to be surprised how regularly posters casually suggest an OP makes a hugely significant or expensive change to their life?

[Thurlow]

Not sure if I've managed to word that title well!

This one has been bugging me for a while. An OP has a problem, maybe with work, or timings, or travel or something. Most posters come up with reasonable suggestions that might help. But there's always someone - and sometimes quite a few people - who suggest a massive change in the OP's life, as if it's something really easy to do.

For example, the ones that stick with me are...

well, obviously you have to learn to drive - as if learning to drive happens over night, and doesn't require time, money and possibly childcare.

you have to move house/out of London - because people can just find the money to move house easily, or wants to move away from their friends and support network.

you should get a new job - this one in particularly, because we all know that that thousands of employers are struggling to fill part-time jobs with child-friendly hours that pay enough to cover childcare too...

I know this is just a chat forum, and that you can ignore any posters and advice you like - but, but, but... Does anyone else get a bit about how casually some posters make suggestions like this?

Oh, I never say that they must do it otherwise they're wrong - I just put it out there as an option; I "suggest" it.

Unless I've read the title of this thread wrong, the OP is saying that those "suggestions" are inappropriate and that all "suggestions" on threads should maintain the status quo in all other aspects of the OPs life!

I disagree that LTB is said too quickly. I am constantly amazed on Mumsnet by what women will put up with from the cunts they are married to. Really. I can't understand it.

If its a choice between LTB and go to a spa, I always lean towards the former.

Or perhaps, learn to drive?

I don't mean the suggestions are inappropriate, but in a lot of cases they aren't always helpful at all. If an OP says they are seriously struggling with working and running a family and don't feel like they can cope much longer then frog, your suggestion would be entirely appropriate.

But sometimes it'll be a case of "I'm not entirely sure what childcare I need for school drop-off and what will be the best thing to do" and someone will suggest getting an entirely new job...

Agree Thurlow.

Suggestions are well and good, absolutely - but they should be make with the OP in mind, rather than projecting the poster's experiences. "What do you mean you haven't got relatives who can look after your DCs once a month for the weekend so that you and your DH can go away for a spa break? Just ask a friend instead - and if they say not, then you need to rethink your friendship" - it's that type of ridiculous advice that makes me want to gnaw off my own arm.

Posters once told me OH should leave the Navy because he had kids

I've seen one today where someone is suggesting HE in an entirely inappropriate situation.

I'm sure it is all well meant, but sometimes it's just a bit... silly.

yep, agree with whoever said 'get a cleaner.' That ALWAYS comes up, and cleaners are a) expensive and b) you have to be there to let them in, tell them what to do, let them out and stuff so not exactly a practical solution if the problem is lack of time/money/children always underfoot etc. Also if everyone has a cleaner, who is going to be the cleaner iyswim? Just a disconnect with the economic realities of most people's lives.

Also ditto to 'get another job.' I have a gif from some TV show, not sure which, saying 'Just get a job? Why don't I strap on my job helmet and squeeze down into a job cannon and fire off into job land, where jobs grow on little jobbies!'

I like the LTB threads, there is so so much advice in the real world and on the rest of the web ( to women particularly IMHO) that when faced with shitty behaviour from a partner you should run yourself ragged trying to accommodate or simply put up with bad behaviour. You are meant to work through difficulties, which seems to be code for roll over and accept it.

Discovering the LTB crowd mumsnet was a revelation for me. I have not and don't intend to LTB but it has been gamechanging to my relationship to have that in my armoury. Whereas I might have placated and back-pedalled in a row, now I feel I could say quietly and confidently. ' I will not put up with this, if you cannot treat me with respect then please leave' etc. and mean it. it has been very very empowering. (Thanks AnyFucker and co :))

I also do like e big picture advice. That is the beauty of a strangers advice. You and people close to you might be focussing on short term solutions. It needs a random to spot the big change you could make but didn't consider.

But there is a massive difference between truly awful, shitty behaviour and partners who are having a bad day and being generally ratty - and the LTB cry goes up all to often from (usually single) posters, as if the middle, sensible ground of sitting down to talk after everyone has calmed down is somehow condoning the behaviour of an utter bastard, showing you to be a weak and foolish woman who has no self respect.

If there is one thing I have learned from MN it is to put things in perspective. On the one hand, it has shown me that occasionally DP can be a bit of a prick, and expect something, and I've learned that yes, it needs addressing quickly. But equally, it has shown me that some women are with utter, utter bastards and everything that might frustrate or anger me in my relationship is so minor in the wider scheme of things when I am with a man who works hard and would never hurt his family.

That is what I sometimes feel is missing from the LTB threads. There can be an immediate jump to LTB when sensible conversation and addressing the situation is far more appropriate.

Of course yes, a lot of posters start a thread and you can tell immediately that the possible minor incident is in fact the straw that broke the camels back and there is a much bigger picture there.

I agree with the LTB getting on my nerves.

DH left the milk out before work, it's started to turn and I'm dying for a cup of tea - The response - LTB!

Of course that is an exaggeration but it's not far off some of the threads I have read.

But, surely, if you are in the type of relationship where talking sorts out minor to medium problems you're not posting on mumsnet about how he's eaten all the crisps (or whatever) AGAIN and he's so selfish etc.

Because if you usually just talked about it then you'd just talk about it. Healthy relationships don't pootle along for years without any disagreements at all and then poof! Argument about crisps, oh crap, I have no idea how to deal with this. Of course you do! If you don't have an accepted strategy in your relationship to deal with small issues then either you'd split up within weeks or months, if the person is emotionally healthy themselves, or you end up in a tangled game of "don't disturb the tripwire!" forever and walk on eggshells until everything is so utterly fucked up that "talking about it" just isn't an option at all.

And when pressed it 99.9999999% of the time comes out that "talking about it" is totally alien in the LTB recipient's relationship, either because their partner refuses to discuss things, nods and smiles but nothing changes, ot turns it all back around on her until she fears "talking about it" or becomes irrationally aggressive which frightens her.

I have never ever seen a thread where someone posted about a minor issue and people said "Why don't you talk to him?" and she said "Oh! I'd never thought of that, thank you so much for the advice."

IME talking to your partner is usually the FIRST port of call and it is only when you have learnt repeatedly that talking gets you nowhere that you look elsewhere for advice, believing that the problem must be with the way that you've handled it. But generally, someone you can't talk to is not a person you want to be in a relationship with, whether it's a personality clash which means you can't talk or an aresehole nature of one of you.

I remember a thread where the OP was given a sure fire solution that she looked at and reported back OT would cost £15k plus to do. Oh the anger and ire that was heaped upon her 'uncooperative' head!

The refusal to believe that the 'solution' offered wasn't in any way feasible was quite unpleasant. I think someone even wrote 'well you've been given advice and refused to take it' The OP didn't get the support she needed, and probably felt alienated by the response, due to this type of knee jerk 'I must be right' reactions.

It not OT

Bertie - that's true, of course, but there are times when posters just want to vent about their partner, whether that's as a result of a less-than-ideal incident or whether things have hit a bit of a dip in an otherwise strong relationship. Whilst there is usually good, sound advice you can pretty much guarantee that someone will come on, ask them if their partner is always that much of an arse, that their partner is obviously a narcissist/sociopath/having an affair, and tell them that they've obviously got self-respect ishoos if they are willing to put up with that kind of behaviour.

And you think - really, you - a complete stranger and non-expert in relationships or psychology - can infer all that from one post?

I love the old chesnut, 'Get a cleaner' in response to someone with a lazy fuckwit of a partner. The couple are both working FT and the solution is 'Get a cleaner/send your washing/ironing.'

What if they can't afford it?

I do agree with that, SirChenjin. I wouldn't vent about my relationship on here. Out of context, the innocuous can easily be twisted into sounding far worse than it is. Sometimes people are going through a bit of a blip and want to rant, but that can be taken very wrong.

Its a message board of opinions. Not a court order. Noones forced to do anything suggested

The "get a job" or "get a new job" comments rile me, since jobs ares few and far between now. I have one, but didn't for 6 months, and finding the one I have was really tough.
As far as the driving thing goes, it would be nice if, rather than assume that a car is a necessity, more people thought of campaigning for decent public transport for all those of us who can't afford a car-you know, thinking of what we can all do to effect real change.
But that would involve them doing something, rather than telling someone else to do something.

The driving thing, though, usually comes up in the context of the OP living in the middle of nowhere with 47 disabled kids, an arsehole husband and a complaint that public transport is too expensive/non existent.

It's really hard to know what to suggest other than move/get rid of arsehole husband/move somewhere more urban...agreeing that the bastard government should provide more doesn't really seem that helpful in the overall scheme of things....

Sorry that should read "LEARN TO DRIVE/get rid of at arsehole husband/move somewhere more urban"

I have wondered about describing my (lovely) DH on relationships to see if I get any LTB responses. I don't think it would be trolling.

Noones forced to do anything suggested

Bloody good job, given some of the crap that's spouted under the guise of 'helpful suggestions'

Actually OP, while I agree to some extent that these solutions don't tend to solve the problems like "I have only £20 to last the week" or "I need to get to XXX on next Wednesday and DH can't give me a lift and I can't drive myself" - but long term, people can see that the big changes would be the best option to stop these sorts of problems happening again, and again.

Yes, there's a recession on, but that doesn't mean there are no jobs. some people go years without ever looking, just believing that the crap they have at this job is something they have to put up with forever and making no attempt to look for something better. Often it just doesn't occur to people that getting a new job is an option, esp if you buy into the "there's a recession on, you have to be glad for the job you've got and not try to get another one!" idea. It might take a long time to get another job, it might be hard to get another job, but it's perfectly possible and people do move jobs regularly.

Yes, learning to drive takes time and money, but it's perfectly possible to do if you decide you are going to do it, and would solve the "not being able to drive and relying on other people" problem.

Move out of London/move house, again, this is a huge thing to suggest, but ultimately, a lot of people do take the decision to move house if it's going to make their lives massively better. Pointing it out is a way to often plant the seed that there's other options. A lot of people are frustrated by those who complain about things like London prices without considering that moving is something they could do and are actively chosing not to do.