To be utterly clueless as to how to handle dd8- talk me through how you would

[Retropear]

Dd8 can be difficult at home.She can be nasty and unreasonable to her brothers 10,rude and intolerant to all of us.She is also incredibly lazy and has a temper.She can be lovely,has a lovely qwerky personality and is amazingly kind and gentle with animals.

She is extremely unmaterialistic,not into sweets or gadgets.I obviously don't smack.She answers back to the death lately with eye rolling and hand flourishes. As a result little things generally turn into a big deal as I struggle to find ways to punish her that actually bother her.

Soooooo this morning after a hair brushing upset(I was apparently not being gentle enough,IMO I was and firmly told her so) which made us late she then threw her brothers book down the side of her bed as he was first at the sink for teeth brushing wtaf!Just why?

It took several repeat apologies to get one in the correct tone and then a load of belligerence. I then took her teddy off her so she could experience what it felt like.She screamed bloody murder and I ended up screaming back.She ended up losing a possible hot chocolate out for possible hard work and a sleepover because she doesn't give a shiny shit about her behaviour or the consequences.

I should have all the answers but I just don't.Twin boys were a doddle compared to this.Why the nastiness and time wasted on arguing,answering back etc?I have explained over and over that she makes little things 10 x worse.I have also explained that I won't let rudeness or spiteful acts go- she will be punished.

So talk me through it,where am I going wrong?How would you deal with her?

eye rolling to me would not be a big deal, I sometimes mimic them when they do dramatic eye rolls and slumps, so they see how silly it looks. Makes them laugh and snaps them out of the mood.

Or say" Careful your eyes don't roll out of your head," then ignore.

Retropear Sorry if I sounded a bit harsh.

Sometimes putting things forward opens-up a discussion.

I do think you are one of the good loving caring mums otherwise you would not look for answers.

I recommend The Incredible years www.amazon.co.uk/The-Incredible-Years-Carolyn-Webster-Stratton/dp/1892222043/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1383832915&sr=8-1&keywords=the+incredible+years

I am taking a 12 week parenting course at the moment due to some similar issues to the ones you describe.

The book is very American and it may seem way over the top but after 3 weeks of one-on-one time, playing together and praise the relationship between me and our 10 year old has improved more than I could possibly have imagined.

I know the hair thing isn't the biggest problem here but just to say I've had dd brushing her hair since she was 7 with detangling spray and a tangle teaser brush , she can do it easily now. I used to help her tie it back but she can do this too now.

With regard to the one to one time, I have just allowed dd to stay up half an hour later than the other dc's (she's the oldest). I make sure I spend this time with her and don't tidy up, work, do lunches etc. We just watch TV, but it is still time together just us. It's helped massively. Can your dd do this or is she the younger one?

It also goes to show, you don't need to do anything fancy or spend hours with just your dd to get a result. Just a little, every now and again

Retro, I didn't mean you show the boys you always intervene. I mean you show them you DON'T always intervene ie. there are situations they need to sort out between themselves. I would say name calling could be something they sort out amongst themselves. Actually destroying someone's stuff ie. a lego model, needs to be dealt with by you (in private).

The eye rolling. I would have a good chat with her about it. That for you it means she's not respecting you. Do you do things which make her feel not respected? You can make it mutual. Whatever she says (shouting, not listening to her, whatever) you say you will try not to do it and ask her not do it as well. If she does do it, point it out, without punishment. If this is still going on then another chat, and say you will need to start a punishment for this.

Only if this is something which really bothers you. If there is something else she does which you hate more, then start with that, but don't overwhelm her with too much.

I hate the eye rolling - it horrid isn't it. I've been on the receiving end of it a couple of times and I usually say something like 'please be polite to me. I'm being polite to you.' If its repeated I then send them to a different room.

Oooh yes, 1:1 time. I took ds1 (nearly 8) to McD's the other day, just me and him, had a nice time and when we came back dh said he was 'radiant' (hopefully it wasn't anything radioactive in the fish fingers!).

Thanks Merry great ideas all.

Kinnane no worries I'm a bit uber sensitive today.Burst into tears at the school office when letting them know she might be a bit wobbly- in front of one of the yummy mummie. I wanted to die- they gave me a tissue.

Tis funny how you can wake up full of the joys of spring and the day can descend into the day from hell in seconds.

Retropear, We have all been there, one way or another, including the tears. [Smile]

Well, I am sure we have all been there!

Retro, the last 2 weeks of term before half term were like this every day for me! Ds1 in particular was worrying me by becoming 'unlovable' and not eating much (he does this when stressed). The difficult thing is that when he needs love the most, he seems to make it even harder to love him.

We had a nice half term and had a lot of chats with my dh and a couple of threads on here, and it's got better from there.

I pick my battles and cuddle her loads. I think about whether its worth escalating things, most times it's not. The only things I will not stand for are nastiness towards her brother. Zero tolerance.

Since I've been doing this, just walking away or ignoring she will usually come to me within 5 minutes crying and saying how sorry she is. I always accept and explain gently what went wrong. Before I would stern and setting out clear boundaries in the middle of the ding dong in an "how dare you?!" Kind of way and it just never worked, just escalated it to really awful proportions with both of us ending up beside ourselves.

I was actually just thinking this morning how long it has been since we had one of these episodes and its been weeks, where before with my telling her off at the first sign of trouble they were happening ten times a day.

It's really hard to do when you first start. It goes against everything we are told about keeping our kids in line and how to bring them up nicely but this way works and she's lovely, sunny and happy because of it so no rows. And that's the result you want isn't it.

I have two DDs and after a lot of hair and attitude issues, I began making mine brush their own hair. If I'm honest, the smaller one suffered due to the resulting neglect and tangles but she learned within one week that she needs to do her hair or it gets BAD.

They do their own now...aged almost 6 and 9. The 9 year old also washes her hair. I told the smallest that she either let me do it without yelling or running away or we'd cut it in a short bob. She didn't want the cut so managed.

I think your punishments are too harsh by the way...if mine screech I send them in to school with messy hair! Their problem....they never yell now as they prefer their hair well kept. Obviously if they want plaits or something, then I do it....they actually ask me for nice hairdos now.

That is reassuring.I do feel bad though,I really hollered at her, practically frothed.

The "unloveable" thing I get.Obviously I utterly adore her and love her to absolute bits but when she does things like this I hit a wall and don't understand it or like it in her.

Best go and pick her up.

Oh and get a Tangle Tamer hair brush. It has reduced hair brushing tantrums to zero. I have five as I am terrified to lose them .

You've cried and you've come here to help/advice. That makes you a good mum who loves her DCs. Any cock ups along the way are par of the course.

Don't be hard on yourself. IME the ones with the great outside look as if life is perfect are the ones trying to hide greater difficulties.

Did you have any trouble bonding with her when she was a baby?

Also re the eye rolling what would you say and do if she just repeats it after being told not to?

tbh I would sigh and maybe gently tease her about it i know that sounds a bit harsh but it might defuse the situation or she may blow up, one o f mine it deffused the other it sort of blew up in my face

Sparkly sequins - I think your advice there was great.

I am going to try it.
I am one who steps in at the first sign of trouble and it does escalate, I think I'm going to try your way.

Thanks for this thread.

Sparkly
How would you handle this situation?

The other day dd did not want to go to school. I have 3 to get to school. The situation really escalated with me walking along the road carrying her whilst she screamed. I did ask at home why she didn't want to go and just said she wanted to be at home. I did explain that she needed to go and the reasons but she was set by then. it was hideous. She would have loved me to walk away!

eye rolling to me would not be a big deal, I sometimes mimic them when they do dramatic eye rolls and slumps, so they see how silly it looks. Makes them laugh and snaps them out of the mood

I xposted with this that is what i did and do

That is reassuring.I do feel bad though,I really hollered at her, practically frothed.

we all have frothed at some point i used to froth so much sometimes it looked like i had rabies please dont beat yourself up about this you wlli get there with it wont be like this for ever

I would have not got into it at home. Just an "I do understand how you feel, I should think you're feeling a bit rubbish today aren't you? let's have a talk about it later ok?" No explanations or reasoning, then a big hug, then I might have asked her about something I know she's really into at the moment, like her swimming or a movie we've just watched and I would have kept asking her stuff while I got the others ready. Mine hates school mornings too and I do this. She's usually had a good day and forgotten it all till the next morning. Some mornings it won't work though and I will have one like you describe, but it happens a lot less than it used to.

Thanks sparkly.