To think NHS do gooders need to realise that the patient is not always right

[oggieogggie]

I've had a right few weeks of it. I'm an auxilliary nurse and my morning normally starts by taking breakfasts around the ward. Picture the scene if you will - a trolley full of cereal, bowls and milk and a pot of hot porridge.

I walk into room one = "would you like breakfast this morning?" patient (full mental capacity) says "well before all that I'd like you to fix my TV. I cant get the channel to turn over." I say "well I'll see to that after breakfast, would you like some cereal?" he says "not until my TV is fixed ... can't you just do it, it will only take a minute (so everyone else should wait until YOUR TV is functioning before they get their breakfast and you don't see that as selfish at all?) I don't say this - I remain professional.

Imagine a few more patients who decide that their TV/Slippers/Laptop chargers etc are more important and then the unfortunate patients who receive cold porridge as a result -

Next I take a tray of hot toast around = One patient demands "I want it buttering and cutting into thin strips." I explain that she will either have to press the buzzer for someone else to come and do it or wait until I have finished delivering toast before it gets cold. "But I want it NOW!" she demands. Ok, so it's fine that everyone else will receive cold toast? that's ok with you is it?

Imagine more of the same throughout the day

"I can't get my phone working!" = well I'm taking care of a rather ill patient at the moment, it will have to wait." "that's it!! I'm making a complaint!!"

"I want you to wash me." = "I will help you but you have to wash what you can yourself." = "why?? its what you get paid for!!!" no actually - I get paid to help people back to independence and to care for those who genuinely can't do it themselves ... " - "Ive had no sleep!! I want you to wash me! I can barely move I'm in so much pain!!" (well walking down the stairs for a fag 10 minutes ago must have been agony then eh?)

I'm sorry, but could it not be said that sometimes, just sometimes certain patients are not always right and that as staff members we should not live in fear of one of these people complaining that we're not jumping through hoops to keep them happy? And no I've never had a complaint against me - I do that nursey thing of taking the abuse and maintaining a smile. Just lately I can't quite shake the notion that the NHS (and Britain in general) is so bothered about political correctness and ultimate customer satisfaction that it's actually counter productive. Why are we all so polite??!

Part of me is wondering if the OP is a wind-up to provoke everyone.

Also I'd just like to say that MOST of my colleagues HAVE been bedbound patients for one reason and another in the last few weeks / months / years and understand exactly what it's like.

Also we've ALL had close relatives die in hospital and been frustrated with some of the care.

The staff on our ward have a good reputation and I'm proud to work with them.

I said it before and I will say it again, I would happily commit suicide (if I am able to) than end up in a ward again (and I have only been in a post natal ward of a well know teaching hospital).

My Grandma was an auxiliary nurse for many many years. Believe me, she did indeed get paid!

I have been a patient and so have most of my colleagues we know how awful it is we have all experienced lack of care and that is exactly what im trying to say in my other post. The DECENT people are leaving the nhs! They just cant hack it so your left with uncaring nurses who dont give a shit im afraid you can complain until your blue in the face. ASK WHERE THE MONEY GOES! next time you or a loved one have an inpatient stay and you have complaints put it in writing! Dont just moan to an un listening HCA. And ask where the bloody money goes because the nhs is in the black! there is enough money...so where is it?

I work with a lot of very clinically competent nurses , degree educated , very knowledgble . But i do sometimes despair at their attitudes towards our patients . They see things in black and white , can be immensely judgemental , i do pull them up on it , because i was taught that every person you come in to contact with you should treat like a loved family member , regardless of anything .

I have to say though that the worst comments that i have heard being said about my patients have come from other patients and relatives .

The problem is there are so few "nice" nurses that its falling to you as you seem approachable and polite. My dd (20)is doing her nursing training and is shall we say not impressed by some of the staff behaviour.

If she complains she will get a bad report. Her plan is to work really hard, and change things from within. I'm glad she's so enthusiastic but it's not realistic I feel with this sort of behaviour becoming so entrenched.

I recently spent three days in hospital and I'm a mobile 46yo. They were leaving cups of tea and toast beside elderly people's beds, I was admonished for asking for my medication (4 hours late) and given NOTHING to eat for two days - nothing to do with my condition. When I did finally get something it was in edible- really, I'm not being fussy but some kind of meat/fat covered in glutinous grey gravy stuff with a scoop of mashed potato.

I was then transferred to a private hospital where they took more scans and said they couldn't believe the NHS hospital had missed that because I'd been on morphine for cancer, I was so constipated my bowel could have ruptured. I spent three days there, got meds on time, night and day.

My Grandma was an auxiliary nurse for many many years. Believe me, she did indeed get paid!

Oh - I thought 'auxilliary' meant 'helping out' - as in volunteering. When I was at school 6th formers who were applying to do medicine used to work as auxiliaries in the hospital down the road from the school I always thought that was really nice of them but either it's changed now or they were actually they best paid part time working 17 years olds ever and not so caring and lovely after all! Oops!

As you were ....

Grandemama - that's a fairly ridiculous and offensive thing to say!

There are plenty of nurses who understand sundowning Minty. Unfortunately for you most of them work in psychiatry and not on general medical wards.

There is a very poor grasp of knowledge regarding Dementia and its symptoms within general nursing. The inpatient assessment and respite beds for people with Dementia are being closed rapidly (a whole two wards in our trust) meaning more and more of these patients will be shifted inappropriately onto other wards and nursed (and doctored) by those with very little grasp of their needs.

Nursing management is just as good as that of doctors. Or just as bad. The bigger picture should not and need not be about professional protectionism but more about clinical staff (whatever area) meeting the needs of other clinical staff as opposed to those with no idea about life on the wards.

minty i would have been delighted that you had taken my concerns seriously . I feel for the Drs too , especially on nights and weekends when their workload is huge and the support is minimal . But the powers that be in the NHS believe that all patients go to sleep at 9pm and only get sick between 9 and 5

Monday to Friday !

Grandemama please don't talk about suicide in such a flippant manner, especially on a thread with lots people who work their arses off to save other people's lives.

Listen trusts spend millions of pounds on private companies. The pot is full not empty!

Jellymum this is why people have to mobilise and seriously strike. We all know there is money in the pot, it's been increasing over the years, there were massive boosts went in during the last government.

It's not enough to say 'we can't afford the staff'. They bloody well can but refuse to appoint more care staff in favour of their other priorities.

We're not allowed to strike for things like that though, can only strike regarding pay and pensions I believe.

You can protest though, whenever you like. They can't stop you doing that.

It's clear nurses are the brunt of both the management's bad decisions and the public's needs/expectations and are taking the flak from both. This is unacceptable and is an unviable way to run any kind of organisation (though the same could be said of teachers and social workers). But it is precisely for this reason that you have to protest and mobilise.

In the good old days, there was a form of kindly protectionism going on. The clinicians looked after 'their own'. There is no mechanism left to replace this and that's why you are being crapped on. The very worst thing nurses can do is to take it out on patients, blame the 'TV demanders' and the 'people that shouldn't be there / dementia / foreigners' for being the cause of the problem.

Management is the cause of the problem and they are not being held accountable because we are all busy attacking each other. (staff/patients)

Yanbu. I dont think anyone who doesnt work in a hospital can truly understand what its like, even if they think they do, even if they spend time there, etc.

Is it any better in private hospitals?

Is it any better in private hospitals?

Depends what you define as better. You get a room, better food and a bigger TV. Doesn't mean the standard of care is any better. There are more staff yes, but private hospitals rely a lot on agency nurses and the standard is very variable.

Some agency nurses are brilliant. Some I feel like I might as well be on my own, the amount they do. Don't forget the consultants you see are NHS consultants too.

I wouldn't want to work in a private hospital personally. I don't like the 'I'm paying for it, therefore I want it' mentality. It goes against any clinical judgement. I'm not sure I could deal with that.

Surely in private hosps they depend on patients attending for their income so bad nursing would result in bad publicity and fewer patients so is less likely to happen.

Not really. If the nurse is really crap, they just don't hire them again. It's easier to get rid of people in private hospitals.

I have a friend who was an inpatient on the ward i work on and i found her view of what it was like very interesting , in the most part she had a good experience , but it was also beneficial to hear about the bad parts of her stay . I always read the complaint letters aswell , i think it is important to listen to people's experiences , that way you can make small changes to the way you work for everyone's benefit .

I think a lot of the time people become defensive when there really isn't a need . Before i trained to be a nurse i worked in a customer services role for a very big company , i worked out with very little training that allowing people the time to have a good rant , gave me the opportunity to work out what i could do to make it better for them , it is all about listening . I know this is hard when someone is literally inches from your face screaming blue murder and accusing you of a myriad of abuses against their relative , but all the times this has happened , and there have been a fair few , once that initial outburst is over , the person who is screaming apologises and i apologise for anything that should or shouldn't have been done and then we can all move forward .

I have spent the last decade working for the NHS in a non clinical role.

I have unfortunately come across many staff who's attitude has been beyond belief and who clearly felt that they were doing the public a favor by turning up for work each day.

Having previously worked in the private sector in a customer service orientated role I found it shocking that (some) fellow colleagues couldn't understand that many patients not only have a physical condition that needs treating,they are feeling extremely frightened and vulnerable are stressed about everything from the car parking to worrying about who's going to feed the cat and maybe,just maybe,they may not come across as nice polite people !

My role now involves facilitating hospital discharges for "older people" and I'm proud to say that I haven't come across one instance where the staff been anything but caring and compassionate. I do feel this is down to good ward level and senior management and the general ethos that anything less will not be tolerated.

The following is displayed on one of our consultants office doors :

^A Patient is the most important person in our Hospital.
He is not an interruption to our work.
He is the purpose of it.
He is not an outsider in our Hospital, he is part of it.
We are not doing him a favor by serving him, he is doing us a favor by giving us an opportunity to do so.^

Every single member of NHS staff needs to remember the above.

Is that a geriatric consultant floppyfanjo ? you can always tell those who are going to go into looking after the elderly amongst the junior doctors because they tend to be lovely

Can i just apolgise for my awful spelling on this thread , am on hardcore painkillers , did actually give my son the dogs dinner tonight

frumpet Yes !!

I'm less than 6 months in of working within HCOP but I agree with you.