Children on a school trip allowed to pet my dog... I'm bloody LIVID.

[HarderToKidnap]

Should I phone the school about this? Every week I walk up to a local cafe with dog and toddler DS. I secure dog to pushchair on a short lead, he tucks himself behind the pushchair and snoozes in the sun. DS and I have cake and tea and sit by window so I'm next to dog, who is outside.

Today lots of primary school kids were out on a trip going from shop to shop collecting money for something. They went in the cafe before me and they left as I arrived. I placed my order, turned round to look at dog out of window and there must have been ten or twelve children crowded round him stroking him. He was covered in children. Teacher next to them smiling benignly and agreeing with kids how cute he was.

Dog is ten year old toy breed, is very cute but also very very nervous of children and has snapped at kids before. I never let unknown children stroke him. I was LIVID. For on,e he could easily have bitten one of the children and then they would be hurt and he may be put down. For two, who in their right mind lets lots and lots of children crowd an unknown dog???? I marched out there, said loudly "he doesn't like children and they shouldn't be touching him without asking the owners permission!" I was quite sharp but not snouty. Teacher said "yes yes OK" without really making eye contact and shepherded them off.

Should I phone the school concerned? Or was my sharp comment enough? Dogs are left unattended outside shops etc quite often and really the teacher should never be allowing the children in her charge to touch them, let alone crowd them. AIBU?

As a compromise, and in the spirit of earlier threads, why don't you show this thread to the school?

Elsie, spectacular display of total non understanding of dog behaviour and character.

Yes the teacher was stupid to allow the kids to pet him without asking owner's permission, but some people are stupid and you have the responsibility as the dog's owner, to factor that stupidity in to your own dog-owning behaviour.

True enough - but does that mean it's not also worth trying to educate? Given that it's common knowledge that all dog owners are not responsible any more than all parents or teachers, surely it's even more important to educate children how to behave?

So basically dont leave the dog outside again
I never leave my dog alone as worried shell be taken and/or touched
I still dont think you can just say well you shouldnt have left the dog outside because the dog was out of the way minding its on business sitting in the sun , the teacher allowed a hoard of children to bother it but thats ok ! the OP shouldnt be allowed to take her pet out with her then even though has been doing for 2 years with no problems?!
Like i say i can see both sides but no one can say this dog or that dog will never snap so ANY dog should not be appraoched IMO
I wouldnt be calling the school though as its over now and you said your piece to the teacher

It was tied up immediately outside of the doors and we were on our way out. The nursery open onto a park area, not a road. My daughter was in front of me. You seriously don't think I should let daughter open the nursery door in case there is a biting dog that I don't know about tied up outside?

Don't leave my dog at buggy height? That's made me giggle. Should chop his legs off or should I get the cafe to build a high shelf for him to sit on? He is just buggy height I'm afraid!

We all agree the teachers a twat. And obviously people who approach unattended dogs are also stupid. Although I'm sure small kids do pull away and run off very quickly at times and may not know not to touch.

However the other big concern is that by leaving him unattended you put the dog in an awkward situation. One that sadly affects him to a very drastic degree. So in theses cases you have to assume tht everyone's an idiot and protect yourself and the dog accordingly. If that means a muzzle and a yellow ribbon or leaving at home when shopping then that's just what you have to do.

Harder people are reading the thread. They are just disagreeing with you.

Sorry? You're going to have to expand on that, OP.

It doesn't matter what personality your dog has, what breed it is or what anyone else is doing with their dogs.

As a dog owner you have a legal responsibility to have your dog under control while it is somewhere that is accesible to the public.

Leaving it alone it is not under your control.

Good to see you fighting back OP with the tried and tested other people are far more irresponsible than me and what you say is common sense of course, although it shouldn't apply to me.

Yes, we've all agreed (I think) that the teacher was also in the wrong.

Both you and the teacher were in the wrong.

"My dog is essentially good natured and put up with ten kids crowding him"

But has snapped at children3 times in the past.

My last post was to feelingood

Im really concerned that you have a dog that isnt great with kids and has been known to snap at them, aswell as a small child. That imo is pretty irresponsible.

Yes the teacher should no way have let all those kids crowd roind and steoke the dog without permission....out of order and just shoildnt have been done. But honestly......what if a child had just run upto it before a parent could catch them. A toddler could be really hurt by a snappy dog.

Unfortunatley ive recently had to rehome my 10 month old dog necause she was too snappy for ds. She never ever dis it in agression, but still the risk was just too much. I knew she was lile this. I never ever left her tied up anywhere. Warned parents of young childrwn in the park etc. She was a lovely dog and like I said never aggressive even in fear.....but I wouldnt take the risk with my own young child or anyone elses!!

Put a muzzle on the dog when you go out. All it takes is one over excited toddler, too yoing to understand, to run upto your dog and get bitten. Not fair on either the chold or dog. And fgs dont leave it outside. Leave it at home or dont go.

Youve told the teacher off enough. I highly doubt she'll do it again.

I have read tbe whole thread...been here from the start

We're all frothing with rage because you totally sidestepped the issue of your own responsibility.

If the homeless guys dog bites someone it will be put down. So will yours.
If you love your dog you would protect it, by supervising it or muzzling it.

You all means vent at the school, but you aren't lillywhite yourself

I can't believe a teacher would allow one child never mind a crowd of 10 to pat any strange dog. I am amazed your dog did not snap at the air as a warning.

However, no dog who has form for snapping even occasionally, should be left tied up outside a shop/cafe without a muzzle. I cannot think of any dog that would not be distressed with 10 kids or adults touching it.
Your dog acted brilliantly in this case, but next time he must wear a muzzle as people are not always sensible.
My little dog stays at home when I go out to the shops and when we are dog walking would never leave her outside to pop into the cafe , we wait until we get home to have refreshment.

I am pointing out that you talk about a school group that is not a regular occurrence so not something that you have to take care of each time you go out. However preschool aged kids who are in a buggy are around at all times during the day, you can't be so complacent that you have nothing to learn.

OP, do you mind my asking if you are form another culture/not based in the UK? I ask because you have stated several times that is is common to see unattended dogs 'where I am'

The law in England & Wales is much more weighted to place the responsibility on owners than it is elsewhere in the world (esp Europe, for example).

If so, I can understand why it might look like we are 'frothing', but I can assure you that, if your dog harmed anyone (child or adult) the responsibility would be entirely yours. It is very difficult to argue contributory negligence in cases like this.

FWIW, your dog wouldn't actually have to touch a human to be taken from you and be pts, even causing a human to 'reasonably apprehend' that the dog will cause them harm can be enough.

Oh, and size of dog rarely comes into it, especially where children are involved.

I have said I'll rethink what I do with my dog. There are lots of people who leave their dogs tied up outside though. Children are going to come across them. A word in the teachers ear that she's not to encourage the children in her charge to climb all over them may be helpful, no?

A word in the teachers ear = yanbu
I'm bloody livid = yabu, for the reasons given in 75% of the responses above.

I believe you addressed me earlier in the thread, OP. Expand and explain please.

Regarding phoning the school I don't think I would.

Best to put it down to sometimes these things happen.

I don't think all the YABVVU and fuming is really needed :)

You take little risks here and there. You nip in to grab your cuppa under a scenario that has been fine for two years.

Most people haven't approached your dog, but there's always a chance.

The outrage over the fact that you do it is disproportionate.

It's a toy dog under a buggy not a foaming grizzly