To find this disturbing for a number of reasons....

[Tinlegs]

Photograph, posted on Facebook (and, therefore, in my eyes, endorsed) by a teacher of a group of people dressed up for Halloween. One person, "blacked up" (face mask, brownish make up on neck etc) one person "whitened up" (face mask, White make up) and a third person, also made up but in a brown colour. "Black man" wearing track suit, trainers and lots and lots of jewellery. "White woman" in curlers, Primark hoodie, track suit bottoms, heels. "Brown person" (an adult) in a child's buggy with a bottle, dummy and carrying what looks like a lunch box.

AIBU to think that this is racist and stereotyping of the worst kind. That they are dressed as a mixed race "chav" (not a word I would use but...) low income family who bottle feeds their baby, dresses badly and pushes a very old child around, who are all overweight etc.

Now I know these people. The area we live in is NOT at all multi cultural so there is unlikely to have been anyone offended at the party. But I am offended.

FWIW at least one of these people works with children on a daily basis.

Mumsnet, over to you.

Goady *

Ah, if it was Kanye and Kim then it's just a costume of slebs innit?

To clarify my 'Othello' point - I totally agree that there is no need to do that nowadays - I was just wondering if an 'authentic' production of said show would ever be acceptable nowadays. I agree totally that now we have the diversity of actors then we should use them! (and yes I'm glad also that we're moving away from the 'white guy gets the part' culture.)

Now, what I'm going to say/point out next may not be liked, so let me repeat what I said before about totally getting what the OP is on about regards perceived (whether intended or not) racism with the blacking up of faces, however I'd like to bring something I've noticed after reading the entire thread, up for debate. A definition of racism was posted as follows:

"someone is racist when they believe people of another race are one homogenous group who they can stereotype as all acting/being the same rather than seeing them as individuals they therefore see them as different or other to their themselves and their race."

Surely by that definition those of you saying that Lovely and taflee's non-white (see I don't even know what terms to use now) friend's are wrong to not find blacking up offensive are being racist? They are grouping them with all other people of the same skin colour and saying they should believe in the same things and behave in the same way? (FWIW, I don't think for one second they are racist or that they have even thought of what I've said above, just saying that it might be the same for other posters who perhaps have different views? It's so difficult to say exactly what you mean in a text conversation as you can't add in tones of voice, or inflections which can totally change the way a sentence can be perceived. Veering a bit OT but - Try saying the sentence: 'Why did he do that?' 5 times, each time putting the stress on a different word. It makes the sentence mean a different thing each time doesn't it!? Ok not a brilliant example, but I hope it works at least a bit.)
Apologies if I am missing the point (I often do) but that thought stuck me.
Again, I'll reiterate that I can see both sides of the argument, am kinda uncomfortable with 'blacking up' as in the OP but, probably because I am a theatre and history student (history of theatre mostly) I am very interested in this debate and am only trying to provoke discussion and see peoples' views.

bugger

my post makes no sense i am off to bed

Freud its never happened, infact quite the opposite, only once have we gone out in 'afros' (including my black mates) and we were joined on every kareoke bar singing along to every song we could - in no way were we ever seemed as being racist, and neither was my brother on his stag night!!!

Why would we???

Koalaface you say you are of mixed race. Can i please ask you a question based on my last post, (ie michael jackson costume and blacking up). Do you think in anyway i was being racist is saying i could not see the problem with the michael jackson costume and him blacking up. (Ok you said blacking up looked stupid - you are right it does) but if it was part of the costume and he was an admired black man do you feel offended by this. Was i being racist do you think. That is what i am being called for this.

i asked what if it did what would be your reply. you can no longer claim you do not know a little of the history of blacking up and why it is so offensive to many you just choose to not apply that to yourself and what you see as a bit of a laugh

i do not know one black or mixed race person who would think it was in the slightest bit amusing i know a few that would certainly not hold back on telling you how nasty, stupid and ignorant your were

music whats wrong with being proud of the colour of your skin. whatever colour it is. You and others have been bleating on about people saying black people are treated inferior. I say they are not and should be proud of their black skin. What is wrong with that.

Haha I can't be the "mixed race spokesperson" I can only speak for myself.

No I wouldn't think you are racist for defending someone who wants to dress up like Michael Jackson. I went to a fancy dress party as Mulan once. I would have been horrified to offend any Chinese people.

But during the course of the discussion you did seem adamant that what was described as a pretty offensive costume was okay and quite funny and people shouldn't take it too seriously. So I reckon thats why people think you're racist.

Because you are extremely patronising. It isn't for the likes of you to be telling black people to be oroyd of their skin.

Get a grip.

Black people have never been treated inferior by me or anyone i know. I dont give a shite what colour someones skin is. as long as they are a nice person thats all i care about. too much is being made of this. Whatever i say you are bashing me. I say 'black people are proud of their black skin' and that is wrong.

Proud*

It's also because posters have come across mylovelyboy's horrible views on other threads, koala.

music and it isnt for you to tell people they are racist when they are clearly not. Oroyd is not a word by the way.

You're being weird.

I'm gone

FWIW I take offence at 'cringiest of Am Dram' comment, and would like it known that it was professional standard award winning amateur theatre where I wore kabuki makeup and had slanted eyes, (admitey not overdone, just using eyeliner to subtly make eyes look a bit more oval) and that it was very recently that I did the last one! However, saying that, the makeup was subtle and that this play is performed in loads of places with (at least the title character and the lead contralto) usually in full or part kabuki makeup if not the rest of the cast. I've never known of anyone who finds it offensive before, including a Japaneese theatre group who did a production of it and said how much they loved the costumes and makeup of the english versions they'd seen! (Note I stated I don't know of anyone who was offended, not that noone was as they could well have been and not made their views known, I am aware of that.)

Has anybody come up with examples of their gloriously multi-coloured friends "whiting up" for a costume? Specifically, your fabulous selections of pals, Mylovely and Taff?

If not, why not??

Hang on a sec, Drama, kabuki makeup is a thing in itself. You so wouldn't need to 'slant' your eyes wearing it.

Drama I asked the question earlier if it would be acceptable to dress in Japanese costume, wearing a lovely dress, beautiful black wig and eyeliner to make eyes slanted. (they were my words). I was accused of being racist in thinking this outfit acceptable as dress up assemble

(Alsosaid theatre company has got in actors (or at least tried to) for shows that require a certain 'race' of actor, but that's not always possible. Should we then never put on shows like 'Showboat' or would it be ok for a totally white as white person to be playing the part of a slave in that without any added tan? Again, no strong views either way, I'm just interested in debate. Our theatre company do try to put on shows that we have the appropriate people for, but also was it 'Agist' of me to put wrinkles all over my face to make me look like a 70 year old in my last show when the part needed it even though I got it fair and square through auditions when older people also auditioned or should they have advertised for more older people for the role?)
Sorry if I'm messing things up, I'm here for debate only, if I'm not helping then one 'shut up' from each side or several from different people on one and I will 'zip it' no offence taken.

DramaQueen there have been a few good points raised on this thread I think, but de-railed quite a bit by a lot of shoutyness about being racist purely on the basis of 'blacking up'.

I am of the opinion that defining a group with stereotypes (colour/sexuality etc) is not acceptable, but dressing up to depict a particular individual (done in good taste) is not offensive.

Re actors, there are a huge variety of actors across the whole race/gender spectrum so no longer an issue to have to cast against type (female parts also used to be played by male actors way way back if I remember correctly?).

I think I understand your point about defining Taflee and Lovely's mixed race friends (by that I mean a mix of friends of different racial backgrounds) being defined as one group by the non-racist arguers - they were expected to act according to their colour and actually called out as racist themselves by a poster way upthread because they joined in with dressing up as the Jackson 5. Surely by making that generalisation, the poster argued against herself?

I abhor bullying in any form and will always call somebody up on it - I also agree with Lovely re standing up to bullies as you see it rather than being a "wallflower" about it all. In real life, if I witness unacceptable and bullying behaviour or discrimination I absolutely deal with it immediately - but I truly don't believe in the instance of this particular situation (OP) there was any racial connotations, just a group of people in fancy dress as a currently well known celebrity family.

(Hope that all makes sense!).

garlic but the outfit was a japaneese character. So why not slant the eyes. How is that offensive. Its not taking the piss. It is showing the character in question. stop being so offended by everything. Ive just farted. There................are you offended

Costume is clothes.
The skin of the person wearing it is the skin of an individual. It's just weird to treat that skin as another element of the costume.
Apart from anything else, it shows you see their physical characteristics as part of a 'costume'.

Also, to pretend you can't act a part unless you've adopted the relevant physical characteristics is bollocks. Look at Ali G.

mylovelyboy,who did I call racist?

Has anybody come up with examples of their gloriously multi-coloured friends "whiting up" for a costume?