Breastfeeding newborn

[SuperLovefuzz]

My OH and I have just had a baby girl, she's now 2 weeks old. I do all the night feeds and changes as I'm on mat leave and OH works full time. He does help if I need it by changing her, but mostly I do it myself (which I'm happy with). I've been breastfeeding her using nipple shields because she has a tongue tie, mixed with giving her expressed breast milk from a bottle. She's also had the occasional top up of formula on the advice of the doctor because she wasn't getting milk quickly enough to clear up the little bit of jaundice she had in the hospital.

On Saturday, her poo was a bit foamy and didn't seem right. I looked up online and found advice which indicated this meant she was getting too much 'foremilk' and not enough 'hindmilk'. Basically she was getting too much of the first milk that comes out which is harder for her body to digest. The advice I found on this was to only feed from one breast for certain blocks of time (alternating) to ensure she is emptying the breast in one sitting and so getting both types of milk. I also took her to the out of hours GP because she seemed to be in pain while pooing. He checked her and agreed that it is because she is not fully breaking down the lactose, but did not offer any other breastfeeding advice. He said this is all completely normal and nothing to worry about.

My OH thinks the best solution is to solely express milk to ensure I am emptying both breasts each time. I've pointed out the issues I have with this as follows (1) in some cases solely expressing can interfere with milk supply and she may end up needing to go onto formula, which we both want to avoid. (2) it is not practical for me to be getting up every 3 hours in the middle of the night to feed her an expressed bottle, change her nappy, get her down and then spend at least 30 mins expressing milk until I empty my breasts. I would have to express during the night to have any chance of keeping up my supply and also to stop my breasts from becoming overly full and uncomfortable. I had to have an emergency c-section and lost over 2 litres of blood. My wound is also infected and I'm on a course of antibiotics. So I need even more rest in order I recover. When I point this out to my OH he takes complete objection, saying I'm putting my own needs before the baby's. (3) this method means she is never getting 'fresh' breastmilk.

We are travelling 200 miles to spend Christmas with his family tomorrow, so I have been expressing milk and storing it in the fridge to use on the journey. Since Saturday, I have also been breastfeeding directly, giving expressed milk and a bit of formula to compensate for what was being stored (short term solution).

The main point my OH focuses on is that by breastfeeding directly, our baby isn't emptying my breast. I have pointed out that she takes between 3 and 6 oz in one feed when taking a bottle, and each breast only holds about 4 oz. I also tested this yesterday by keeping her on one breast for as long as possible and not switching. After this I tried to pump from that breast and only got out about 10ml (after much effort).

DFil is here tonight as he drove up to pick us up and is driving us down to his family tomorrow. (I can't drive because of c-sec and OH can't drive at all).

Since this discussion on Saturday about the best way to proceed, my OH has witnessed me breastfeeding and hasn't commented or tried to intervene. An hour ago when she woke up for a feed, I got up and went to pee first. When I got back OH was holding the baby and comforting her. I got my nipple shield and sat in position for feeding and asked him to pass me the baby. He told me not to breastfeed and instead to go and warm up one of the expressed bottles from the fridge (which I have stored specifically for the journey tomorrow). I said I would feed from my breast and if she needed more milk after this, I would give her a little bit of formula. He completely refused to give her to me so I got quite upset as she was still crying and obviously hungry. I left the room and told him to feed her and went to sleep on the couch. After 10 mins she was still screaming so I came back through and again asked him to give her to me to breastfeed. He still wouldn't do this so I went to get DFil and explained the situation and asked him to speak to OH. He did this and while I was there he agreed that I needed to be left to breastfeed in my own way. I then left them to talk and DFil went back to bed and OH came back through feeding baby with one of the expressed bottles, so I'm not sure what was said.

Eventually I told OH that if he will interfere with my breastfeeding in this way, he can take responsibility for the night feeds from now on and she will have to have formula. This is really upsetting me because I want to breastfeed as I can and think this is best. I am hoping he will become too tired with doing this and working and will relent and realise that not only is sleep important, but also that this should be left to me.

I am looking for any advice and would also like to know if IABU in the way I am handling this. I don't want her to be formula fed but equally, it isn't up to OH to dictate and try to railroad me jnto his way of doing things. I am happy to discuss and take on his opinion, but ultimately it's my choice.

Also on a side note, I don't feel like I want to go to stay with his family now and I will have even less control and will be in an unfamiliar environment. I don't feel I can avoid this though as his dad has come up for us. Also I do want to go because I want the baby to meet his family. I'm really torn about this.

Hi
Seeing as its the middle of the night and not many people up thought I would reply. Can't give specific advice as no idea how to deal with tongue tie, but I did espress for a long time and in my experience it was much harder to keep up milk supply if you are breast feeding.
Also not the end of the world giving formula during the night to give you a rest. I had a CS (without the blood loss) and badly needed sleep to recover.
I think you're DH needs to back off and take your opinions into account. I would say he can give opinions but the decision lies with you.

Ok ignoring your DP who is being a total arse.

1. There is no such thing as 'foremilk and hind milk' it used to be commonly thought that there was but this has now been abandoned as a theory.

1. It is however important that your DD takes a full feed and empties each breast, it is VERY unlikely that you will fully empty a breast by expressing as the most effective way of getting milk transferred is by breastfeeding directly.

1. Unfortunately, nipple shields are one thing that will decrease your babies ability to empty the breast, especially combined with a tounge tie, is there a plan in place to get the tt cut? This will be essential to maintain bf long term. Have you tried getting your DD latched on without them?

I'm sorry that this is a bit to the point - I'm up tending to a poorly 21mo and one handed. I'll be back with more thoughts and hopefully someone really experienced will be along soon.

Oh OP YANBU. I'm so sorry this is so hard. Of course you should feed your DC how you want.

Will post with advice in a sec just want you to know I am listening.

Hi, answering this with my 9 week old firmly attached to
My boob so really can empathise. Firstly-yanbu-your husband is being a bit if a dick and the "refusing to give her to you" is a bit concerning! I think your plan is a good one. Firstly always keep her on the same boob until completely empty, this will help supply and ensure she gets whole meal. You should feel her tongue flutter on the areola at the end, this indicates she's emptied the boob properly. I'd try and stop using the shields if you can because its harder for her to efficiently feed with them. I think keep persisting, don't express and bottle feed until you're happy with the breastfeeding and tomorrow when your calm and DH is properly awake have a serious talk about his behaviour because it was misguided interverrance at best, controlling bullying and controlling if it is a more regular occurrence.

YANBU.I can't believe he wouldn't give you the baby and your fil had to get involved! Is your dh British?

Are you getting the tt snipped? Your babies ability to drain the breast will improve dramatically after the tt is released. Best thing to do though is keep feeding - lots of skin to skin to boost your supply. Don't stop feeding overnight as your supply will plummet - night time is when the biggest volume/best quality milk is made.

Your biggest issue is your husband though!

One other thing, if you switch to formula for nights now, combined with your other issues it will be very difficult for you to build a decent milk supply. Obviously formula is fine if you want to switch but it's important to understand just how important 2am feeds are in the first 6 weeks.

Sorry for appalling typing, one handed dozy iPhone reply!

Thanks a lot for replying :) hopefully he will discuss this more rationally tomorrow! Do you mean you found it more difficult to keep up supply by BF or expressing?

Hi, my DS would never latch so I ended up exclusively expressing and it was awful. His first few weeks were spent with me in a constant cycle of trying to get a latch, feeding him a bottle of expressed milk, and sobbing over a breast pump (40 mins expressing every 3 hours ). I was exhausted and not enjoying my son. If your DD can feed from you that is amazing and you should keep it up as long as it suits you to do so.

As for your DH he should be supporting you, you are doing fantastically to say you are only a few weeks on from major surgery / blood loss.

Incidentally did the GP mean your lactose or lactose from dairy you are eating, could you try changing your diet?

Congrats on your DD, try and enjoy Christmas. This is brand new for everyone and it will take sometime to get into a routine right for you.

YANBU. And what mrscog says. Also, I doubt any pump is as efficient as a baby at "emptying" a breast. By just pumping I would think you are in danger of restricting your supply, not to mention exhausting yourself.

I do think you need to look at getting the tt sorted out though, and sack the nipple shields.

And yes, your DP/DH (sorry posting on phone so can't check back) is being an utter arse.

Expressing is much harder to keep up supply, well it was for me anyway although I only really expressed much later (3 months onwards).

In the 1st week I did 3 nights of formula feed to get some sleep then went back to doing the night feeds, but I was wary of giving any more formula just in case it affected things longer term. I had some health problems and just needed some sleep to be able to cope physically.

I think you have been given some poor advice about breastfeeding. There is lots of conflicting information out there, but your boobs never truly 'empty'- your milk is like a river rather than a pond- and expressing is not an accurate way of measuring your supply.

There is lots going on so I think the best thing to do would be to call one of the breastfeeding helplines. They can talk you through everything including foamy poo etc. and help you make a plan. Seeing a lactation consultant in person would be even better.

I think driving 200 miles with a 2 week old newborn and after a c section is bonkers and won't be good either for you or your DD. if you must go, you should plan to stop every hour. (Why can't you breastfeed on the way?)

I'm so sorry, I wish I was there to back you up and give you a big hug. Do you have a MW still you can call in the morning?

Just saw the other posts, thanks everyone! He is still up with her now and usually she settles within an hour, so even this is showing me this should be left to me! I felt a bit silly having to get Fil involved but he wasn't listening to me.

I'm so upset because I don't feel like I can just give in to his demands but by refusing to do it his way, I feel like my baby is missing out because if I stop BFing her at night my supply will dry up and she'll have to have formula all the time.
He is British. We're not actually married btw (I thought OH means other half and this could be used for just your partner? Am I wrong?) or maybe it's because I said Fil, just easier than writing OH's dad every time.
At first I was thinking the tongue tie would be snipped but have been told since that if feeding is going ok (which it was until this poo thing) that there wasn't really any need. The health visitor has said we can have it done if we want so think I will get this arranged.

I hope you are ok. Reading the bit where your baby was crying and your dh wouldn't give her to you made me furious.
You did well to stay calm.
I echo what everyone else says but would also add that at 2 weeks babies poo is often odd. My (ebf) dd2 was only pooing once every 4 days at that point but it has now settled down to at least once a day. I think your gp gave you bad advice.
If you are concerned about it, it is best to speak to bf experts- la leche league maybe? But honestly I think you are overthinking it. Babies find digestion hard to start with, it is normal. Just feed her as much as you can, try to not use the shields to help with emptying (though it sounds like that is not really a prob anyway given how little was left to express) and try to relax.
And tell your dh where to get off- it is your body.
I hope that doesn't sound patronising, I was very similar to you with dc1, stressed about expressing, building up stores etc. with dc2 I don't think about it and if anything feeding is easier and better.

Sorry massive x post. Didn't mean other posters had given you poor advice!

I think I'd just go and get your baby and breastfeed her. She's tiny and it will make her feel comforted as well as feeding her.

Don't feel silly involving FIL. Sounds like you need the back up!

I did get quite upset and was shouting a bit which I am upset about doing in front of my baby. At one point he said I was 'hysterical' which I agreed with and said it's because I am not being allowed to feed my baby.

I will phone the breastfeeding helpline to discuss and hopefully get some better advice. I feel like so much of what I've been told conflicts and it's hard to make the right decision.
It is so easy for DP to give an opinion and say I have to just do this as he feels it's right, no matter how difficult.
I feel like I've shot myself in the foot a bit by trying to get on with things after the c-sec to the point that he just thinks I'm fine.
I wish I'd never agreed to the trip to see his family but there was no pressure from anyone and when I agreed I felt fine. I think I was just running on adrenaline at that point!

I tried to take her before when he laid her down but I'm not willing to physically fight and risk hurting her. He has fed her with all the expressed milk I had stored up so nothing I can do now.
I can breastfeed on the way down but just felt a bit uncomfortable doing it in public until I get a bit more established and with Fil, so expressed instead.

Didn't want to read and leave you at this time of night! An also up feeding my 4 month old.
I agree with all the PPs.

Your DP is being very controlling regarding feeding. He should not have refused to give you your DD. that's very bizarre behaviour IMO. Is he always like that?

You need to speak to a lactation consultant or call a BF help line as it sounds like you need some advice. I'd get the TT snipped so you can BF without nipple shields. Don't judge the amount of milk you have in your breasts by the amount you can pump. Pumps are not very efficient compared to your baby!

I would just let your DD feed, feed, feed from the breasts to increase your supply. The more formula top ups you do, the harder / longer it may be be to increase your supply.

I found BF such a struggle in the early days. Keep going, you are doing a great job! I lt does get easier. Kellymom is a good website yo answer BF questions. In the morning, when things are a bit calmer have a word with your partner.

I also don't have any experience of tongue tie but did have to express, use a nipple shield and give formula top ups to my DS as he was initially too small and weakuto BF.

Exclusively expressing is really hard work and is not necessarily the most effective way of completely emptying your breast (although I don't know if the utongue tie issue means that in this case a pump is more effective than direct BF?) The amount which you can express will not be the same as the amount which the baby can take when feeding directly

I don't think that your DH should be telling you how to do each feed, but I would be wary of the threat to make him do all night feeds with formula as a few days of this could impact your supply.

I agree with your reasons for not wanting to solely express and I would also not want to travel so far so soon after having a baby, especially when it was by cs.

How has your DH come to the conclusion that the best option is to solely express? Has he read something somewhere or is it just his gut feel? I would be wanting to speak to a breastfeeding helpline or a medical person who is an expert in breastfeeding for their advice on what to do now and what to do about the tongue tie e.g. getting it snipped. If you end up following DH's advice and it is not correct and adversely affects BF you could have a lot of resentment towards him in the future.

Congratulations on your baby girl

The breastfeeding helplines are great and will have up to date bfeeding advice. In the meantime this Kellymom page is useful determining what is usual.

Can you speak to FIL and tell him you are feeling overwhelmed and it's too much?

And YY to posters saying to feed her from the breast as much as possible.

I got DD's tongue tie revised and it was very straightforward and really helped us.

The sooner you can dump the shields the better. Don't worry too much about her poo - weight gain and general demeanour is a far more reliable indicator of milk intake. And I would be hysterical too if I was refused my baby - who does he think he is???

I too was given nonsense advice re emptying one breast fully by HV with pfb, we had been feeding really well for two weeks then she turnsup, makes these comments and pfb andI end up in tears for 3 days.we then just went back to what we had been doing!
That was 2 years ago and I decided I didn't want to see HV at all this time with our current 3 week old.
It is my understanding that tongue ties are usually snipped rather than be left so I am surprised by this, although I don't know much about them tbf other than there is usually a waiting list so probably best to get your name down asap.
I thought you were not really supposed to express until bf was fully established, so after 6 weeks ish, I am sure someone with more knowledge will confirm the situation but if I tried to express after No2 has just fed I would only get a dribble. I found it was best to express once pfb had fed from one boob and dropped off it asleep so then express the other boon.
CongratulAtions on your baby, is it not an option to stay home for Christmas and relax with your new little Family? You need to rest.

I don't blame you for being hysterical, it's your instinct as a mother to respond to your baby, and he was keeping you from her.

I think he is entitled to an opinion on how she is fed, and you should take his opinion under advisement, but ultimately the decision should be yours. He should support you, whatever you decide. I'm sure new fathers are just as anxious as new mothers, so I would give him the benefit of the doubt (as long as he's not usually such a jerk), and have a talk with him when you are both calm about what you want/need from him and how he can support you in making BF successful. Do you have La Leche League in the UK, or someone who can come out and talk to both of you about how you can be successful at BF? Maybe if he hears it from an authority, he will be less anxious?

I would have the tongue tie corrected (untied?), also. My best friend's youngest had it, and when they got it snipped, he was a whole new baby. Feeding was much easier.