Who is being unreasonable?

[Regbooboo]

You may have seen my previous posts on whether I should join my husband to live in Canada. I have decided that I will give it a try as he has lived in the UK for 11 years even though he hated it. I have told my DD (34 years) and DS (28 years) and my son is OK with it although obviously he will miss me.

My DD on the other hand is very upset that I am going and leaving her and DGS (22 months). I will be coming back every six months for a visit and to stay six weeks or so.

My DD and my DH (not her dad) have never got on and she has always resented him from day one. One of the reasons he went back to Canada is because she is so controlling. I posted a pic on Facebook of me and DGS and my DH commented that I looked good and that he was looking forward to me coming to join him "in our little house on the prarie" (as we call it). DD commented "Yeah Mum you will be happy then". DH then retorted with "thanks for your support". All a bit nasty really. Once again I AM STUCK IN THE MIDDLE and I am fucking totally fed up with it. She says he's got his own way and rubbing her nose in it and he says why can't he comment that he's looking forward to me arriving. I sometimes wish I was completely on my own and to let them all get on with it.

Would like to know who is being unreasonable (if anyone) in this instance?

Sorry for long post but no-one else to discuss with.

Thanks for your patience.

Nobody - I think the OP has had an easy ride of it. Those of us who have pointed out a few home truths have been respectful and kept to the facts the OP provided in her 2nd post. It sounds like a successive string of relationships which the DCs fitted around

Can she honestly say hand on heart that she has invested strongly in her relationship with her DCs? Is it any great surprise that her DD is exhibiting signs of rejection ?

There are winners and lovers in these choices and I don't feel I can honestly see how the DD was ever a winner. I don't think that being 3 yo has anything to do with it.

Sorry it should say 34yo ie DD being an adult now

Good old autocorrect

Winners and losers

Can she honestly say hand on heart that she has invested strongly in her relationship with her DCs? Is it any great surprise that her DD is exhibiting signs of rejection ?
This ^ and people feel rejection at all ages. Being 34 makes no difference.

Lol @ winners and lovers!

I'm not saying anyone has been rude or disrespectful at all, and as I say I also think the OP has clearly made mistakes in her life, but I also know how abusive relationships can affect people. I'd agree on the neediness of OP to have a man in her life, this is again a common thing in DV sufferers. But the OP can't turn back time, she needs a frank conversation with her DD where she admits and apologises for her mistakes. But I also think DD needs to take control of her own life, she IS manipulative and emotionally blackmailing OP, but she also is a product of the abuse. I just don't feel all the blame lies with either party.

The OP was a victim of domestic abuse! Of course she should have left! And abusers are very adept at manipulating situations to their own benefit. Victims often are left feeling powerless. People slating the OP for this??? Obviously she isn't perfect and has made mistakes but she was escaping abuse! People in that situation don't always think straight. Plus abusers often manipulate kids so that they can maintain control over ex. Daughter is also a victim, but she sounds very immature and manipulative.

OMG - those of you saying she "left" her children - did you want her to stay in the abusive, violent relationship she was in? Would that have suited your notions of what she should have done? Are you serious?

She said she had been bullied and beaten by her first H. She was in a ground-down state and was made to accept being the NRP by her violent bully of an H. And yet you somehow think that she "got an easy ride"? Blimey.

Victim blaming a-go-go.

I think walking out on your children & leaving them in the care of sometime you know is violent ad broke your arm is reprehensible, regardless of whether you are male of female.

The DD will be damaged by her childhood in ways the OP doesn't even seem to have considered. It has been a conveyor belt of mum's boyfriends, culminating in a toyboy who has decided to scapegoat the DD for everything he doesn't like about living in this country.

Frankly, your DD will probably manage better without you, but I can understand her insecurity as a result of her difficult childhood.

a conveyor belt of mum's boyfriends hardly a revolving door in her bedroom, two husbands in 20+ years since her first marriage broke up?

However I agree that leaving DCs with a violent man would not be the solution that would occur to me - but I've never been faced with that.

Your DD has learned her abusive behaviour towards you from her DF. She needs counselling in my opinion, and you need to move to Canada.

Things were different 23 years ago when the OP left her violent DH. The police did not have the understanding about DV that they do now. It would have been incredibly hard for the OP to get rid of the DH completely.

Show a bit of compassion, please.

Clearly the DD is very damaged as a result of all this - damaged by her abusive father, not her mother.

I would say the daughter was damaged by her upbringing. You can't put all the blame onto one parent it sounds like things were bad all around but it's no wonder the daughter feels insecure and as if she is coming second best again - that may not be the case but I can see why she feels that way.

What will happen if you stay?

so your daughter and her partner work fulltime and have you there all weekend to babysit so she can stay in bed until 2 and then go out with her partner? You must be joking? No wonder she doesn't want you to move, she'd be forced to spend time with her child!!

I can see your daughter's point, to be honest. In her shoes it would seem to me that all you care about are your husbands and yourself, all these years all the effort put into your marriages while I was left with an abusive parent...

She may be difficult, but I don't think it's right to put the sole blame onto her. You don't sound as though you even like her very much.

And FWIW, it is hard to see your parent, who didn't care very much about you as a child, dote on their grandchild. You're left with no doubt that they're capable of caring, just that they didn't want to care about you. It hurts.

I think that the guilt of the past is making OP feel that she has to do whatever dd wants to try to make up for it.I think they should invest in counselling together and all these unresolved things can be thrashed out in a safe environment. I stated with abusive x for 35 years, when the dcs were small it really wasn't the same as it is today and was almost impossible to get the support as today. Don't blame OP for her choices, sounds to me like she had been suffering all her life. Two marriages when she was the NRP is hardly enough to make dd feel this bad it also has to do with her X who had her most of the time.
Get joint counselling

I've just read through that 2nd post again.
I can understand why your daughter feels rejected. She feels as though your relationships take priority over your children. Perhaps that's why you provide so much childcare for your dgs, misplaced guilt? And from Friday to Saturday when they were kids, that's how much time you spent with them? I know the Mumsnet feminists will pile in now and shout, but children really really need their Mother, more so than their Father. That's just a reality, not gender politics.

My mum looks after my DS while I'm at work and if she moved to Canada I'd be devastated - but not because I'd be losing free childcare as some here would cynically think! He has a wonderful relationship with her (he'll go to her rather than me or DH too) and it has been such a bonding experience for us as mother and daughter. I would hate to lose that.

It sounds like your dd has been very affected by what has gone on in her life - and maybe at 34 she should just deal with it, but otoh maybe she is just more emotionally fragile than your average robust Mumsnetter who can apparently deal with everything life throws and brush it off.

Maybe stop trying to see yourself as torn or in the middle, but as a person whose decisions will affect others around them - as we all are. Stop fighting your daughter and spend some time with her, not to give her a break from childcare but go and have some fun days out together, make some memories. Remind her of the person you are and how much you both love each other. It sounds like you've both lost sight of that.

To be honest I thought you would have left by now.

I remember your last posts.

Go to Canada and enjoy life: your husband sounds lovely.

I would go to Canada in this situation.

But I am amazed at the number of posters who assumed the daughter just wanted her DM to stay for the practical help before the OP added the full facts. Do you really think that is the only reason someone wouldn't want their DM to emigrate?

I would be devastated if my mum moved abroad. I'm 34. I love her and I value her time and company. Of course I would support her choices but I can't pretend I'd get over it ASAP.

OP- Is there any way you could have counselling with your daughter to help you both come to terms with the past and the move?

Op made it clear that DDs father was a good father. That he and stepmum looked after the kids well. It seems Op, the mistake you made was to not go home to the battering you knew you were going to get. He broke her..... she didn't know what to do. Had he not been battering her, she would have stayed. Yes, the situation had a negative impact on the children. Of course it did. We don't know if Op has tried to talk to her children about how her first marriage was. We have no idea if she is able to repair her relationship with DD. It is clear that DD is angry and abusive.
We actually cannot help with the decision. We can only say what we would do using the info given.
I would go to Canada.

"Op made it clear that DDs father was a good father. That he and stepmum looked after the kids well."

That didn't stop lots of people piling in and saying how the DD had learnt to be an abusive cow from her father. Which I thought was horrible, given that the DD was left with the father by the OP. Of course this is bound to cause emotional scars and that doesn't make her a nasty abuser as a DD. No one's saying the OP should have stayed in an abusive marriage, but her take is inevitably from her POV. The DV situation was so untenable she walked out but then the violent partner became a great dad with a loving stepmum and the OP showered her with gifts, so what's the DD's problem? Seriously, if you can't see why the DD has issues, you're on another planet. Esp as the OP is doing it all over again by bonding with the GC then leaving for her man.

I'm not saying Op shouldn't leave. I think she should, and I think the DD will be better off focusing on her own little family and not letting her mum keep re-opening these wounds. Cheap rent and such don't make up for the cracked foundations of that kind of childhood. Your DD is not BU. Your Dh was insensitive to intrude on the nice post when a moment's thought would've told him it wouldn't help. But all he was thinking about was his own feelings. DD is also thinking of her own feelings - missing your mum is understandable at any age, esp with that history. And OP is thinking about herself, even if it's couched in 'oh i'm so stressed thinking about everyone else' terms.

You are all three being unreasonable because it's a fraught situation. If you go to canada, at least DD's situation can normalise without you, and you can hopefully enjoy yourself with your DH. But for all of you to get along together is an unreasonable ask and you should know and accept that.