to wish all these filthy rich people who claim to know what it's like to live off a pittance, would just fuck the hell off?

[sickofthisshite]

AIBU?

Sarah Ferguson claims a family of 4 can easily live off £80 p/wk to cover all living costs

Boris Johnson has said the poor "should show gratitude to the mega rich"

Iain Duncan Smith says living off £53 is doable for a single person.

According to DC, customers at Waitress are "friendlier & more engaged" than those he has interacted with at other supermarkets. As if people who shop in Sains, Tesco, etc don't have opinion on politics & the state of the country, their lives. Just because someone is inarticulate or introverted does not mean there thoughts & feelings are irrelevant.

The list goes on.

Who the hell are these prats to judge those in the vicious, relentless struggle of poverty.

I hope there perfect little bubble is one day burst.

It makes me sick to my very core.

I would imagine the likes of Sarah Ferguson do not hve to shell out for holidays as often these parasites get them paid for them. Cannot see how she would manage on £80 though.

Hate hate these people. If they try it for themseles it is oly for a week.

I wanted to kill Eggwina Curry when she was on tv with Jack Monroe and that blonde woman who talks nonsense.

Here we go again, having to justify why I as undeserving scum should have Internet. There's lots of reasons.

Let's start with the library argument. I'm lucky enough to live a 40 min walk from the library but it's only part time and they restrict members to 30 min per week, I couldn't fit 40 hrs of job hunting plus everything else I do into 30 min. Plus having to wait a week to find out how an application has gone is impractical.

Other reasons:

They've closed all the banks so Internet banking saves the £8.50 return to the nearest bank or the 6 hrs it would take to do it on foot.

Having Internet allowed me to negotiate an online tariff for gas and electricity saving £10 per month and avoid pre pay meters saving even more. (Cost of Internet covered already).

Dd is given homework that requires the Internet. It usually takes more than half an hour (see library point above) and no they don't allow them to do it in school.

I'm studying, having Internet at home allows me to put extra hours in at night when dds are in bed and everything closed.

I sometimes get emails from work that can't be left 6 days to deal with.

It's a long time since I applied for a job on paper everything is online now and having Internet allows you to spend several hours a day job hunting that 30 min per week at the library.

I read the news to keep up to date without buying newspapers. Being up to date actually helps with job hunting.

It allows me to shop around when buying something is unavoidable thereby saving money.

I do use it for entertainment too, sometimes I feel like a little down time and a little fun. Much cheaper than a night out isn't it. I guess though I don't actually deserve fun but there you go, it's not my main reason for having Internet.

You really can't win can you? People go on about how you have to do everything you can to pull yourself back up yet when you do try to do it they moan about that too. FYI, I'm no longer at rock bottom but it's a long slippery slope of the way back up and people tend to slip back a few times on the way (often due to circumstances outwith their control). I vow that if I ever get there I won't be kicking people while they're down and continue to try and look at the bigger picture not just what Government rhetoric wants us to see.

having to justify why I as undeserving scum should have Internet

Why so intent on being a martyr? No one here has suggested that people do not deserve the internet!

I think some of these rich poverty tourists lack imagination. Of course it's possible to live on a small amount for a week or two. The real problems start with with the sheer relentless grinding misery of trying to cope long term. You can't afford the bus - so walk. That's fine, but what about when your cheap shoes start to let water in ? You get home wet through and your cold home does nothing to get you warm and dry again quickly.
There must be many examples if this kind of thing that these rich folks simply don't think about.

If you are massively skint then a tv and or Internet maybe your only link to the outside world and a bit of company or distraction.
Also don't forget that many people found themselves on benefits after having a job or better income, so they often will already have a tv and Internet often on contract, same as phones. Are you suggesting they sell all this and cancel contracts or direct debits ending up in further debt?

Objection. Actually, people have said exactly that.

But what makes people with LOTS of money feel entitled to tell those with very little how to live in the first place????????????

Richer isn't "better" and certainly isn't "morally superior"

but it is LUCKIER.

And please don't tell me you 'make your own luck'.

Does the child born into homelessness make its own luck?
Or the one born into an abusive situation?
Or the adult who becomes victim of DV?
Or gets breast cancer?

or any of the other hundreds of less dramatic examples of reasons a person can be, for a period of time, in poverty financially. LIke losing a job, being temporarily ill, or becoming separated from society and losing their confidence, whilst society tells them they are scum who deserve no help.

Whist the big Banks and Corporations / companies rob us blind, as a country, we are encouraged to turn on each other. It is disgusting.

dawndonnaagain I didn't realise that. Could you link? My impression was that people were saying internet is not a necessity to survival, rather than people don't "deserve" it

any of the other hundreds of less dramatic examples of reasons a person can be, for a period of time, in poverty financially

for a period of time being the operative term.

firstchoice - Come on, it's not all luck

First of all, being richer isn't morally superior, rich people simply are better at making money. This is a morally ambivalent stance. Some "rich" people are very moral, some are not. Same with "poor" people

For those people who aren't able to make enough money for themselves, there maybe a lot of reasons why not. Bad luck in terms of being born to abusive parents or with a major disability of course is a major factor, but if someone is emotionally and physically (more or less) healthy then they can choose what they see as important in life - relationships, jobs, education, money etc etc

Of course some people are not very talented. They may not be talented educationally, motivationally or even in terms of their relationships. I guess that may be bad luck that you have born as a talentless person - or that nobody has been able to spot and develop any talent you do have

For someone with parents who are tennis players then they have all the access in the world to be a good tennis player. And if your parents are bankers, they get access to that too. It is human nature. However, everyone can play the game, it just takes some people a little longer because they started off from a less priveledged position

Excuse me but I haven't once said 'undeserving scum' so really where has that come from? I said if needs must TV would be one of the things that needs to go if it meant I could get more food or pay bills! Stop acting like a martyr and bringing an argument where there isn't one.

I think some of the luck element is more about being lucky to have choices and options available to you and to be in a position to make the most of them. You could still fail to take them.

Chazs, sure, but opportunities don't just present themselves to you (unless you are very lucky!), you have to go and proactively look for them

When I was young and single, I used to mope around that I didn't have a partner and nobody I knew interested me. So I decided to move to the centre of a city with a whole bunch of people I didnt know, and 3 months later I met the person who I'll spend the rest of my life with

Decisions create luck. And then the luck requires more decisions. That is true for anything in life

However, if your life is going badly and you are in need of some good luck, then you need to go and change your circumstances. As Einstein said, the definition of stupid is repeating the same thing again and again but expecting different results

Just to add to my little sermon for the day (in case anyone cares)...

You can only take decisions with a level head if you have the confidence to do so

Many people who find themselves in dires straits financially have confidence and self-esteem issues and don't think that they have the power to change their own situation. This is not their fault of course, but it is something they can try and change

All the people on this threads who say we managed was it recently. Times have changed. When I brouught my 1st house I had about £20 pw after bills for everything. I only managed because electricity was £10 per month and gas was maybe £20 per month. Faced with current utility bill levels I would have losy my house or starved or still been living at home.

mijas
I agree that decisions create luck but if you have a safety net of a supportive family its easier to take those decisions. I was the first in my family to go to University, nobody tried to put me off, my Dad sat with me in the library whilst I researched uni's (my DM had not long died), I had a quiet dedicated place to study in the house etc.

My degree allowed me to get a career and be successful.

Chazs - of course, some people's circumstances are easier than others

I was also the first to go to uni in my family - my parents did try to put me off and during A-levels I was sharing a room with my 3 brothers so I did my homework in the living room once everyone was in bed

There are lots of excuses people can give. I did well because I wanted to, motivationally it was very easy. I understand that not everyone wants to learn and work, or finds it easy.

I've never thought that I've actually worked hard or sacrificed anything, but I did have to fight against the tide a little in terms of expectations, my parents were 16 when they had me for Christ sake!

The important thind for me, is that people feel enabled. they can do anything they want. I have always thought that, and is something I should thank my parents for. It is something I will pass on to my children.

I've been horribly poor at two points in my life. One with children, one without. I couldn't claim benefits because I didn't qualify. But my income was insufficient and I suffered. To the point where I've gone hungry and sat in the dark. It sucks.

I had youth and optimism on my side though. I believed it was temporary and would get better. And it did.

Even so, that time was a dark time in my life and is probably one of the most defining things to have happened to me. And most of us could find ourselves in that place with just a job loss, an accident or divorce. It's why I won't ever judge anyone on benefits - there but for the grace of god.

I accept that the country doesn't have a limited supply of funds. But I find it morally repugnant that people can be sat hungry in the dark, and that police officers and nurses can have their pay frozen while MPs demand a way-above-inflation pay-rises and claim more on expenses for lavish dinners than a benefit recipient gets in a week.

The trouble with the idea that people can live on £53 a week is a form of 'othering'. It's ok for those people to live in that way because they are not like us and their needs are different.

Like many other posters have said, living on that amount is do-able only in the short-term and only with the proviso that the person concerned doesn't have any debt or additional expenses as a result of the situation that has led them to claim benefits in the first place. Very often that isn't the case so they're starting from a deficit straight away.

How many people end up on benefits because of relationship breakdown meaning they've had to re-equip a new home with all that entails.

How many people end up on benefits because of a job loss and have tried to shore up the rent/mortgage on overdrafts/credit cards in the belief they'll soon have another job and can pay it off so why downsize (especially since downsizing requires moving, which requires even more money)?

What happens with that £53 when the fridge breaks down and both DC need new shoes in the same month?

What happens when you're told your benefits will be sanctioned if you don't attend x, y and z interviews which require you to spend about £20 of that £53 on travel?

What happens if your public library is one of the ones that has been closed and so you can't walk there?

I think some of the luck element is more about being lucky to have choices and options available to you - and living in the UK where the vast majority of the population have those choice and options is the lucky part for most!

You really can't win can you? People go on about how you have to do everything you can to pull yourself back up yet when you do try to do it they moan about that too.

its called gaslighting useless Its a form of abuse usually used by an abusive spouse but in these classist times it gets used by the Gov and media and some members of the public on a much bigger scale.

Objection
There are people in the UK who really don't have the options and choices or don't realise what options and choices are out there. To use a bit of a stereotype who do you think is most likely to go to university and get a professional job (assume identical IQs)

• the DC of a 16 year old single mum on the Gurnos Estate in Merthyr Tydfil ( I have family nearby so know the area); or

(excuse the Daily Fail article www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1356247/Gurnos-Merthyr-Tydfil-The-British-estate-healthy-life-expectancy-just-58-8-years.html)

• my privately educated DC?

Please stop thinking that because you have seen poverty in another country, poverty doesn't limit people's options in this one. DH's family is from rural North Africa and didn't have running water until a few years ago the older members of his family are illiterate and medical care is patchy. Having seen all that, I still recognise that some people in this country do not have opportunities and choices that they can see or appreciate or utilise.

I managed on this level for 6 months because:

1. It was 6 months so didnt need to buy clothes or shoes.
2. I was living in a room in a shared house, so bills were cheap.
3. I was healthy so walked the 2 miles and back to Job Centre, or interviews, no problem. I walked everywhere.
4. I spent very little on food and ate things that housemates thought looked awful, but were very cheap and fairly healthy.

Agree with mljas, luck doesn't always just present itself - you have to be proactive and look for it.

The link about Merthyr-Tydfil, why are so many people content with waiting for their life to change? Why do the young people stay when they finish school? Why do they not leave and try to take control of their own futures? Why are people waiting for the government to step in and 'create jobs'?

I do believe people need help to escape those situations they can't help, I believe in benefits as a safety net, I believe in carers and those too ill to work or with disabilities getting the extra help that they need - I think there should be more support for those particularly vulnerable people in bad situations.
I struggle to feel any sympathy though for healthy, young, able bodied people who moan about not having any luck, but who do very little, if anything, about being proactive in looking for their own luck.

Please stop thinking that because you have seen poverty in another country, poverty doesn't limit people's options in this one
I don't think that at all and I apologise if that's how its come across. I DO think however that many many people are incredibly defeatist and not willing/able to open their eyes to the opportunities that are surrounding them

Genuine question - what can be done to get people to seize the opportunities or recognize that they are there at all?