To think this mother should not have been arrested?

[KeinBock]

Apologies if this has been posted before, but this story is just so heartbreaking. The baby is seemingly being adopted against her mother's wishes. Surely any mother would kidnap their own child to prevent this from happening?

Also for those who say just leave the violent partner. If violence is all this person has ever known to be "normal" it's very hard not to end up in another abusive or violent relationship. It takes a lot of therapy and hard work to be able to change a persons who lifetime knowledge of what love is and what is a loving relationship.

I agree. I had one client who said that her boyfriend hit her occasionally 'but that's normal isn't it? Who here hasn't been hit by their boyfriend?'

This was 'normal' for her. So she had a mountain to climb in that she first had to accept it wasn't normal and then work on why she thought she deserved so little in a relationship.

I never took anyone with me to contact. Was late once (due to a snow shower on route but phoned to tell them) and missed three due to a severe chest infection. The first of which contact I made it to but the centre staff sent me to the hospital because I was so ill by the time I got to them. (it was a three hour journey on public transport) I was advised a week in bed and given anti biotics.
Not all parents act irresponsibly

poster OurMiracle1106

I didn't say all but I have to say in 7 years I only ever had one parent who never missed any contact what so ever and didn't arse about with it to be fair

The majority of the parents that I have delt with have chaotic lives and find keeping appointments ECt so are not very good at keeping appointments and even if they do turn up struggle to do so sober or with out abusing the staff ECt

And I can say now I am an adopter my own child's BP never visited her once

I had five contacts a week. Over ten months and missed three but social services were aware as to why. Another few hours and I would have been admitted to hospital. I do agree some parents don't make it or can't turn up fit to see their children through their own fault

Sadly I think Fusedog's experiences are very common.

a lot of parents have pervasive difficulties in all areas of their lives and this has a knock on effect on how easy they find it to travel to contact and be on time.

when I was starting out I used to think the SW was very cruel in fixing contact for 10am when my client would have had a much better chance of making a 2pm slot... but now I understand. If you can't get yourself up and ready to see your child by 10am, that is a pretty key indicator that you are going to find parenting generally a struggle.

I do agree. I saw it with other parents. Always an excuse. Also they don't always see they need help, arr prepared to accept it or follow it through. I do accept I am in a minority of parents. I am also in a minority of those that accept the adoption counselling and ask for more. Most parents don't want to face it.

Sadly, I think that makes you extremely rare. I think I have only had a handful of cases where a parent said 'I can't do it, I know I need help'.

And that is because it takes enormous emotional intelligence to be alive to your own failings, particularly over something as emotive as being a parent.

I always said it's the parents who know they can't do it are usually the ones who most likely can be helped.

The ones who are armament they can or were set up by the baby snatchers have no hope and I see this a lot on the other site

I struggle to feel any sympathy for someone who takes cocaine, speed, ecstasy and vast quantities of alcohol during pregnancy. I also struggle to feel sympathy for someone who leaves their baby with drunk people so they can go out partying returning two days later to find that their child has now been passed on to someone else they don't even know because the drunk people couldn't be bothered. I struggle to feel sympathy for someone who treats their home as a party house morning noon and night, full of people taking drink and drugs while there is a baby in there. I also struggle to feel sympathy for someone who thinks its acceptable to get pissed up and stab their boyfriend. This child is better off away from all that crap, I also think a lot of this might have been prevented if someone had stepped in when stacey and her siblings were growing up.

Mothers like Stacey are made, not born. She was obviously failed very badly as a child - by parents who let that happen, by a society who didn't intervene to rescue her.

we have got to try to break the cycle at some point.

that doesn't mean we can't feel very sad for her. But she doesn't sound like she is able to keep a child safe at this time in her life. I hope one day she will be able to turn it around. But she will need to own her problems and get help.

happy, I really do appreciate that holding your tongue if SS bashing starts is difficult...but the reason the other side of the story is not put out there by SS is because it's not fair on the child. We all know her name and face, and it isn't right that we as random members of the public who don't know the family or anything beyond the news articles, know about her background and past. It's the childs story to tell to whom they want when they are older.

I still feel a lot of sympathy for the devastation of losing your child. I am an adoptive mum btw so I do have some experience of what happens after abuse/negelct and the effects of alcohol in utero.

I believe this is the child's grandad:

fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/t1/971853_153354564855091_836922430_n.jpg

Not just one family though I think. Whole streets and towns of them with bad parenting skills

It is those that ask for help to change that stand more chance of reunification. However even then sometimes the therapy needed can't be done whilst caring for a child (as in ny case) and the length of that therapy is out side of the child's time frame

I think she should be arrested; she broke the law. I understand her desperation, though.

When a child is taken by Social Services, is a reunification plan put into place? Here in Ohio, a child wouldn't be placed for adoption after nine months, unless the parents signed away their rights. They are given a reunification plan, with the steps they have to take in order to get the child back.

The article says the baby was taken due to an abusive relationship with the baby's father. If he's no longer in the picture, and the mom is trying to become a better parent, then I think putting the baby up for adoption at this stage might be premature. There's no way to know based on the article, though. The fact that she's visiting her 3x per week does make it seem like she's trying. Kidnapping the baby is certainly not going to help her case.

Of course she should be arrested. She committed a serious offence and probably terrified her child in the process. There's little chance that the true story is coming through in the media.

I am a criminal defence lawyer and I have dealt with many women who've had their children removed due to being involved with violent partners. Unfortunately, many of them have stayed with these violent men, despite being on 'final warnings' from SS. I've seen women who've been doing reasonably well and who've had their children returned to their care, only to go straight back to the partner who has multiple convictions for assaulting them, and promptly have their children removed again.

SS can only do so much. They don't always get it right, but where a woman hasn't engaged, and hasn't been willing or able to keep her vulnerable children away from a violent criminal, there really isn't any option but to remove the children. And they can't keep giving them back again and again, otherwise you finish up with children who have no idea whether they're coming or going, and who have no faith in anyone's ability to keep them safe.

steff - the process is explained here.
www.childprotectionresource.org.uk/category/the-law/key-legal-principles/welfare-stage/

under the Children Act the LA will apply for a care order if it thinks a child has suffered or is at risk of suffering significant harm.

The LA writes a care plan which sets out the timetable for the proceedings, which must now complete in 26 weeks.

There will almost always be an assessment of the parents and any family members who also want to be considered. The child has a Guardian who also assesses and makes recommendations.

Adoption is NOT inevitable. This has to be the 'last resort' as both domestic and European law is very clear that a child should be with his family if at all possible and the state has positive obligations to offer assistance and support.

So if these proceedings had gone on for nine months and the mother was told her child was going to be considered for adoption, then there is going to be a wealth of evidence as to why this is the best thing for the child.

It doesn't sound sadly as if this mother is being supported by her friends and family to change.

OurMiracle1106 You don't have to answer but what concerns did SS have in the first place, do you think having your child put up for adoption was the right thing to do.

Because it seems like you tried very hard to maintain visits and follow SS advice

huge back story obviously social services do not snatch children from mothers breats and she did kidnapp her putting her at risk

I had a client who was always on time for contact and had lovely interaction with her child. But sadly she also had a massive drugs problem.

SW are not looking for excuses to keep children away from decent loving parents. And if they were, those of us who act for parents might notice, don't you think?

My dh only knew abusive relationships from birth until he met me.
he is a brilliant Dad, none of this therapy needed for him to raise 3 dc without a hint of being abusive.
it annoys me this insistence that the abused become abusers or attract further abusers.
Some people are able to stop this cycle themselves, without outside help.
It is an awful state of affairs when you thank god that ss weren't involved in your abusive upbringing, that you suffered this alone because had they been involved you would be deemed to be incapable of raising your own dc without abusing them.

Yes, some people are able to live happy successful lives, even though their childhoods were miserable.

But i suspect, from what I have seen, they are the minority.

Most of us, if we spent our childhoods frightened or abused, would show signs of this as adults.

The thing which worries me about this article is how her dad paints things, and how this clouds people's opinions of what happens. I'm involved with ss work, and the reality is, there are not a lot of parents turn up ready and commited. I don't know this young mum to comment, but a lot of parents consider that they are doing "all ss ask of them" if they turn up for contact ten minutes late, disheveled with a cheap energy drink in hand, and sit taking pictures of the kids laying in a bouncer or walking between toys, bleating about 'properloving their kid'. However they don't feel that they have to change their lives outside contact, as that something they can change 'when the baby is back' and 'their kids aren't around so what does it matter'. Then when its too late, its never their fault.... And I'm generalising here i know, but this is true in around 80% of cases. And i get the feeling this was the case here... Going from that, I can see why adoption would have been the plan- had she been successful her daughter would not have spent nine months in care, but would be going through an intense reunifying plan by now if it had not already happened.

ourlittle speaking from the other side, I admire you- I wish most parents I know could learn like you have and admit what they need to do. I wish you success should you choose to have another child, I have a feeling you will do what you can to show how you have grown as a person.