Chicken pox parties

[RosebudTheCat]

A relative has asked if I'd like to expose my two kids to her DD, who has chicken pox. My youngest is just 8mo. AIBU to think it was a stupid question to ask? Do people really still do 'chicken pox parties'?

SantaIKnow, what if you keep your child away from all the outbreaks and they end up catching it as an adult. What if your daughter contracts it during pregnancy it it affects your grandchild? Wouldn't you be feeling guilty about that and wishing they'd 'got it out of the way' in childhood?

Why should the NHS be paying millions to vaccinate children against a disease that very rarely causes serious complications. The US uses the whole 'save money because you don't have to take time off work' angle to promote the vaccine over there. Yes, it's inconvenient but children get sick and having to take time off is just par for the course. It's usually around a week - not two - anyway.

Just realised I repeated some of tiggy's points

Why treat rare cancers on the NHS, then? Why introduce the pneumoccocal vaccine then, it's 'rare'? Why offer the HPV vaccine, HPV is almost endemic among sexually active humans? Why give babies a rotavirus vaccine, most have it without complications? Why treat rare diseases on it? What's a few kids fucked up for life or dead?

What an attitude!

I have a friend who took her children to a cp party, then moaned and was upset for weeks when two of the 4 (all under 3) were really ill and miserable with it.

Wouldnt intentionally expose my dcs to it, especially the baby

I was exposed to the chickenpox loads of times throughout my childhood but never caught it, my doctor did a bloodtest when I was pregnant as he didn't believe me when I told him I hadn't had it!

Anyway, fast forward to me having a 14 month old DS and and 5 month old DD and we ALL catch it at the same time. It was actually 6 weeks of hell, I was so incredibly ill, I couldn't even walk with the pain. I was exclusively bf so couldn't take any strong painkillers, and the only liquid I could drink was gaviscon due to my burning throat

I get a bit worried when I hear babies under 12 months don't build up an immunity against it, because DD has got quite a few scars from it. Does anyone actually know if this is true or not?

I shouldn't have read this but please can someone say something to make me feel better - am stuck at home with Ds1 who has chicken pox, Ds2 (2.5) and DD(5months) - there is absolutely nothing I can do to stop the little ones getting it and am sick with worry about it because I can't keep them safe. What can I do? Does breastfeeding DD mean that she will get some of my antibodies so maybe not be so ill?

Yes twiggy, I know that it would be difficult to avoid, but apparently we should all be trying to do this because exposing our children to chickenpox is neglectful and idiotic etc etc. I have already said that it is endemic in the UK and most people will contract it during childhood. My response was to Santa who was asking how guilty you would feel if your child had a serious complication after you had exposed them. My point was that if, as a parent, you made every attempt to prevent your child from catching CP and this meant that they then contracted it as an adult then you would feel guilty about that too.

charley, as others have mentioned, vaccines don't always work, immunity from them can wane and you could be left vulnerable as an adult. Plus, vaccines carry a risk too - how do you know your child won't have a serious reaction to the vaccine?

Expat - Treating cancer on the NHS is not the same as introducing a vaccine program. Yes, meningitis is rare but it is still more common that complications from CP and the consequences of it are ore likely to be severe. There is already a question mark about the HPV vaccine among many people in public health. I will agree with you that the rotavirus vaccine seems unnecessary. Again, treatment of disease is different to preventing disease. No one is saying that you shouldn't treat a child if they do develop complications from CP. As for "what's a few kids fucked up or dead?" Don't be ridiculous - no one is saying that but rolling out a mass vaccination program to prevent a few cases of CP that do develop complications is a bit extreme. Why not throw all that money into figuring out a better way to treat the complications if they do develop.

bad kitty, the stories on this thread are not representative of chickenpox in general. Please visit the NHS website for reassurance. Most people, including me, can tell you that their children came through CP with no problems. Yes, if you have immunity to CP yourself then you will be passing some on to your baby so she may not get it at all or she may have it mildly - this may mean that she gets it again when she's a bit older but hopefully that will reassure you a bit for now.

charley - it's not typically 2 weeks - it's usually 2-3 of days of feeling ill followed by a few extra days for the spots to dry up so they aren't contagious. That is the usual course of the disease for the vast majority of children. I understand that it is not nice to see your child unwell with anything - that does not mean that I would rush out and get a vaccine against it without thinking through the potential consequences.

Re effectiveness and duration:
"From the second to eighth year after vaccination, the vaccine effectiveness remained stable at 81 to 86%."

So we only know that it is 81-86% effective for 8 years so far. So that would take most children into their early teens/adulthood depending on when they get it - not so great if it starts to wane then when complications are more likely and they are usually more serious. (As has already been discussed on the thread)

What exactly looks good to you?

"It is not known how long a vaccinated person is protected against varicella." ?

or are you looking at the 10-20 years (bit of a gap there - when should you get a booster?) and skipping over the part where it says:

"But, these studies were done before the vaccine was widely used and when infection with wild-type varicella was still very common."

I'm not sure what you mean by a 'tiny dose' of a vaccine - a vaccine is a vaccine. They all carry risks. Just have people have been saying that you don't know how likely your child is to react badly to CP, you don't know how likely they are to react badly to the vaccine either. According to the NHS link - the risk of a serious complication from the vaccine (e.g.. anaphylaxis) is less than 1 in 100,000. I believe I quoted the risk of serious complications from CP earlier as being 0.3 in 100,000. The risk of less serious complications from the vaccine such as developing a rash are 1 in 10. Having CP is also more effective at providing lifelong protection (over 90%) without having to worry about when it will wane (with a range of 10 years!).

Never mind 8 years what about 25 years or 50? I'm just glad I had it as a child when it was safer.

I was so ill with CP I had to take a couple of days off school and watch TV.

Lol! I don't think that's being pessimistic - just realistic! :) As I pointed out - 8-10 years could mean waning immunity when you are more at risk of complications. Having CP gives lifelong immunity in over 90% of people - no need for boosters.(which, as vaccines, also carry a risk.)

New guidelines for tetanus are 5 shots in a lifetime - not every 10 years. Although reading about the tetanus vaccine is very interesting.Very few cases of tetanus annually and nearly half of the cases are up to date. I wonder will we see a new vaccine soon.

If you vaccinate everyone then those natural boosters won't be there ;)

If you look at the figures, your daughter is as likely(if not more likely) to die or suffer a serious complication from the vaccine as she is from the disease. Add up all those boosters over the years and factor in the risk of her not being immune anyway...

Question about Chicken pox, DD started first having spots last wednesday, most are all crusted over now, when is it safe to take DD out again?

You could flip this thread , go back 15 years and we could be talking about the MMR. I remember the conversations, lots of anecdotes about horrific effects of the jab, people taking the view that it isn't worth the risk, and people saying they couldn't live with themselves if the jab meant something happened to their child...

Lucius, you have to wait until the last one has crusted. Hopefully it won't take too much longer if she started last Wednesday.

Lillly, I don't really think they're comparable because the risk of complications from CP is less than the risk of complications from measles. While people may have delayed, or opted for singles, most people still vaccinated against measles because the risk of complications from the vaccine was less than the risk of complications for measles (for some children this was not the case the parents made a different decision).

In this case, the risk of complications from CP is very small and, in fact, seems to be less than the risk of having a serious reaction to the vaccine. It seems strange to me that people are prepared to take the risk with the vaccine and assume that their child will not have a bad reaction to it but are worried about their child having severe complications from CP - you don't know either way and the odds are actually in the favour of CP (particularly when you take boosters throughout life into consideration as well)

Also worth noting that the CP vaccine is not as effective in adults so if you do need a booster in later life it is less likely to work for you and you may end up completely unprotected in adulthood.

It seems that catching CP is the best form of immunisation (other than in babies) which is why some people want their DC to get it over with.

DH had it as an adult and wishes he had been exposed as a child.

www.hpa.org.uk/webc/HPAwebFile/HPAweb_C/1194947358374 - hpa says 5 days from spots first appearing

ProudAS, he probably was exposed as a child but just didnt get it.

I doubt he went through childhood without any exposure but feels he may have got off more lightly with deliberate exposure as a child.

I wouldn't comment on any mothers choice to actively seek out chicken pox infection, or not, nut would say that trying to avoid every infection is not the wisest course.

My mother kept me as protected from infections as much she possibly could, as a child.
As a result, I caught everything from my children (this was pre MMR!!)
I almost died from cp, which went internally.
I was so ill with mumps, and the aftermath, that I couldn't care for my baby for weeks.
Adults - as a general rule - are far more sick than children if they get 'childhood' illnesses. Where cp affects internal areas, 1 in 8 adults die. (sorry, can't ref that stat ...straight from the consultant who treated me)