Depressed and anxious about h's unwillingness to add me to deeds of house, have a will, or contemplate life insurance. Am I being unreasonable?

[tisrainingagain]

I am fully prepared to accept that I am being unreasonable but please be gentle with me!!

H and I have been together for 18 years and married for 12.5 of those. We have three dc (8, 10 and 12 years old). The house we live in is in h's name. He bought it when we were already living together not married. When I met him he owned a shop with a flat on top of this and it is the equity from this and a house he bought and sold after that which meant he could buy our house (with a mortgage). H is divorced from his first wife and very bitter about the fact that she got their family home which was worth more than the building he was awarded, and included a flat which can be rented out. His ex wife has a son who was about 4 when she married my now h and must have been about 14 when they got divorced - so his stepson.

Fast forward 16 years (from the date that he bought our family home), and we are married and have had three children. I am a stay at home mum which feels a bit redundant now that my youngest is 8. My h has since bought 2.5 more properties (2 are rented out, the .5 he recently bought with his brother and is doing up) and a martello tower which, when he gets the money together and gets planning permission, can also be done up and rented out as a holiday let. So property is one aspect of h's business - he is self-employed. Despite owning all of this, the mortgage (especially now that he has bought half of a house with his brother) is not small and h works really hard and struggles to cover bills etc....

Anyway, that sets the scene. What irks me is the fact that throughout our marriage h has always viewed himself as in some way being alone. I am not sure where I stand in his life and in fact we never talk about the future. He is very affectionate towards the dc but not to me. We are getting on much better these days than we have recently (we went through quite a long rough patch) and chat away (as long as it is about general stuff), but he never puts an arm around me or says anything nice.

Basically, I feel that the fact that h does not want to put me on the deeds (which predates the rough patch, he has always thought this way), gives me the status of a mistrusted babysitter/housekeeper rather than an equal partner. The issue came up again yesterday and I have finally really understood that h has no intention of taking on board any of my anxieties, and it has kind of knocked me for six. I am now wondering what I am supposed to do as my existence feels kind of pointless. Is this a greedy overreaction? I think I thought that at some point h would realise my worth and empathise with me, and finally trust me.

From my point of view, if something were to happen to h tomorrow, there would be a massive mortgage and outgoings which I could not cover. A portion of the equity from the house would go to me but the rest would go in trust to the dc. Therefore we would be forced to sell up and move. This issue could be sorted out either through having a will or through me jointly being on the deeds of the house we live in (not the other ones he owns). I was trying to tell him yesterday how anxious it makes me feel that my future is uncertain in this way and he told me I was blackmailing him, that people behave in bad ways when money gets in the way and that he is not going to play the whole insurance game. I offered to pay for the adding of my name to the deeds and for the insurance (with an ISA that I have) but basically he wants things how he wants them.

So I feel that he does not trust me (and I was telling him that my being on the deeds would not mean that I am suddenly going to go running off with half the house) but that I am supposed to trust him implicitly. For all I know he could have a will leaving everything to whomever he wants. Our finances are separate in that he puts money on my account and I get child benefit and tax credits. I buy food and pay for everything concerning the children. He does and sees everything else.

So I don't know if I am being obsessive and greedy. I am 45 (h is 57) and feel that the position I am in is childlike. It's not really about the money but about feeling that h and I are equals and both in control of our lives together. At the moment I feel that he is in control (though he is not mean with money when he has it iyswim).

I also don't know if I am being morbid or if that is a symptom of not having enough purpose in life. H has recently been getting these weird symptoms where he is driving somewhere and no longer recognises streets that he is familiar with (he is now taking vitamin B12 - one of the symptoms of deficiency is memory loss and h has been a vegetarian all his life which makes it even more likely that he is deficient). Things like this make you realise that anything could happen at any time.

The other thing that I find difficult and I suppose they are connected, is the fact that, in the end, big decisions like whether we move or not and where to, are in h's hands (eg. he chose our last family car without consulting me). We spoke about that yesterday and he said yes, he does conduct his life on his own. I asked him what my place was in all of this and he said whatever I wanted it to be.

So now I feel that h and I can be together if I accept that my life may be in complete and utter disarray if he dies (despite the fact that he could set up something more secure for me and the kids if he wanted to), and that we never move from this house unless we move where he wants to go.

I FEEL SUFFOCATED AND ODDLY POINTLESS/REDUNDANT!!! Am I being greedy, grasping and or unreasonable? Should I just be more buddhist about all of it and be grateful that we have a roof over our head (which I am, very)?

You will get more if you divorce him than if he dies. What are you getting out of this?

Um, well I don't want to add to your upset, but his unwillingness to make official what would be the likely outcome (minus a huge chunk to the taxman) of his death in anycase makes me wonder a little if he might be considering a third act in his life?

Is there any possibility he might be imagining a future without being married to you at some point? I'm hopefully completely wrong but to be honest, he reminds me of myself in my first marriage. I got married foolishly in my early twenties and I realized that I had made a big mistake very quickly, there was no infidelity and my ex-h was lovely but we were a complete mismatch. Anyway, it took me another 7 years to make the decision to divorce but in those years of marriage I absolutely knew that I didn't want to have children with ex-h so I was paranoid about using birth control and I never mixed our finances, I didn't even want a joint checking account. It wasn't a calculated thing, I just instinctively knew that I didn't want to do these things and it would be better if I didn't.

Obviously my experience means my interpretation of your post is extremely biased, but just in case fwiw. The irony is, if you were to divorce now you'd get half anyway!

He thinks he's protecting the marital home by having it solely in his name but he's wrong. That's an asset of the marriage. It doesn't matter if he owned a property before you married because the instant that ring went on your finger it became a shared asset.

The other properties I can sort-of understand as he probably sees that as his business rather than marital assets/family home.

If he dies intestate you will not be left destitute. You automatically acquire a proportion of his estate (dunno the actual value) and your children the rest.

As for life-insurance I believe that you can take out a policy without needing to consult him about it. That's the first thing I'd be looking into.

Check the deeds of your family home and make sure they are in his name. Friend discovered after her husbands death that the property she thought was in his name was in a siblings name , a sibling who wanted to chuck her and her children out on the street , similar back story to you and your DH .

Born free- point taken lol

Lots of good advice here OP. I hope you are ok.

I don't want to upset you more but someone I know had the unfamiliar streets thing. She had a brain tumour :(

If he dies without a will you will get 250,000, and a life interest in half of the remaining estate - but you won't be able to spend it. You would only be able to spend the interest on it. Not sure how that works if property is involved.

If he became incapacited and unable to act for himself that would be a real mess. You both need to do a will and to do a power of attorney for each other.

It sounds as though he thinks you don't deserve anything he perceives as 'his' even in the event of his death. I can't think of any other reason to avoid doing a will at least.

faIR they said today on this morning, she would have to sell family home to give children their share...if they wanted it.
its all very very messy.

they also said co habiting means noting in event of death.

they mentioned gay people being affected, lived together for x years, partner dies, house goes to his family, they cut out lover, dont even let him go to funeral.

OP your dh is being bizarrely obtuse by leaving you off the deeds and recklessly irresponsible by failing to make a will. But the bit that makes me worry the most is that he never puts his arm round you or says anything nice. You deserve to be loved and valued. Please don't forget that or stop fighting for it. Your dh needs to show you affection and if he won't couples counselling is needed.

YANBU, you have put all your eggs in his basket, not vice versa. Make a plan for financial independence, your own business, job, whatever, and require him to do equal domestic and childcare shares. He is telling you outright not to rely on him for financial security, I suggest you take him at his word.

Thanks for all your thoughts and for reading my really long post! I think the reason h doesn't want to make a will is that it kind of tempts fate. I agree that I have to find work and make myself more independent. I've always thought (up till now) that childcare is too expensive and would not make working worth it (last year when all three dc were still at primary school (the eldest is now in Year 7), after school club would have cost £150 a week) - but I am now thinking that I have to get a full time job and that h will have to pay for childcare (which will be cheaper as eldest ds can be at home by himself) .

Will pull myself together tomorrow but have had a very down day where I am wondering what exactly the point to me is . The thing about working is that I am so out of touch with the workplace, the recession means it's difficult to find work for people who are newly qualified let alone people like me, and I really don't want to be judged because I am in my forties - which is probably a silly way to think...

Following h's revelations yesterday feel like taking off and setting up somewhere smaller and cheaper (than London where we live) where I am responsible for and in control of my own life, earn a living and could own my own home. Obviously the dc mean I can't do this but I feel trapped!!

I agree, missy, that I have to take my h at his word.

Apologies for not responding to each post - I have read them all and taken everything in and will act on advice.

Thanks again.

Tis raining I strongly urge you to wacth the This MOrning segment on wills. we don't have one either ( well we do but pre marriage) I wrote to some solicitors straight away after seeing it to ask for costs.

So he would rather hold some silly superstition over the financial security of his family?

The point to you, is being a mother!!! I am sure your children utterly adore you and they wont thank their father for treating you like a skivvy.

How many people with DC do you think get divorced? Millions.

Being in London is very interesting as of course house prices are so much more there, so you could, think about divorce and being able to afford a nice house somewhere else even if just outside somewhere.

You are trapped, but your not trapped, I understand what you mean, but there are options and choices open to you.

Can you make the most of some free advice at the very least from solicoter?

When your feeling down its not nice to hear things BUt I have to say, I would be considering leaving my DH if he spoke to me like yours....

I agree with others that he may be thinking of a third act too....it doesnt sound like he is committed to you.

Do you want to stay with him?

A marriage should be a team/partnership...

He sounds like he has set himself up in the role of a 'boss' and you are a subservient that he is in no way answerable to.

Jesus, making a will does not tempt fate!! Making a will shows you are an adult who has thought about his wife and dc and provided for them should he die.mJeez. That's all.

Your dh sounds very odd at best, a complete nob at worst. I'd take him to a meeting with a solicitor where you can discuss finance and wills.

I would say that in the absence of a will/name on deeds you feel insecure about your future.

I would tell him you are getting a full time job.

Tell him to prepare himself for half the cost of childcare and half responsibility for pick offs/drop offs etc.

As long as you are his slave at home he is free to expand his property portfolio but deny you any of the benefits of this or recognition that his success has (partly) come at the expense of your career/earning potential.

You aren't greedy, he's a pig.

Did he actively want you to be a SAHM, or would he have preferred it if you'd gone back to work after each child?

Yanbu. Wills and life insurance do not tempt fate. You can insure someone you have a financial interest in, ie husband, but they would have to answer the health questions and if a gp report is required would have to give consent for gp data to be accessed.

It is mad for neither of you to have cover. If you died how would he look after the kids? If he says 'it's fine my mum/gran/aunty dot would look after them' say great organise it from tomorrow and I will go to work.

I am the breadwinner (I hate that phrase!) dh is a sahd. I owned a house and savings pre marriage. I also had a twat of an ex. However my dh is not my twat of an ex, he's a lovely man I decided to marry and have a baby with. So I have lots of life cover to ensure he would be okay. He also has a list of assets so he can find them on my inevitable demise.

If you divorced you would be able to control your half of the marital assets. Really the future of his assets are in your hands...

This is a self-sabotaging man.

Allowing his past relationship experiences to cloud his current relationship. You could have a nice life and relationship together but he is mistrustful and bitter. I understand why this may be, but don't understand what he hopes to gain by passing that onto you whilst his ex wife is sitting pretty.

He is making his baggage yours to carry. & making you feel minimised, too. I won't tell you what I would do - as I can be vengeful about men who allow 1 woman to cloud their view of all so go on to make another woman miserable! But, definetely get specialist financial advice and dont tell him you have done so either.

One of the things I said to him yesterday is that we could get cover for both of us because if I were to die, how could he carry on working in the way he does now? His response to this was sarcastic. I cannot explain the extent to which he dismisses this side of life - things like insurance, wills etc...

I don't know if he actively wanted me to be a SAHM as we never really discussed it - but as the dc were born close together, it made sense. I was also not at all career minded (which I regret now).

Setting things in context, he works very hard and I have the luxury of not working partly because he does that. I realise this all has to change.

I do want to stay with him to the extent that our relationship is a lot easier now than during the rough patch, and I want stability etc... for the dc. I also do not want to be apart from the dc for half the week. If it was just me and him though, I think I would have got itchy feet a long time ago.

I can't force him to change his mind on any of this (which is frustrating!) - I could show him various things people have been talking about but I think he would think I was trying to railroad him and was only thinking of his death. He would never come to speak to a lawyer about this.

So I suppose the only thing I can try to do is become more financially independent myself. It does give me a knot in my stomach though. He says I am always anxious about something (which is true), but sorting this wouldn't take long and could then be forgotten about. It would certainly make me feel more relaxed and more taken into account.

I agree that he is self-sabotaging. Will get financial advice but will have to explain to the adviser that there is no persuading h to do anything. It's actually a very difficult thing to talk about and I can only bring it up when I feel brave enough (about once every two years!).

Im not surprised you are anxious. He is minimising and stonewalling you, and dismissing your feelings. There's no point talking to him anymore. Focus on yourself. Yes, do tell the adviser there is no persuading your H to do anything, and then at least you will get advice from the correct standpoint. Once you have clear and concise advice, you can decide - for yourself - how to go forward with your situation. I hope at least, this aspect goes well for you. Your H seems as if he is quite prepared to go on living unhappily and miss the joys of the relationship you could have. & for what? Past baggage, mistrust, and the pursuit of money. Make sure you look after yourself as best you can emotionally and financially. You matter too.

Thank you mistress - Make sure you look after yourself as best you can emotionally and financially. You matter too really helps, and I will repeat it to myself whenever I feel a wave of anxiety.
Thank you very much everyone else as well.

So he controls all the money. He is dismissive and mocks your role in the family. He discounts your opinions.

I'm sorry to say that I think life might be far better for you if you left him. I know you've got your kids to think of but staying in a relationship like this has an impact on them too and sends them clear messages about how people treat each other. Would you be happy for one of your kids to be "you" in a relationship like yours one day?

What do your friends/family say? If you're isolated, is there a reason?

You're very down and don't feel like you have much to offer but you seem very sensible and clear-thinking to me. You write well, you seem like you're organised (to be so clear about what needs doing).

I know the job market is tough but see if you can start to get some experience (maybe volunteering for a medium-sized charity doing some admin or project management). People who can write well and think clearly are really valuable. You have a lot to offer as a parent and for the workplace.

No wonder his first wife left him.

I am sorry. You sound like an abused and beaten woman. I am sure you didn't dream about that future when you were a little girl, nor would you want it for your own dc.

Divorce him, it is no more than he deserves. Might as well cut out more of the miserable middle bit, because by your own admission he will never change. He expects you to "shaft" him at some time...make it sooner rather than later and save all of you more of this half life.