Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5

Original poster

to think M and S are now terrible employers and deserve eveything they get...

103 replies

glasgowsteven · 23/12/2013 10:33

Long story short... A friend of mine started with M and S in Leeds, in July, on a 2 month temp contract, with about 60 others..... 30 hours a week, set shifts, nice job...

then after three months they were all given another 3 month temp contract, to take them to 27th Dec.

they were all told, that temp contracts are just a precursor to a Permanent one, and after 3 temp contracts they will all get a permanent one - with a pay rise also...

November comes

"Overtime availability please, the more shifts you are availbale for, the better it will be come contract renewal...."

December 19th comes...

"we are sorry to tell you all that there is not enough work to give the permanent staff, sorry, you all finish on 27th, but we may call you in Feb or march if we need more staff"

Reaction was mixed, disbelief, tears, or walking out, or in some cases a combination of this.....

I could have understood Christmas temps not being kept on after a month, but these folk had been there approx half a year, working full time.

The stories of people who were relying on the money, who have had their confidence trashed, who just want to give up now.....

Horrible place and if they are hitting the skids, the managers at a local level deserve all the flak that is coming

OP posts:

Iamsparklyknickers · 23/12/2013 12:54

Actually I don't like the implication I have no idea what hard work is or the impact of unsociable hours.

For context I spent 4 years working in a care home and once spent pretty much the whole christmas week (including christmas day itself) there because of staff sickness.

It is what it is - that's work for you. Christmas comes every year and bar exceptional circumstances it's not a world ending scenario to have to work during the period.

monicalewinski · 23/12/2013 12:55

I see what you are saying Glasgow, but tbh if I was temp staff I would be working all the shifts I could get my greasy mits on to earn as much as I possibly could (even if I thought it would end up permanent), to make sure that I earned as much as possible on the offchance I that I may get laid off.

TinyDiamond · 23/12/2013 12:58

Sad for your friend but this is not new or exclusive to her in happens to temps every year!

Kewcumber · 23/12/2013 12:58

They thought 60 people on temporary contracts were all going to be given permanent contracts! REally?! SIXTY?!

M&S shoulnd;t have indicated the contracts would become permanent unless they had a pretty good idea that they were (no idea if this is the case here) anyone on a temporary contract who assumes they will move onto permanent is being naive. Why else issue a temporary contract than to have the flexibility to terminate it?

ThreeWisePerpendicularVinces · 23/12/2013 13:01

This happened to me too, at a time when I really needed a permanent job. I didn't walk out in tears though, I finished the contract and got a good reference.

The people who walked out crying were in the wrong, and may have damaged any future chances of further work with M & S. I certainly wouldn't employ them.

It is upsetting, but a temp contract is just that. If M & S sales aren't high enough to justify further staff then they can't be expected to take extra people on. Otherwise, there'll just be redundancies at a later date.

I suggest that the people who 'might as well claim', take their valuable M & S experience and start searching for another job. It's hard, but they'll get there.

Binkyridesagain · 23/12/2013 13:02

They only had 2 temporary contracts? so none of the 60 had reached the 3 temporary contracts leads to permanent stage?

Original poster

glasgowsteven · 23/12/2013 13:02

Yep

Of which about 30 are left.

They were all taken on in the summer.

For Marks a temp contract appears to be a type of replacement of a probationary period.....

OP posts:

Darkesteyes · 23/12/2013 13:05

mateysmumMon 23-Dec-13 11:59:21

So because you've had one set back you walk out and might just as well claim benefits? What rubbish.
Word is M & S have not had a great Christmas season, so staff budgets have probably been cut back. That's what happens in business.

Maybe if ppl had a bit more job security while working in places like m and s they would feel more confident to spend.
Food for thought eh?!

Original poster

glasgowsteven · 23/12/2013 13:05

This is the only part I have issue with,

I dont mind temp staff getting let go etc etc

All these staff were not brought in to cover a busy period.

they were brought in to fill shifts that needed covered......

Looks like the staff that are left will be doing more with less...

OP posts:

handcream · 23/12/2013 13:06

Of course if you are a temp contract there is a chance it wont become permament.

And, yes someone was quoting young single parents complaining that they might as well claim benefits up thread.

Some people do seem to have a sense of entitlement around working. M&S isnt a charity there to support you.

My job is permament but I have had my share of temp roles - who hasnt!

lekkerslaap · 23/12/2013 13:07

M&S have always employed Christmas temps.

I'm very surprised that they would say this would lead to a permanent job.

Never ever believe a company that says a job is going to go permanent until you have the contract in your hand. Oh, and keep looking, if you are want a permanent job. It's look after number one these days.

Original poster

glasgowsteven · 23/12/2013 13:09

M&S have always employed Christmas temps

Are staff who start in July really christmas temps???

OP posts:

redskyatnight · 23/12/2013 13:12

they were brought in to fill shifts that needed covered......

And now there are no shifts that need covering.
So they've been let go.
This is fairly normal ...

Iamsparklyknickers · 23/12/2013 13:14

Oh please, like anyone actually gives a shit about the workload of the permanent staff left - it's just another reason to whinge about not getting an extension on a temporary contract.

For all you know they might be pleased to have the chance to pick up some overtime if they're that short-staffed. Granted that's pure speculation, but getting your knickers in a twist over this is actually boarding on the ridiculous to be frank.

It's how temporary contracts work, and I'll say it again, M&S were acting decently to give them notice of this on the 16th December. Yes it's a shame no permanent contract materilised, but the fact is it was never a certainty and they were given loads of notice relatively.

To start drama queening over never working again is immature.

delilahlilah · 23/12/2013 13:14

A friend of mine had this with them the previous year, they did get back to him shortly after when they had work on, he has been there all year and been taken on permanently this year. So, the people who walked won't have helped themselves. He says it was well worth the short spell out of work.

somethingwillturnup · 23/12/2013 13:15

They were not Christmas temps!

M&S aren't the only employers to do this though - government departments do it all the time (not that I'm going to name it). It's poor business practice to dangle the carrot and then not deliver - not even one person got taken on.

Employers get away with this sort of crap because they know people are desperate and THAT is unreasonable. I wonder how many temps they'll take on in January when they realise they're short-staffed again...and I wonder how many people will have heard about how they treat their temps? If it's a small local store, quite a few I would imagine.

Don't get me wrong, I know things are bad for the unemployed right now but you can't just let yourself be walked all over - otherwise where does it end?

fromparistoberlin · 23/12/2013 13:16

it was temp. you cant blame M&S, its very disappointing but they cant take on new staff if they dont need to

Sausageeggbacon · 23/12/2013 13:17

Considering the expected backlash and boycott of M&S over the pork and Alcohol issue probably better off not being there. Saying that the whole issue with the religious lot wouldn't have come up apart from the Lose the Lads mag campaign. So distant connection but your friend can thank the feminists that campaigned about lads mags for M&S not offering jobs.

ThreeWisePerpendicularVinces · 23/12/2013 13:18

You may be right Steven, but that's the remaining staff's concern. You can't assume anything nowadays and I would urge the staff who walked out to get back out there and start looking for a new job.

I've been made redundant several times and had temporary contracts that have ended early. I understand that ultimately, nobody owes me anything and I have to look after myself. If the profits aren't there, you can't hire staff.

It's upsetting that it's so close to Christmas, but to just give up makes no sense at all.

Iamsparklyknickers · 23/12/2013 13:24

somethingwillturnup I completely agree public services are awful for this reliance on temps - but more fool them imo. It leads to constant fire-fighting and panicking when things go tits up due to lack of experience and not enough bodies.

Sucks to be them.

The golden rule in employment is to not take anything as a certainty till you see it on paper. It's not being walked over to treat the situation for what it is and keep your options open and be prepared to treat them in exactly the same way if you get a better offer.

Topaz25 · 23/12/2013 13:25

I can understand why the workers were upset. They were given the impression they would be kept on, especially if they worked lots of overtime, then let down just before Christmas. If the work is not there it's not there but M&S could have managed expectations better. However, walking out was an immature overreaction, which will rule out any chance of a reference or working there in future. I have been in the situation of not being kept on after a temporary contract when I had been told I would be. I was disappointed but I finished my shifts and got a reference, I didn't just walk out.

Iamsparklyknickers · 23/12/2013 13:26

Oh and Christmas Temps/Temps is completely irrelevant. It's a job that has an end date on paper and that's all anyone should take as a fact.

Even that means very little in this day and age given that even on a permanent contract you have two years where they can get rid of you for no reason at all.

Darkesteyes · 23/12/2013 13:28

Wow Sausage that IS a bit of a stretch. And a load of bullshit.

annielouisa · 23/12/2013 13:33

While it is very sad for the people concerned, temporary means temporary. I a series of temporary contracts and knew although I loved my job it might end on a specified date.

MrsArthurWellesley · 23/12/2013 13:51

sausage I fail to see the connection between this, a Muslim worker who doesn't want to handle pork or alcohol and lads mags

Can you elaborate?

Flip

1 2 3 4 5