To refuse to pay school fees having withdrawn my dc because..

[bluestrawhat]

the person we were told would be the dcs' form teacher did not actually perform this role and instead left the class with a TA. This happened for 7 months without parents being informed and without the knowledge of the head teacher but with the knowledge of the deputy head. Mean time pastoral issues have been passed on by the supposed class teacher variously to other members of staff and TAs and there has been bullying which we think has not been dealt with adequately because the children are not clear who their form teacher actually is. Having tried to deal with these issues and received an apology from the head but not from the other teachers involved we decided to move schools and have not paid fees which the school is now pursuing. What is our position? TIA

Argh, but the deputy head colluded. This person knew what was going on and did nothing to prevent it. We were in a very odd position of the head saying he wished we'd said something earlier and we pointed out that the deputy had been entirely aware and not said anything when it was this person's responsibility. Cue an embarrassed silence. This points to serious failings at management level. It's not just that it happened and the consequences for the class and the failure to deal with bullying, it's the fact that it was allowed to happen. For 7 months.

So, the form teacher is fault. The fact that he is going doesn't make it ok. The lack of pastoral care has been damaging for the class. The head is at fault because he didn't know - why not? The deputy is at fault because he didn't know and didn't do anything about it even though he must have known (or should have) that what was happening was against school policy and was not communicated to parents.

Why did the teacher not do their form teacher duties? Where there other more pressing things? Illness? Do you know?

No good reason. Hence why asked to leave.

And in teaching you can't just not do one part of your job because there are 'more pressing things'.

But none of that is a reason for refusing to pay a business money that you contractually owe.

I really think you've made a mountain out of a molehill and with a bit more communication with the school or further with the governess this could have been sorted out without uprooting your children and causing this hassle.

Perhaps the class are particularly dull so the form teacher handed them over to the TA :)

I'm not sure you have a leg to stand on unless the DC were left unattended for large swathes of time.

The whole the Head teacher didn't know but the deputy did doesn't mean anything other than the deputy choose not to bother the head with the fact that Mr Slackoff had deferred his form duties to Mis highly efficient desperate to get in the good books TA.

They could argue that they are a teaching team and share the pastoral duties accordingly and it could even be argued that this is a better way of doing it.

Thanks for your thoughts Tequila. I really don't think that is the case. Our children have become increasingly distressed because of the failure of the school to get to grips with bullying and the lack of the most basic pastoral care. One of our complaints about bullying was simply ignored because of a lack of understanding of who was actually responsible for this particular class.

The head himself has deemed the fact that the form teacher simply chose not to do his job sufficiently serious to sack him.

There is no job where it's OK to simply not do an important aspect of it when the leader of your workplace has assigned you this duty and assumes you are doing it.

It is particularly serious if children (and parents) are not being properly cared for because the job is not being done.

The children were not 'dim'; they just accepted that the situation and took their problems to whoever was available at the time. This is the way it generally is with 7 year olds!

'They could argue that they are a teaching team and share the pastoral duties accordingly and it could even be argued that this is a better way of doing it.'

Er, no, they couldn't given the Head has said the situation is unacceptable and we have evidence that issues were dealt with ad hoc or not at all.

'Perhaps the class are particularly dull so the form teacher handed them over to the TA smile'

I'm sure you intended this to be funny. Under the circumstances it isn't.

I honestly don't know how you can hand out the money and not expect good communication and standards. I still think you're in the wrong, though. By the way you reply to people who disagree with you I think the school will eventually give up just to get rid of the hassle.

No, schools have insurances so they can pursue cases for unpaid fees and they do so. Much easier from their POV to turn it all over to the lawyers.

What has been posted here does not look like a strong case to break the contract. Have you actually had legal advice on the points you can support with evidence and the exact timelines?

Complaints proceedure not followed - don't think you have any chance what so ever of succeeding, sorry.

If the bullying was so bad I can't understand why you did not go into school and speak in person to the TA, form tutor, head of year, pastoral deputy AND head.

If my child had serious bullying issues I would not be relying on emails, and would have pushed on through the management levels.

I think it is highly unlikely school would just 'give up' on collecting the fees. They will persue this until you pay.

I don't think you have a case. Sorry.

Absolutely no way in the world would I be paying the fees. Not a chance.

They have clearly not performed the service that you were paying for! It's not so much the TA/teacher thing (even though that's completely unacceptable) but as you've mentioned several times, the way it was handled means that you can no longer trust the school IMO. We had a similar issue a few years ago with the school lying about certain things including the safety of the structure of the building and we withdrew DD1 immediately - and refused to pay a term's fees in lieu.

As to how hard they'll fight - probably quite a lot, but I would definitely be seeing it through. Good luck!

I get that you are cross about this and that it's sub-optimal but I agree with the poster that said if the bullying was such an issue you should have gone to school and spoken with the actual form teacher. You would have gotten to the bottom of things a lot sooner and the situation may have turned out differently.

My attempt at humour was also an attempt to make you see that this sort of thing happens for a number of reasons but that the DC are still cared for and happy.

I think that you have lost faith in the school and are now trying to construct a back-story.

It sounds to me as if your DTs have fallen victim to some internal politics. There may be a slim possibility that the Head is delighted with your complaint as it has allowed him to sack the member of staff in question in which case he may accept a deal on the outstanding fees.

'The head teacher has admitted the form teacher was at fault for abandoning her duties.'

Is the form teacher male or female?

The teacher / TA thing is not unacceptable in an independent school, a free school or an academy. It is perfectly acceptable under the rules.

Whilst most do use fully qualified teachers ime they are all within their rights to choose not to.

Form teacher's gender seems to have swapped. Whilst this is probably a genuine error here it is essential that you have this exactly accurate when putting a case together. Any slight error could mean your case would fall at the first hurdle.

You'd need to prove they were in breach of contract. There is some case law on this specifically in terms of child being withdrawn, school pursuing notice period fees, so suggest you speak to your solicitor.