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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to say "pardon?"

294 replies

matildamatilda · 29/01/2014 19:24

So I'm American and in the US it's not rude to say "What?" when someone calls you or when you didn't hear something.

It's informal, but not at all rude. Especially if you say it in a pleasant tone. So kids wouldn't be told off for answering "what?" the way they are here. It's just "what" as in "what did you say?"

Since I've lived here I've been training myself to say "Pardon?" but I just can't get the hang of it. It sounds kind of... supercilious maybe? Huffy? Am I just not pulling it off?

I usually end up saying, "Here I am, " or "Sorry did you say something?"

Do you say "pardon"?

OP posts:
UsedToBeNDP · 29/01/2014 22:40

Aged goose Grin

Dubjackeen · 29/01/2014 22:41

Skyways = always...

whereisshe · 29/01/2014 22:44

You need to read "Watching the English" by Kate Fox, OP. It helped me immeasurably when I first moved to the UK!

Also this...

Vixxxen · 29/01/2014 22:51

I was at Waitrose today and one of those UP class ladies with a very laid back outfit but beautiful skin and expensive items on her basket, accidentally slightly touched my buggy with her foot. She looked at me, smiled and said "pardon"

this is how you say pardon

I can't help judging when the MC friend of dd says pardon. Her mum who are extremely anal about her kid's manners is getting it wrong and she doesn't even know it.

I am WC and a foreigner BTW.

DameDeepRedBetty · 29/01/2014 22:55

whereishe

Clicked the link.

Thank you! I can almost hear most of those being said.

am not guilty of any of them myself oh no of course not

takingthathometomomma · 29/01/2014 22:56

whereisshe Grin I love that!

HesterShaw · 29/01/2014 23:04

Vixxxen, surely she should have said "sorry"? I can't think of anyone who would say pardon under those circumstances.

Catsize · 29/01/2014 23:05

OP, you said this...

Yeah, that's why I think I sound supercilious when I say it, like, "I beg your pardon, are you addressing me?"

But I think it is more 'pardon/forgive me, I didn't hear you. Can you repeat what you said please?'.

'What' is dreadful - especially when the 't' is dropped. The only possibly forgivable context would be the use of a whole sentence or two, such as 'What did you say? Sorry, I didn't quite catch that'.

Much easier to say 'pardon'.

Or 'eh?'. Grin

Vixxxen · 29/01/2014 23:08

whereishee I wish I was taught it at my English School.
It would have saved me so much hassle!
It took me a long time to realise that English people sometimes say the opposite of what they mean and are not direct to the point almost never. Thanks for the link, I shall print and bluetack next to my bed.

Vixxxen · 29/01/2014 23:09

But hester in the context she was begging for forgiveness...

HesterShaw · 29/01/2014 23:11

I thought she was just apologising!

Weird, isn't it?

perfectstorm · 29/01/2014 23:15

My mother was telling DS off for saying "pardon" and telling him to say "what", and DH was telling him off for saying "what" and telling him to say "pardon". Poor kid didn't know if he was coming or going, but both were just trying to instill good manners. They come from very, very different backgrounds.

I've told them both to teach him to say "sorry" instead. Problem solved.

Isabelonatricycle · 29/01/2014 23:16

cardibach Say again is a military thing. If you miss something over the radio, you say "Say again, over" or "Say again all after xxx", or "all before yyyy" etc. It then transfers into everyday speech and then their family and friends get infected...

I've generally found pardon to be used in two instances: "I beg your pardon" in a "What do you think you're playing at" fashion, or the passive aggressive "Oh, I do beg your pardon" (no I don't you arsehole).

MsVestibule · 29/01/2014 23:18

So, from reading the thread, I've ascertained that a lot of people who object to 'pardon', 'toilet' and 'serviette' do so because the people who use these terms are lower middle class, possibly trying too hard to be middle middle class.

Now here's a revelation for you - I AM lower middle class, along with a pretty large swathe of people in this country!! I was brought up to say 'pardon' and 'toilet' and I still do now. Not because my parents had middle middle class aspirations and not because I have any now.

So to all of you who look down on us LMC types because you think we have ideas above our station - fuck off Smile.

UsedToBeNDP · 29/01/2014 23:18

Vixxen, surely if in your example "begging for forgiveness" for touching your buggy with her foot is appropriate, then similarly, "begging for forgiveness" for seemingly ignoring somebody who is speaking to you is also ok ? Neither really need or warrant pleas for forgiveness/pardon but as a social niceties/politeness thing, surely one is as valid as the other?

Apols for typos, been up a while & I'm on iPad.

oldandcrabby · 29/01/2014 23:19

Fantastic link, whereisshe. I think pardon, what and sorry are all wrong and grate with different people. I can't stand 'pardon', know 'what' is rude and find 'sorry' is sloppy. I am old and middle class. I think what is wrong is they are all incomplete. 'I beg your pardon, I did not understand/hear...' 'what' or 'sorry' did you say or mean? These are all less contentious. What is the 'My Fair Lady' quote, 'as soon an Englishman opens his mouth another Englishman despises him'? Smile

ProfondoRosso · 29/01/2014 23:22

Oh, I'm so glad I don't live in England.

Alisvolatpropiis · 29/01/2014 23:25

Isabel

Yy to when two instances of using pardon.

Last time I used it was definitely the latter of the two.

SPsMrLoverManSHABBA · 29/01/2014 23:29

This thread is hilarious! I say toilet, loo and even shitter... Why the fuck does it matter we all know what it is and we all do the same when we are on it!

This really is an issue I see on MN. Call things whatever you want. If you want to napkin say so, those who judge people by such things are strange IMO.

As long as you don't wipe your arse at the table with it then call it a napkin or whatever.

IneedAsockamnesty · 29/01/2014 23:29

One school of thought is that if you don't hear something the person talking is not doing so in a clear enough way.

Vixxxen · 29/01/2014 23:32

UsedToBeNDP maybe.

But the way I see it is e.g.: she touched my buggy and asked for forgiveness for being careless, she actively inconvenienced me (not).

However if someone doesn't hear what you are saying, it doesn't mean they are ignoring you..it could be the volume of your voice, noisy surroundings, etc...no reason to ask for forgiveness.

I am a foreigner and to me what sound best is:
_ Sorry what did you say? (in a nice tone of voice and facial expression)
_Can you repeat/say again please?

My BIL is an intellectual and English language professor and I have heard him saying:
_Come again?

What do you people think of come again?

EBearhug · 29/01/2014 23:51

We were definitely not a pardon household.

I tend to say, "what did you say?" or "Sorry, I didn't catch that," or "Can you repeat that please?" (Half the time, what I really want to say, "Will you put the fucking speaker near your mouth and speak up! I expect you to concentrate when you're on my conference call!" Obviously, I never had, but god, some of them mumble away in the distance!) The majority of my colleagues are in different countries and English isn't their first language, so I do think it's important to try and speak clearly - I try to avoid slang, dialect and too much Dorset accent, and I think as I usually communicate with them by phone, "Can you repeat that please?" is usually clearest, sometimes accompanied by, "You're really quiet, are you near the mic?"

I do also sometimes catch myself saying, "say again." I know I picked this up from having to use a radio when camping out and calling home to base camp in the past. I annoy myself every time I hear myself say it.

I am also trying to stop myself saying "sorry" when I don't hear, particularly if it's them mumbling that's the problem. Although I think it's okay when it's, "Sorry, please can you speak in my left ear and speak up, I've had a bit of an ear infection, and I'm half-deaf," - because that is me at fault. A couple of my German colleagues delight in pointing out how British I am, apologising all the time. "Why are you saying sorry, when it's not your fault?" Mind you, on bad days, I do have a tendency to apologise for my entire existence.

Sofa, napkins, loo/bog - although toilets in public place, such as shopping malls, restaurants, train stations, etc. And also mirror, not looking-glass (but I was brought up to be aware of the Mitfords and U/non-U.)

Whichever words are used, usually you can tell by the tone of voice whether someone's actually intending to be rude or not.

wouldbemedic · 29/01/2014 23:58

OP, I do say pardon but 'Could you repeat that please?' feels more inclusive. However I'm chuckling at the idea of saying 'Here I am!' when I'm not sure what someone has said. Sounds like something Miranda would do - pointless but sweet :)

Caitlin17 · 30/01/2014 00:16

Sorry here too. I would only say "pardon" if it were to my son or husband and it would be "I do beg your pardon" and only if I were being sarcastic.

Caitlin17 · 30/01/2014 00:22

I completely agree about how irritating the "can" "may" issue is.

Lounges are found in airports not houses.