To think this woman is mad getting into all this debt at Christmas???

[salsmum]

It's a well known fact all these pay day loans charge massive interest..why didn't she just go to charity shops/cheap toy shops etc...surely it will be nice for her kids to have LOADS of pressies BUT in the long run they will suffer when she's stressed because she can't afford to pay the loans back we were scraping to get by this Christmas (I lost 3 members of my family, including my children's Nan and Father)...AIBU to think she's wanting to give them TOO much??? www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2529393/Unemployed-mother-two-borrows-1-700-EIGHT-payday-loan-companies-buy-hundreds-Christmas-presents-children-says-pay-back.html

Snow

No, payday loan companies merely require you tell them you have a job, can pay back the loan on the agreed date. You can lie your arse off and still have the loan.

Their own "bespoke credit underscoring" systems are for their own benefit and do not relate to the applicant in any way. I've yet to find out how they work but will do at some point. I'm keen to know.

anyway these kind of DM articles are just to stir up hatred and contempt for the 'benefit classes' in this case single mothers. And look what a great job they do, as this thread shows.

This makes me sad. Going overboard on christmas in general does, As i think it usually is the result of some sort of personal issue. Obviously i would never point this out to people in conversation, Such as the girl i know who has IMO, gone completely over board for her 1yo. She had a shit childhood and never got anything nice. Her parents would open birthday cards and christmas cards and take the money for booze, Sell any expensive presents off relatives and friends for booze (My mum went ape shit at them once for doing it with winter coats my mum had bought them).

So i'm not going to point it out to her, shes just wanting to ensure her child doesn't have the disappointment she did. Having to go to school and lie to your friends about your home life etc, never having anything nice. Although she isn't unemployed or getting into debt for it.

I think a lot of people are probably similar, whether its like the girl i know, or like others who are just insecure.

I know single mothers scraping by on benefits, one was asking one year if the presents, totalling £300, were enough for her 2 month old. I can only imagine how insecure or pressurised someone would have to feel to go to those lengths when already struggling, and god only knows what she either went without herself or how much debt she got into.

Personally, I am not in a fantastic financial situation this year. But we've had a nice christmas. My older two got a main present each, One was second hand (Not like the two year olds going to notice) in brand new condition so half the retail price. One was a very good deal.

Other bits theyve had have been, for example my daughter, additional items for large sets shed already got. She was very pleased and it wasnt expensive. (Polly pocket figures for the house she already has for example).

I wish others could escape the pressure and just do what suits them financially.

I think Imperial has it spot on.

Also, she doesn't even have matching wrapping paper! Bloody heathen

IMO, the DM doesn't necessarily "stir up hatred", I don't read any hatred in the words posted here - I just think people are incredulous (and somewhat pitying) at the way some people overspend at Christmas and are taken in by the hype of it all, then spend months/years paying back loans at [stupid]% to sharks. But at some stage dont we have to recognise these are adults who make these daft choices,

The article is a set up, at least MNers are wise to that. But there are definitely people who do that. Lets face it, we are in the silly-season, the newspapers need to fill up their pages with crap and so called entertaining articles like this.

Meanwhile it is great reading stories of how people are giving their DCs a very happy Christmas with recycled toys that are perfectly good and they don't even notice any difference, it's all about the excitement of tearing off that paper and seeing what's inside.

Agreed, better legislation is badly needed. The Government is currently paying lipservice to companies like Wonga, who purport to be doing a public service (yer, right) when they are preying on the most vulnerable in society.

Most important message of the day is that Polly Pockets rock! (And Sylanian families).

Snowhoho

They ask if you can afford to pay back, they don't do credit checks. That is one of the things that is so wrong, they don't check if you can pay it back.

I read it and could not understand it at all. The pictures must have been taken before Christmas for the presents to still be wrapped. Who would contact who? How could the DM advertise for someone who has done this to come forward? Would she do this and then contact the DM and allow such a shameful story to be published? Why would anyone think it was good to allow their children to be used in such pictures?

The list of questions is endless, unless I am so thick I am missing something major.

Whatever the truth it's vile to use the children, whoever thought that was ok is worse in my mind than the stupidity of all the debt for a pile of 'stuff'

The whole story stinks.

Oh for goodness sale it's a Daily Fail trash story. Ignore it.

This won't make me popular.

There is a benefits culture in this country and you do not have to buy into it if you are on benefits. It is often characterised by making a huge deal out of events such as Christmas but also weddings, funerals and birthdays. I used to work in a school in one of the most deprived areas of the UK (that said, if schools' jargon is to be believed, 90% of schools have a catchment area that is one of the most deprived in the UK!) and in a typical school year of 90 students, if you added together what they spent on prom night, you could have paid off my mortgage and bought another small property on top.

The attitude is living on a day to day basis, no plans for the future because what is the future? Christmas is a hugely important event in 'this' world. To be frugal at Christmas would have you labelled a 'bad mum', not a sensible one. It isn't about what the kids need, it's about what you need to give them.

I think, from what she said, her mum died this year. I feel for her - her mum was probably her main form of support.

Notanother, the Daily Mail will have contacted her, most likely: she may well have left a comment about pay day companies not being all bad as after all how else would she give her kids a good Christmas?

I bet they got in touch using a female reporter with a nice fruity voice saying they were running stories about 'Christmas no matter what the cost!' and were just lovely to her and marvelled at the lengths she was prepared to go to to give her kids a good Christmas and got them to pose in front of the presents. They'll have sympathised when she said she wasn't sure how to pay it back and I bet they cackled with glee upon seeing one was mixed race and the other white.

She probably thought it would be a sympathetic story about a young woman who had a hard year and lost her mum but made Christmas special anyway.

It's not just a Daily Mail article though - this story was also in yesterday's Mirror, as I read it at my parents' house.

The fact that she's a single parent with two kids who have (it appears) to have different fathers, was a teenage mother and is unemployed, is a red herring thrown in there for a bit of stereotypical added value. The main message here seems to be an 'aren't those nasty payday loan companies awful?' story. The woman herself even states that it's Wonga's fault she's in a mess. However, my initial thought on reading it was what happened to taking personal responsibility for your own actions and financial decisions? A 3yo and an 8yo do not need their own TV and DVD player, plus bike, plus numerous other gifts - especially if the parent cannot afford to buy these items without the assistance of payday loans. Material things do not equal love.

Sometimes people get into debt through no fault of their own e.g. they get made redundant, become disabled and can't work etc. This woman didn't have a job and took out loans. This mess is her fault, no-one else's. Unfortunately it's her kids that will suffer if she can't afford to buy food or essentials. But at least they'll be able to watch telly to take their minds off the hunger, eh?

There are no end of stupid people and unfortunately this lady is far from alone.

I remember a few years ago on another site, a single mum was complaining about how she couldn't afford to heat her house and they were all sat in coats. Yet come xmas and she'd got the kids Playstations, TV's and laptops. Go figure.

I was disgusted by this. That gorgeous little smiling child holding the present - totally unaware that he is being exploited for a story. And some of the comments!

I agree with SoftKitty. She took out the loans knowing full well she couldn't repay them. It's her fault and nobody elses she obviously thinks brand new TVs are more important than food. If the story is actually true that is.

stgeorgia 'a nice fruity voice'. Why am I laughing and laughing at that description? What is a nice fruity voice anyway?

I'm sat here thinking she's got these loans and then gone to the papers to tell her story and avoid having to pay the money back to those nasty companies.

Cynical...moi?

Littlemiss - you know, beguiling and sort of fruity

I had a spate of fruity voices ringing me up inviting me to take out personal loans against my house and they made it sound SO simple and inviting.

Serious question: on Mumsnet, as a rule, criticising the benefits system (unless to say it is unfair) is a no-no. Children are hungry. People are poor. Food banks need to be filled to the brim with tasty, appealing food (that the children would never normally see) and sanitary products as otherwise women would be walking round with washcloths in their pants. Flat screen tvs and smartphones belonging to the poor are myths.

Yet no one thinks this woman is worthy of our pity? Just asking.

I have a family member that has taken out £800 worth of payday loans from multiple companies plus 300 from family members. they are on benefits. it was all unnecessary.

I don't understand what you're saying, stgeorgia.

Why should we pity the woman for spending the money on televisions for such small children? If she was spending it on heating or rent then yes, but televisions?

notanotherusername They dont advertise under their own name. They (and various others) use other people to do it. I have one on facebook and actually saw one asking for people, using near enough the exact wording a previous poster suggested they would have used.

I know they work with the DM because they told me and i refused to go with them due to it.

I've seen plenty of "live for today" in countries without a benefits system, stgeorgian. And Dickens is not exactly reticent about behaviour in Victorian UK with bog-all benefits.

But in the UK at the moment, poverty is associated with benefits. So we get people talking about "benefits culture", when what they actually mean is a particular "poverty culture".

It wasnt benefitsiwanted to talk about though and iwasnt replying to an ad. It was about sexism and HCP.

What these middle men do is basically take down your story and then they contact various papers and magazines to see whos interested and you go with the best offer.

I assume most of these people reply to these sorts of things rather than contacting the paper directly.

Imperial, what I mean is that a lot of the time people state that benefits/low income won't pay for the necessities due to debt and this woman is in debt.

I mean, income support, CTC, CB won't make someone rich but they will adequately feed a family. The reason that they won't stretch so far is, generally, because someone spent it elsewhere. If I pointed out that not buying a packet of cigarettes would buy a lot of food it wouldn't go down well at all - so why is that so different, really, to what this woman has done?

Also, having personal experience with the DMs reporters, i wouldnt be surprised if the more noticable cases (the large families) are bullied into it. Their reporters can be awful, nasty bullies when they want.

They (and others) descended on us like flies on shit when my friend was killed. She hadnt been dead 24 hours and they were barging in demanding, not asking, this and that. It was awful. I had two ten year olds sat on my lap physically shaking and crying because of them.