To not accommodate a request by a female Muslim never to be in work "alone" with any male colleague?

[LibertyPrints]

"Sarah" has worked with our company since December. We have 12 staff (some of whom are part time) across 2 sites. All staff work between the 2 sites. They are retail outlets.

Sarah is Muslim and has recently contacted me to ask if I can ensure she is not ever scheduled to be alone with any male colleague at either site stating this is to do with her religious beliefs.

The manager is male and 3 staff are male. Different staff have different skill levels and they are scheduled where they are best utilised on any given day/week and so that all shifts are pretty equally shared out. It is not practical to agree to this.

For clarity I have no issue with making adjustments for her where I can. For example she asked at interview if she could reduce her lunch hour by varying amounts and then take that extra time out when she wanted to pray at varying times of the day. Even though we don't normally allow breaks to be taken in this way I agreed willingly.

I feel really awkward saying no but it's really far from ideal. AIBU to think if she can't expect this from us?

Sorry, not prefer it that she left, but it would be better for her to go.

Easier just to not mention that and be seen to be bending over backwards to give the request due consideration - even if the answer is no.

"I can honestly say if I was managing her in !y team, I'd say no politely then wait it out."

That was kind of where I was coming round to really Boudica. I am going to explain the situation it would put me in and how difficult it would make things and say really sorry but I can't agree to it. Then cross my fingers and wait. If I am forced to back track to avoid a tribunal I will have to but it will be through gritted teeth and I will be even more wary (and I am wary already) when recruiting in future.

Liberty, I can't stress enough to keep the paper trail clear on this one.

There are different interpretations of Islam, obviously she is coming from one of the more strict versions, but IMHO, she should have mentioned this in the interview.

Unbelievable that she can't see how it can't work, how old is she?
Four months in and she's making all these demands?
Tell her to shove off.

It may be a plyo by her husband to get her to leave her job assuming you will say no, in case its a win for the business but unfortunate for her. I'm sure she's a lovely person but she's not your child.

Make sure you have someone else in on the meeting when you explain why its not possible on a 3 day shift latter to accommodate her request at this time, if she then chooses to go to tribunal (I don't think she will, if she won't work with a man for religious reasons and you believe her to be genuine I can't see her going to a tribunal to profit)

You know the law is on your side, your a small business its just not workable.

However said that, please don't let this dissuade you from hiring staff from differing backgrounds, not all make such request if anything its a minority. By law you do have to be a equal opportunity employer. I work with a strict Muslim woman she's fantastic :)

Could you call her in and explain that all flexible working requests (which essentially this is), are looked at and assessed as whether they are vaible. In this instance, the needs of the business mean that the request cannot be granted.

If she argues the point, suggest to her that she looks at it and puts together a proposal according to busoness needs, includig a months worth of schedules (takig into consideration sickness etc), and comes back to you, incase there is anything you might have overlooked.

From what a previous poster has put, it seems her religion bars her from being alone with stranger men - which her colleagues are not.

slithytove
So by that do you think - have the meeting with her but reply in writing not in person?

Can you actually go to a tribunal after only four months in a job?
Can't you just let her go?

As a feminist atheist I find her request unreasonable and offensive. If I were one of your male employees and I were told about this I'd be very angry and insulted. It's just the same as the sort of idiotic homophobic straight men you occasionally hear going on about being scared about being in the company of gay men - and I'm sure they would get short shrift here.

As a lawyer however I think it is worth discussing with an employment law specialist to see if you can say no. You should also check if you were to accede to her request what the ramifications are if your male employees say they are being discriminated against (and I think they are) or indeed if any of your other employees want special adjustments made for them just because why should she be treated better than them?

Industrial tribunals however have upheld that "the I can't do this it's against my religion" won't cut it if it makes commercially unreasonable demands on a business. Insisting for example that I can't work whatever religious day is special to me every week(which of course is a Friday, Saturday or Sunday) is unreasonable even if an employer has staff to cover it. Unless an employee were specifically hired to cover that day all staff are entitled to get a fair rostering system which they won't if someone is hogging those days.

No most rights only kick in after 2 years.

She 'can't' do the job she was employed to do, that's enough reason.

That's what I thought Nursey.

Her husband was totally aware of her application. She came alone to the interview. I called her a day later to offer her the job. She came in to the shop to accept and he was with her. (I was out but the male manager was there).

Wow wait where did I miss 4 months??? She can't go to a tribunal if shes only worked 4 months.

The worlds your oyster my friend....computer says no.

What is her probation period? If she's within in it then it's tatty by by.

She started in December.
Says so in the OP.

Length of employment is irrelevant in discrimination cases. You can even claim you were discriminated against if not given the job.

Probation periods mean nothing in law so we don't use them. I think we can terminate her contract without redress within two years without stating a reason but I think claim for discrimination may be permitted even though it's less than two years - not sure.

To be honest I simply truly cannot afford the time/stress/cost (direct and indirect) of a "fight". I need to use this to keep the business afloat so the employees and I can all pay our mortgages.

You do have to prove it though, and I think the onus is on you to prove it.

Unfortunately if a dismissal falls under discrimination the 4 months doesn't matter. The following is from a good law firm's site. You are not seeking to discriminate against her on the grounds of her religion but are looking to refuse an unworkable request. However it might still be worth getting advice on how you should proceed.

"there are a number of exceptions to the requirement for qualifying service. The following are the key exceptions which arise

Is the dismissal discriminatory?
Dismissals which take place for a discriminatory reason will be actionable irrespective of length of service. Therefore, although the employee may not be able to claim unfair dismissal if they have less than the qualifying service, they could claim that their dismissal was discriminatory. Compensation for a discriminatory dismissal is calculated in a similar way to an unfair dismissal claim in terms of compensation for loss of earnings, but there is no cap on compensation in discrimination cases as there is in ordinary unfair dismissal, and an injury to feelings award is also payable where a finding of discrimination is made.

In light of this, when considering dismissal, employers should consider the reason for dismissal and whether it is linked in any way to a protected characteristic. The protected characteristics are age, disability, gender reassignment, marriage and civil partnership, pregnancy and maternity, race, religion or belief, sex and sexual orientation. If there is any concern that the dismissal could be regarded as linked to one of the protected characteristics then we recommend that legal advice is taken in order to assess the degree of risk involved."

I would do both. Have the meeting, say all you need to and then hand her a dated written decision and get her to sign receipt.

Just in case :)

And actually, getting her to put the request in writing is not a bad idea either - if it's classed as flexible working she is only allowed one request and appeal every 12 months. But check with acas if that's what it's classed as.

She has only been there 4 months, you can just get rid of her. You don't even have to give a reason.

I find it really unacceptable that someone can make these kind of demands, and actually have a tribunal case. The country has gone mad.

Yes, definitely have a note taker at the meeting, and give your employee a copy of the notes again signed.

You will be fine honestly. Just keep it all formal and in writing, prove that it's not workable for the needs of the business, and leave it there. I would be surprised if she took it further as it doesn't sound like you are being unreasonable. You can have it dealt with in a week.

Thank goodness reason still prevails, Caitlin.

Can she just be given notice after four months, then, or could she claim unfair dismissal? (I've come in my Tardis from a time when employees had better rights, but there was a six-month probation in most jobs.)

If it came to it, you'd be likely to have to schedule more shifts for the female staff at the expense of the men. Then you'd be guilty of sex discrimination. I'd like to see a tribunal work that one out, with both sides complaining!