To have made some friends?

[normaleggy]

I see a lot of posts on here by women worrying about their husband's friendship with other women, most of which are met with several 'yanbu, I'd be pissed off, he's out of order' type comments. Well I'm a single mother (for 2 1/2 years) and I have spent all that time rebuilding my life and confidence and trying to remember the person I was before exh wore me down.

In the last year I've become really good friends with a group of people that I met through some old school friends, and because I have quite 'male' tastes and sense of humour, I get on particularly well with the men in that group. I'm often chatting via text or Facebook messenger with them and there is nothing sexual in it at all just silly jokes and comments. But they are all married and when I was talking to my friend the other day she said she would find that uncomfortable and another agreed with her. But why is that? I don't fancy any of them and even if I did I wouldn't act on it because I'm not that person. We do talk quite late at night sometimes but its still very innocent. As far as I'm concerned they are just very good friends who happen to be blokes, so am I in the wrong for this? It's just harmless isn't it, would you be pissed off?

I wouldn't have been as harsh as chattymum but what she says is what I meant about trying too hard. I'm taking the comments about the men being able to have proper conversations about interesting things whilst the women can only do baby talk with a large pinch of salt.

Why does that make me clingy chattymum? If I were talking to female friends instead would you call me that? I'm not really sure why people think I'm 'trying too hard' either, I was a very lonely figure a few years ago and I'm fucking proud of myself for making as many new friends as I have considering how low my confidence was. I spent many years hanging around with people who I had nothing in common with and who didn't really interest me (exh's friends, both male and female) and now I've found people who are exactly the kind of people that I want to be friends with, I'm being made to feel as if I should take a step back.

Should marriage always take precedent over friendship? Is marriage the ultimate human relationship?
Be interesting to hear the views of any men on here and how they would feel if it were the other way round and it was their wife chatting with male friends.

I'm not saying there is a right or wrong answer, just interested what people think.

It's a little odd every one of these sparkling male conversationalists are married to such universally dull women. Do you tell the men you find their wives boring?

I don't have a Facebook account, possibly late night chats are normal. My son does it with his friends which will be both sexes but he's young, feckless and fancy free , as are his friends.

I wouldn't be thrilled about my husband texting/messaging back and forth with a woman late into the evening, but it would be pretty far out of character for him to do that with any of his friends. I have some very good male friends, and 3 brothers I'm pretty close to... I just don't see the men in my life, particularly the married ones, casually chatting via text or Facebook or whatever, with ANY of their friends. That's not because they're not allowed, it's just that they tend to be busy and have plenty of company at home... There's no need. And actually, I don't really chat with any of my friends like that. Texts are for organising meet-ups, or for asking someone to switch the oven on.

I guess, in short, the problem isn't having opposite sex friends. My husband has female friends, and that's fine. The problem would be this mode of communication that I don't see as a natural part of grown-up friendships. I wouldn't necessarily worry about it if my husband was getting late night texts from a single woman (if he was being secretive about it, yes), but I would suspect her of trying a bit too hard.

Surely these days texting/messaging is a natural part of a friendship though? I have female friends and single male friends that I text a lot as well, as I'm sure many people do. Would it be more acceptable if I gave them a ring at home or wrote them a letter then?

Regardless of gender people you have only recently become friend with messaging late night over Facebook is a bit weird. I have friends who I seldom message as we do not need to be in each other's pockets.. Thus clingy.

It is also odd as pointed out that all the women are boring? Are you sure your not coming across wrong to them so they are trying to avoid you? I can make small talk very boring with people I have no interest in, but be the life of the party with people I like and enjoy company with.

We're hardly in each others pockets, it's not every day, all day! I do make small talk with them, I even (believe it or not) try and step away from the small talk and make big talk too! But I just don't have a massive amount in common with them and so we don't really click. Maybe they are avoiding me, who knows, but it wouldn't be from my lack of trying.

So how long should I be friends with someone before I'm allowed to chat to them on a regular basis then?

I think at the end of the day if you are questioning if it's ok yourself you are not all that sure yourself which shows you are crossing some line otherwise you would of just brushed off your friends comments.

Can't you make friends with single men if you want male friends? I am single too but I don't make friends with straight men who are in relationships. It just seems inappropriate.

I'm not questioning it, I don't really see anything wrong with it but was wondering what the general opinion was.

I have got single male friends and single female ones and married female ones, just doesn't make sense to me that just being friends with married men should be out of bounds. I'm not trying to shag all my other friends so why assume that I am with the married ones?

Why is it inappropriate, please elaborate.

normaleggy

I cannot speak for others but yes my marriage takes precedence over other relationships. Why would I have bothered getting married otherwise? I have an amazing group of friends and I have an wonderful family, however my husband is no.1. If he is away with work and needs to chat about a worry, share a joke, or just engage in silly talk about nothing he calls me. It is nothing and everything - special, intimate. I cannot imagine him doing this with anyone else and I would not want to do it with another man.

The only person who liked to communicate late at night with me was a ex friend who was clingy and immature. She has no respect for other people's boundaries and is extremely selfish. She has self esteem problems and likes to put other women down to make herself feel superior. Everyone else seems to have a life, she didn't and thus she clung on to the edges of other people's relationships.

You have a very interesting group of friends there OP: stuck in some sort of 1950's timewarp where the ladies talk about dirty nappies and school plays and the boys talk about ale and the footie. Sense of humour is divided along gender lines and the women are dreadfully boring.

You asked whether the women who had an issue with this are jealous, I would ask you the same thing. Are you jealous of these wives?
I suspect that you need to do a bit more work on your self esteem because no person who is confident and happy would write off a group of women in such unflattering terms unless they still had self esteem problems.

I am on good terms with a couple - the wife is 1 of my best friends, her husband is a good friend. Generally if we're together I will spend more time and chat with the wife and have a quick bit of banter or joke with the husband. However I am more likely to get into chat conversations with the husband by text as the wife isn't glued to her phone, and me and the husband will send each other jokes/insults and banter by text. The husband and I are very open about our texting [generally if I want to text my friend it's easier to text her husband first - and often if i say something to my friend i get a text later from the husband taking the piss out of me/the situation. I am aware there is a line and will step back when our conversations stray into marital discussions as the wife is my better friend and will say to the husband I don't want to know etc. I have always said my friend if she wants to read my phone she can - she'd be bored of our texts but if she ever felt worried/concerned I have no problem showing her. If she asked me not to text her husband I would respect her relationship and agree but would find it odd - I don't want anything but a banter buddy to take the piss out of

No, I'm not jealous, why would I be? I'm not writing them off, I don't have a massive amount in common with them but that's not purely because they are women. I'm just describing the situation how I see it, they genuinely were discussing those subjects and on a rare night out I didn't particularly want to spend it just taking about kids stuff, what's wrong with that? I also didn't say anything about ale/beer that was someone else, that topic would bore me too as I don't drink it. But I'm not allowed to find topics boring though of course.

I'm sure you do think I'm jealous but I bloody love being single and have no desire to find a relationship, especially as they seem to be so restricting for many. I am not a bitter person at all, I don't resent anyone else's relationship or happiness in any way.

I keep seeing clingy and immature being used but I would say that not being able to see that men and women can have platonic friendships is incredibly immature and I feel quite sorry for those who can't. As for clingy - you don't like your husbands taking to other women, yet somehow I'm the clingy one? Hmm...

So long as you are being straight up friends it is not inappropriate. As soon as you cross into something more blurred it is inappropriate because your innocent feelings could be misinterpreted by the man leading to embarassment or the wife wading to her pain and needlessly putting strain on their marriage.

I think messaging regularly late at night is intimate as MyPrettyToes said. I would not expect to do that regularly with friends of either sex or relationship status unless there was a particular need. It is up to the husband to decide whether to reply to your messages but as the wife I would consider that you didn't really give much of a shit about imposing into what is often the only time most parents get alone together. Not that you should care about that but it could form part of a picture where I got the distinct impression that you were playing a different sort of game.

Marriage is hopefully the ultimate optional human relationship but of course it doesn't preclude having close personal friends of either sex.

I do think it's a trust thing graba and clearly your friends have a loving and trusting relationship, lovely that you are able to be such a part of it.

I apologise for my typos and my grammar

None of the conversations have ever crossed the line calloh and I'm certain they won't, but if I did ever receive any inappropriate messages then I would absolutely take a step back or tell them to piss off.

normaleggy - you have divided this group of people along gender lines and have pretty much stated the men are more interesting to you:

I have quite 'male' tastes and sense of humour,
whilst the men were chatting freely and having a laugh, the women were making little more than small talk or talking about kids

Can you not see how patronising this makes you sound, you are almost derogatory (and I detect a misogynistic tone) in the way you describe the women. I find that odd. Perhaps if you try and see these people as individuals you might come across better?

Men and women can have platonic relationships, that is not the issue here (for me anyway). It is the belittling of wives in this group and the chit-chats in the late of the night I find a bit . For your information a number of my closest friends are men. My husband has female friends. DH and I are not joined at the hip - separate holidays, different hobbies and all that. I am not clingy and nor am I jealous. It is about healthy boundaries and respecting other people's marriage. I just would not be comfortable late night chatting to another woman's husband and describing my male friends' wives like you have.

I am in a very similar situation to you OP, although luckily none of my friend's wives seem threatened by me (they're all prettier than me!)

Most of my friendship groups are female or mixed but, for some reason, up until this year when one left and another sadly died, my group of friends at work was male. I spend a lot of time putting on productions and we used to be a tight knit team of 4 married men and me (single female). Their wives collectively referred to themselves as 'play widows' because we spent so much time at the theatre and joked with me that I'd stolen all their husbands at once. But they were just jokes (I think!) I genuinely consider those men as close friends and have leant on them quite a bit recently when one died as I don't have a partner to support me through it. It's all platonic though. It's totally possible to have an affectionate, close and trusting relationship with a married man you don't want to steal!

I should have grown out of talking to men and only talk about dull stuff with women purely to pander to their insecurities?

This is why women won't like you being friends with their husbands, when you're so belittling of the women. Maybe you could start interesting conversations with them, rather than thinking you're above them. If you're being friendly with men to the exclusion of women, it's hardly a surprise if it doesn't go down well. Include everyone, and it'll probably be fine.

For the record, none of the wives have indicated there being any sort of problem with me, it was a friend who is not part of this group that said she would feel uncomfortable.

Sigh...I don't think I'm above them, I think we have different interests and personalities. I do chat to them etc but I just don't click with them. I've only stated that about these particular women, I've said that I have plenty of female friends but I see you've chosen to ignore that so you can label me as a misogynist.

Hmm. Actually. I said texting/emailing doesn't bother me between DH and his female friends. But I have realized from this thread that a big part of why it doesn't bother me is b/c those female friends of his treat me with respect and affection.

They have lots more in common with DH, but they don't act like they find me boring. They've always been sincerely friendly and inclusive with me.

If they acted like they only ever wanted to talk to DH and they gave off the vibe that anything I said was dull, then yeah, I'd have a big problem with them being close to him. B/c I'd know they didn't respect me. And therefore might not respect our marriage.

Again you're adding things I haven't said, I don't sit there looking uninterested, I've said several times that I do chat to them, I wouldn't dream of giving off the impression I was bored. Saying I don't respect people that I have nothing in common with is ridiculous and insulting.

I don't know what to make of "inappropriate". Does that mean sexual banter? This seems weird to me, but maybe I'm just old.