AIBU to think schools should not threaten parents with not allowing vehicular access to the school and with clamping if this doesn't work?

[TattyDevine]

They have some double yellow lines for the school bus. I wholeheartedly agree that people shouldn't park on them, as the school bus does need to park somewhere. But people do occasionally. There is no signage saying don't park there. The school do not yet own the land (its a Public Private Partnership type arrangement).

They have threatened parents who park on them that they will have a note left on their windscreen and a 2nd offence means they will not be allowed to drive into the school. Who on earth would enforce this? Would the police even be interested?

In addition to this, the headteacher ended the note by saying "if this more draconian approach does not work, we may take up the offer from a parent to introduce clamping". I thought since October 2012 clamping on private property was considered unlawful?

Or am I wrong about that?

The head teacher also asks parents not to park on the grass verge opposite the school (which is the highways agency responsibility and nothing to do with the school and not private property) because it leads to complaints from the parish council and local residents. But they don't own this land, and it is not illegal to park there.

I find it slightly worrying that a head teacher would threaten parents with something unlawful, regardless of their bad behaviour, without checking the legal position first. What are your views on this? Do double yellow lines on private property even have any legal weight? (I'm pretty sure they don't without signage).

Just for the record, I never park on the double yellows, because its obvious the bus needs to park there, but I am still left dumbfounded by the bizarre rant.

AIBU?

Its a real shame she has had to resort to this but I am concerned that she will ultimately make the situation worse with a knee-jerk reaction

I think what I find unreasonable about your OP and further posts is that you see this as the HT's problem, not a problem caused by selfish, entitled parents, who don't give a toss about anyone else's children.

I do see this a lot: on becoming a parent, some people become very selfish, and care less about the community and other people's children. So much for parenthood making people "better"!

Well, I thought I'd update.

This morning they were taking children in via the hall, which they sometimes do when its raining. There were STILL parents parking on the double yellows to drop off and the Head Teacher was stood there screaming at them.

I have to admit I'm amazed at how many people still park on these lines, legal or otherwise. No idea where she will take it from here.

*UptheChimney of course the problem is caused by selfish entitled parents. And selfish entitled parents do unfortunately become the Head Teacher's problem, which I'm sure she doesn't have time for. For that I sympathise. I guess I just think she's gone about it the wrong way by taking the law into her own hands - thus making it even more her problem.

*Curflew I thought both those things. It concerns me that her reaction to this problem, which I agree is a problem, might reflect badly upon the school or might cause her more problems in the future than the problem itself, if that makes sense.

Oh can anyone answer this for me. Our school is at the top of a cul-de-sac. There is a turning area in front of the school with yellow zigzag lined in this area and then a little way down the main part of the street (and white lines in front of residents driveways) so very limited parking.
Every day there is a disabled parent who parks on these zigzags and it blocks the crossing in front of the school.
Is it legal to park on these lines? It really pisses me off because I have to step out onto the road to see right to the bottom of the street to see if it is safe to cross.
I've never said anything but have silently seethed because its so bloody dangerous.

Why on earth are you so outraged at being told not to park where you know you shouldn't?? There are no schools round here (London) where you can drive onto the premises (or park outside) and it really isn't any more than a slight inconvenience. Get over it.

Why doesn't she ask the local traffic warden to patrol in the mornings?

*Floggingmolly I am not outraged about being asked not to park where I know I shouldn't - I have never parked there and never will. The bit about the letter that concerned me the most (and no, that doesn't mean I don't care about children's safety) is that she has threatened illegal clamping if the double yellows don't work. I'm not sure how much clearer I could have made it in the OP that this isn't about me and my parking arrangements. And I'm not sure local traffic wardens do private property or do they?

I find it deeply troubling that a parent cannot think of anything but her need to park. Get out of your car and WALK; if you need to drive from your home then park some distance away from school where it doesn't cause any danger, and walk. Much better for everyone.

Essiebee that is what I do, if you care to read the thread! Good grief! How much clearer can I make it that this is not about me and my parking habits! I have stated several times that I park of site and walk!

*off site

Sorry, Tatty, I've probably misunderstood. The school don't own the land, which has double yellows painted on it. How is this private land?
The wardens patrol round here; but outside our school gates is definitely the public highway, so maybe different to your set up.

If a head teacher thinks they can enforce their will in any way they like, regardless of law, what if this thinking filters down to how they choose to discipline children? Or not stick to the national curriculum?

I'd like to see the money we have to pay for a parking supervisor every morning and afternoon diverted to materials which benefits students. However, because parents think that dropping children at school gives them a free pass to do whatever the fuck they want, then we need to spend that money preventing children getting injured.

Op it sounds to me like the HT is having a lot of pressure placed on her with regards to the selfish and potentially dangerous parking habits of parents. She is unlikely to have joined the teaching profession with the aim of being responsible for parking and traffic management so I think you should cut her some slack for not reacting with expertise in the field.

Perhaps you could offer the HT some support instead of complaining about her efforts to address a problem largely outside of her control? Maybe you could organise a parent group that could patrol the affected areas to challenge the poor parking? If the offenders are challenged by their peers on a daily basis they might think about changing their behaviour.

That's a very useful post, thanks PooroldJumbo. I'd like to offer some support and a parent group is a possibility, though like Tiggytape says it could get ugly. It would be a shame however if they ended up having to use school funds to pay a professional.

Tatty it's no good - AIBU has always suffered from 'post first, read thread later' syndrome - and since PenisBeakerGate we seem to have even more sub-literate twats on the forum who don't bother to actually read the OP properly, let alone any of the previous replies and OP updates, before weighing in with unwanted opinions about the question they have assumed was being asked.

Its looking that way alpaca

Tatty I honestly think you could be the right person to lead a solution. You're responsible, lead by example, are interested enough to do some research and seem to be level headed.

I assume it is not illegal to simply threaten to introduce clamping? Perhaps they are hoping the threat will be enough to force the ignorant fuckwits to park elsewhere.

What would you have them do instead?

Thanks Jumbo. Its a really crazy situation given that there is a proper car park (which of course does get full) with about 25 spaces, they have even said we can use the staff car park, there is parking on the road outside the school which doesn't have double yellows, yet people still want to park where the bus is! Its not a massive school but most people have to drive either because they go straight on to work or because the roads leading to the school are unsafe to walk on (no footpaths, and in fact the LEA funds taxis for the children on one side of the village because its not safe to walk and provides the bus for the other side due to the lack of footpaths)

Perhaps you could offer the HT some support instead of complaining about her efforts to address a problem largely outside of her control? Maybe you could organise a parent group that could patrol the affected areas to challenge the poor parking? If the offenders are challenged by their peers on a daily basis they might think about changing their behaviour

Excellent point.

That's the problem, OP, that your post makes it sound as though the HT is wrong, rather than selfish parents.

In all honesty owl I don't know if its illegal to threaten something that is illegal - but I don't think it gives a good impression, that's all. I might be being a tight arse about that though, who knows. I come from a legal background so I tend to think in terms of legal fact which is probably why I'm reading the letter in the way I am.

What would I have them do instead? I really don't know. Not clamping, because its illegal, therefore don't make false threats. They never name and shame, if one person does something the entire school gets a letter or text, that's probably due to fear of being sued.

In the first instance bearing in mind the yellow lines are brand new I'd have sent the letter saying please do not park on the double yellows and take it from there - its obvious from this morning its not working yet but I'd start there before threatening anything illegal or potentially unenforceable.

Chimney the HT is not wrong to want to resolve the issue, I don't blame her at all for that. I have said up thread of course it is selfish parents causing the problem.

The head can't wheel clamp cars and is being silly to threaten parents with clamping.

However they can install an auto rising kerb and trap cars in the carpark so that cars without the key code cannot get in or out of the school car park. (The parents of disabled children and staff can be given a key fob or a key code)

www.parkingfacilities.co.uk/PF8000-Rising-Kerbs.C171251.shop?OCT_LEVEL=2

Such a solution is expensive and it makes the lives of delivery drivers hard.