a private situation anyway - she's with the child she's caring for. She's at work. Should the fact that the child is nonverbal really make her feel like she has 'privacy' that deserves to be protected? I think that's actually quite a dangerous idea.

Vulnerable adults and children are protected by carers feeling that someone could be watching and possibly assessing how they're doing at any time. I think it's fine for the employers of the carers to video to check up on people and if I was in that job these days I'd assume that might be happening.

The scratching of embarrassing itches aside, what does it say about the caring you're doing if it's significantly different depending on whether or not you think a third party is watching? What sort of behaviour is OK for the baby or elderly person to witness/experience but not OK if a third party sees it? Nothing particularly good, I'd say.

Of course it can be overdone - If I was being watched all the time and micromanaged and every little thing I did wrong was picked at at the end of every day, I wouldn't want to work in that place, but it would be no different than any other job with an intrusive controlling boss. But some observation of carers' work is fine and a good safety net to protect vulnerable people from abusive carers.

Nannynoss, wouldn't you assume, these days, that you could be being filmed at any time?

I think small cheap devices for videoing and the scandals at care homes with family catching people by installing cameras have surely changed the game a bit.

I too would hate to find out later that I'd been filmed when I'd assumed I wasn't being, but I don't think I would make that assumption in the first place.

Skimmed thread - but how about audio recording around the house rather than filming?

It's hard to advise without knowing why you are suspicious all is not right.

I would want to know for certain.
I think I'd just be looking for another nanny that I trusted 100%.

But I don't know how you'd fire her without any proof or the legalities of recording.
Horrible situation to be in. DreamingAboutFlying (love the name) puts it far better than I could.

I'm with Ploppy on this one. You need to sit her down and have a proper conversation with her regarding your concerns.

Why would you want to set out to trap her unless you want to let her go anyway.

She is your employee, therefore you need to go about things in the correct manner, and not like some half hearted Miss Marple.